Some Questions before Going into the Studio - Page 2

Mark Perna · #21 03-21-2008, 10:51 PM

I've never had much of a problem with adding a little pickup. On my last bunch of recordings, when I and the engineer mixed, the pickup added a little detail. It definitely didn't make the bass sound like a P-bass though. In fact, it wasn't very noticeable at all until I pulled it out of the mix and then I missed it.

But, if I didn't have as much control as I did on those recordings, I'd probably take the pickup off too.

My only advice is get a good pair of full ear headphones and bring them to the studio with you. Most studios (even good ones) have lousy or busted up headphones. Not being able to hear yourself well is one of the most frustrating things that can happen in the studio. A good set of headphones will last you years and make a BIG difference in your performance.

mark

Marc Piane · #22 03-22-2008, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calivox

I've never had much of a problem with adding a little pickup. On my last bunch of recordings, when I and the engineer mixed, the pickup added a little detail. It definitely didn't make the bass sound like a P-bass though. In fact, it wasn't very noticeable at all until I pulled it out of the mix and then I missed it.

But, if I didn't have as much control as I did on those recordings, I'd probably take the pickup off too.

My only advice is get a good pair of full ear headphones and bring them to the studio with you. Most studios (even good ones) have lousy or busted up headphones. Not being able to hear yourself well is one of the most frustrating things that can happen in the studio. A good set of headphones will last you years and make a BIG difference in your performance.

mark

+1 on the headphones. I picked up a pair with a mono/stereo switch on 'em. Sometime the balance things they do can be distracting.

Also, regarding the pickup.

This is his project. He has control. In these cases I just tell the engineer what I want. I don't bother taking the pickup of my bass. I'm paying the studio so I don't mind being firm about what I want.

If it is not my project I just keep my mouth shut and let the engineer do whatever. I'll pull the leader aside and let them know that I'd like them to err on the side of mic only but in reality I'm not paying the studio bill so I have very little say.

This goes back to my original philosophy of sideman work. Do whatever the leader wants. All the stuff we talk about (amp or not, stage volume, pickup in the studio, etc) goes out the window when someone is paying you for your services. I have known guys that have lost gigs because they were overly righteous about stuff. There are very few players in this world that is so special that they can act like this.

damonsmith · #23 03-22-2008, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fingers

+1 on the headphones. I picked up a pair with a mono/stereo switch on 'em. Sometime the balance things they do can be distracting.

Also, regarding the pickup.

This is his project. He has control. In these cases I just tell the engineer what I want. I don't bother taking the pickup of my bass. I'm paying the studio so I don't mind being firm about what I want.

If it is not my project I just keep my mouth shut and let the engineer do whatever. I'll pull the leader aside and let them know that I'd like them to err on the side of mic only but in reality I'm not paying the studio bill so I have very little say.

This goes back to my original philosophy of sideman work. Do whatever the leader wants. All the stuff we talk about (amp or not, stage volume, pickup in the studio, etc) goes out the window when someone is paying you for your services. I have known guys that have lost gigs because they were overly righteous about stuff. There are very few players in this world that is so special that they can act like this.

There are very few leaders who want the bass to sound like sh**. More often than not they don't know what it takes to get a good sound, and more often than not they are paying us to know what it takes to make sure the bass sounds right.
You are just as likely to loose a gig for letting a lazy engineer hijack the bass sound and ruin the recording. Not only that, if it is a recording people will hear, you can loose plenty of work by having it get around as a representation of your sound - if it is not right.
So unless you know for sure the engineer can be trusted without question, or the leader specifically asks for twanky, '70s amplified sound (I actually play in a project where we go for that!), follow the advice to just take it off the bass.

thesneakyjesus · #24 03-27-2008, 09:33 PM

hey man.

Best advice I can give you is to do it all live in the same room. All great jazz records I've ever heard are made like this. period.

The isolation thing is cool for all other typers of music, but for the improvisational atmosphere of the music we make as jazz musicians is what matters.

If you listen to D'Angelo's VooDoo, you can get an idea of what really modern neo-soul music sounds like played with the same sort of attitude that jazz music has. The fidelity is high, all the gear was great, the players were great, and all the music was made in one room live. It's unbeatable

If you can, don't use an amp at all. Just go in there and rip. Set the lights low. Don't make the studio a place that is unfomfortable.

Should be cool man.

And honestly, no one wants to hear this.. but if you made the recording and were just selling the discs for like $3 and made less than 500 copies, you can get away VERY eaisly with not getting liscences for the tunes.

If you take it up to where you're getting it done up 1000 plus copies and intend on selling the discs for $10 a pop and having them packaged professionaly and intend on gigging out with them and stuff, then get it done for sure.

I'm just saying... you wouldn't be the first person to sell tunes that were unliscensed.

Kevin Hsieh · #25 03-27-2008, 10:32 PM

going in on saturday

thanks for all the help
it's been priceless.

i'm very excited for this.
will post the results on TB sometime soon!

Kevin Hsieh · #26 03-30-2008, 11:34 AM

Got back from the studio yesterday. Michael Brorby was very nice and helpful throughout the session. It was a very pleasant experience in the studio (probably helped by the fact that I was very comfortable working with my bandmates) We got the tracks down for a short demo and some extra ones that we will use for an album. and we're going to go back in in the next couple weeks to flush everything out and maybe edit some tracks.

Thanks for all the advice. once we get a running band site together I'll let you guys have a listen

best

Kevin Hsieh · #27 04-10-2008, 12:37 AM

hey everyone

thanks for all your help

the songs are now up on our myspace (which is quite lacking in a band description and pictures, but the music is what matters!)

http://www.myspace.com/morningsidecollective

thanks

Greg Clinkingbeard · #28 04-10-2008, 08:03 AM

Good stuff Kevin! Whatever you did worked. It's fine playing.

**Chris Fitzgerald** · #29 04-10-2008, 09:24 AM

I listened to "Violet" all the way through. It's a good sounding group, and everybody is listening and being musical and supportive. The solos were both very good, and the rhythmic interaction during the "broken feel" part of the piano solo was very interesting.

The sound of the bass and piano are very nice. I don't know what the engineer was thinking, but I felt like the drummer was severely hampered by the snare being unnaturally low in the mix. When the brushwork (very nice brushwork, too) was going on, it was almost ambient instead of present, and once the tune kicked into a walk, the snare was so far under the cymbals that for a while I thought he just wasn't comping in any spaces. As always, YMMV.

nashvillebass · #30 04-10-2008, 04:30 PM

Great playing, Kevin! I can't believe you are only 18 years old and it was your first time in the studio. A whole lot better than my first time, which was nearly 25 years ago!

Keep up the great work. I'm sure we'll hear more about you in the future and best of luck to you and the Morningside Collective.

Yapser · #31 04-13-2008, 07:56 AM

Meh.

Mastered music is complete crap these days imho. Listen to all CD's that are sold these days. They're WAY too loud, there are no dynamics (soft/loud parts), there's no spacing between instruments and everything is just squished to hell.

Listen to RHCP's Californication. Yes. The crackling you hear is really there on your CD, it's not your badly compressed MP3. It's just unbearable. Mastering these days seems to be compressing the music to hell, not listening to the resulting sound..

Ofcourse not every mastering engineer ruins recordings, but Vlado Meller..

dar512 · #32 04-13-2008, 09:16 AM

There was a bit on "Sound Opinions" (the NPR music review show) about this very subject recently. I think it was the 04/08 show. They discussed it with a producer who was very matter of fact about it.

BlackLake · #33 04-13-2008, 09:19 AM

Mastering is essential.

The greatest name for a mastering studio I've heard so far is:

The Laquer Channel

Without it, you a nice piece of unfinished wood.

caillean · #34 05-21-2008, 02:48 AM

Sure was worth all the time!

Sounds good

555Soul · #35 07-21-2009, 03:31 PM

When my band recorded our first album we had the brilliant (not) idea of trying to record the rythym tracks all together at the same time. This would take 5 or 6 tries before they got a take they felt they could live with. We did 8 of the 9 tracks that way. It was frustrating, tiresome, and downright obnoxious to play the same song over and over again. I personally found it MUCH easier to play my bass part individually while listening to the click and any other parts of the song that were already done. I did do 2 takes but only because the engineer wanted some variety. It didn't take more than 10 minutes and ended up being the cleanest sounding song on the album.

peterpalmieri · #36 07-21-2009, 05:41 PM

I don't want to make you feel bad being that you're a new TB member and all. But this is the Talk Bass Double Bass section of the forum under Jazz technique, not to mention by looking at the post preceeding yours was 5/21/08.

I am unclear in that context if your post is speaking to the discussion specifically or not?

WELCOME!

Kevin Hsieh · #37 07-21-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 555Soul

When my band recorded our first album we had the brilliant (not) idea of trying to record the rythym tracks all together at the same time. This would take 5 or 6 tries before they got a take they felt they could live with. We did 8 of the 9 tracks that way. It was frustrating, tiresome, and downright obnoxious to play the same song over and over again. I personally found it MUCH easier to play my bass part individually while listening to the click and any other parts of the song that were already done. I did do 2 takes but only because the engineer wanted some variety. It didn't take more than 10 minutes and ended up being the cleanest sounding song on the album.

WOAH! thanks for digging up some old memories. this was about a year and half ago. so much has happened since then.