cello suites an octave down

[tbassist4]

I was just wondering if this is a widely practiced thing. I know that they are very difficult on the cello octave, but I just tried courante from the first suite in the bass's normal orchestral range and actually it sounded really nice. Am I adapting to these very quickly? or are they just plain easy in the lower octave? Also, what level would these pieces be seen at if performed on a bass in the bass's normal register? I ask this because when played on a cello, everything is in first position with a slight amount of shifting (just as when played on the bass in the normal orchestral range), and these pieces are seen as things to work on for one's whole life. I will be entering college in the fall, and I am learning these quite well. Are they of high enough caliber in the lower octave to add to my audtions and work on through college? Or would I just be better off playing them on the original octave? Thanks in advance!

[billyfalconer]

You can tinker with transposing these to various keys & registers the rest of your life. E. Meyer shifted them a bit in his album: "Meyer transposes the D Minor and G Major suites up one whole tone from the original cello keys, while taking the C Minor work one half step down to B Minor" (from http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/...p?album_id=458.)

[Reuben]

It depends on your intention. If your goal is to perform them, they can get a bit dull and ponderous down the octave. But they still make great practice down low and are great music, so if it's for fun and education who cares? Enjoy.

[Anonymous75966]

There's an old Peters edition that's written down the octave - not that anyone would need it to read down - so there's definitely precedent for playing down there. Ditto what Reuben said - the suites are such good material that you can morph them anywhere on the bass and learn something out of it.

For an audition, though, I wouldn't play down the octave - just because you don't have the lowest notes and that does kind of kill the flow IMHO. There's a really good transcription by Robert Rohe (available from Lemur, I think) that was written to sort of approximate the difficulty level of the suites on the cello: most of it's below thumb position. G major is in D, D minor is in G, C major is in G, I forget the rest. More challenging without being crazy hard, check it out.

[jdapodaca]

Originally Posted by billyfalconer

You can tinker with transposing these to various keys & registers the rest of your life. E. Meyer shifted them a bit in his album: "Meyer transposes the D Minor and G Major suites up one whole tone from the original cello keys, while taking the C Minor work one half step down to B Minor" (from http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/...p?album_id=458.)

With solo strings, these are played in the original keys. Why would you play the first suite in A major? It sounds A, but it's being played in G. The second is in D minor, also, sounding in E minor. The "B Minor," was played in A minor.

[damonsmith]

It is harder in terms of dexterity an octave down, harder to keep in tune an octave up.
I like taking certain phrases in all 3 octaves. I am never going to play them in public, I just use them for technique and musical study. It is not interesting to perform them unless you can really find something to say with them like Edgar Meyer did.
They are a great use of practice time.

[Simandl Fan]

Ed Barker gave a recital here in Boston a few years ago, and he programmed the first three suites; all the repeats, DCs,etc- with an intermission between two and three. I disagree that they may not be interesting when publicly performed. Of course, few of us play as well as Ed. Besides, at any bass recital, there will be a lot of bass players in the audience.

I like the Sterling edition (Peters). I just think the bass sounds best in that range. But that's the beauty of our instrument - there are so many options available for the suites. You can play them how you like (and didn't Brahm's father tell a conductor "don't tell me how to play my bass"?)

[Fred W]

I have been working on the 3rd suite in C, down the octave. I'm close to performance level on the Bouree, still working on Courant and Gigue. I think they sound fine an octave down on the bass. There's not much below low E in these pieces. I will probably never perform them in public but they are already popping up in my solos. And they never fail to inspire.

[damonsmith]

Originally Posted by Simandl Fan

I disagree that they may not be interesting when publicly performed. Of course, few of us play as well as Ed. Besides, at any bass recital, there will be a lot of bass players in the audience.

I think it would be nice to hear Ed play them, Bradetich sounds amazing, too. I said it is only interesting if you can come up with something to say with them.
Regardless, practicing them is something will make most people a better musician, no matter what instrument they play.

[billyfalconer]

Originally Posted by jdapodaca

With solo strings, these are played in the original keys.

By whom? When? Only two of the three E. Meyer suites could be, unless he tuned his solo strings down a pitch for #5. The #1 and #2 could have been, but the #5 sounds in b minor, and its original key is c minor.

Originally Posted by jdapodaca

Why would you play the first suite in A major?

I don't know that I would.

Originally Posted by jdapodaca

The "B Minor," was played in A minor.

How can it be "played in the original key" of c minor if it was "played in A minor"?

[jdapodaca]

He plays the first and second suites in the original keys, but with solo strings on.

So the first suite is played in G major, but it sounds in A major. The second suite is played in D minor, but sounds in E minor. The Fifth suite is transposed to A minor, but sounds B minor.

I dont know if this was unclear in my first post.

[cassidyholden]

Bass-ically, do whatever you can with the material. Remember, it's not written specifically for your instrument. I work on the suites at home, and alternate playing them in different transpositions as much as my brain can tolerate Also, I'm coming from a jazz perspective, so I play them all in jazz pizz as well as bow. I feel the bowings are also subject to interpretation (I have a cello edition), so make do when in different keys or octaves. It's a bass, not a cello.

Does that match up with other people's experience?


-cassidy

[Simandl Fan]

We have to remember that J.S. Bach (or Anna Magdalena) only wrote the notes, not bowings or dynamics or anything else. Whatever book you are using has three hundred years of interpretation layered onto it. Make your own! That is, be honest to the original, but this music was not written for the bass. Put it in another key; take it up an octave or whatever; or play it at pitch; make it interesting for your audience. Damonsmith is right- it's AWESOME material to practice every day, even if you never publicly perform it.
(just one bassist's humble opinion)

[mcnaire2004]

I've seen the original Anna Magdalena cello suites un-edited. There are bowings. Though it can get tricky to figure out when they stop.