BASS PLAYER Mag -No Fill on 8

CelinderMotoMan · #1 08-01-2008, 09:09 PM

Anyone remember reading the commentary about not playing fills at the end of every 8 bars? Who wrote it and what issue was it in? I have a drummer that I need to show it to.

Kitsapbass · #2 08-02-2008, 12:29 PM

It was Brad Hauser (or is it Houser) - he was in Critter's Buggin and the New Bohemians...I have the issue around somewhere....

Coward Of Reali · #3 08-02-2008, 05:22 PM

Good advice, i was just thinking the same thing last night when I was jamming

Audiophage · #4 08-02-2008, 09:32 PM

Anyone ever not play anything in a space where a fill would usually go? I mean, not even the bassline, just drop out for however many beats until you come in on the next measure. Scares the mierda out of some musicians.

bassrique · #5 08-03-2008, 08:15 AM

Space is the place.

deepbluesuk · #6 08-03-2008, 12:58 PM

PM'd you CelinderMotoMan

DeRoy · #7 08-03-2008, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Audiophage

Anyone ever not play anything in a space where a fill would usually go? I mean, not even the bassline, just drop out for however many beats until you come in on the next measure. Scares the mierda out of some musicians.

Oh yeah. It is often more effective than playing a cool fill! That kind of song influence is what being a bass player is all about.

masmasbasso · #8 08-03-2008, 01:18 PM

This is the original unedited article from Brad's MySpace.

Quote:

and note to self............(especially me)

as some of you may know, i have been a bass player for a long-ass time.........(too long, considering how many clams & extraneous bs i'm still blowing.....).
that having been said, i've been noticing for a long time some destructive musical tendencies among bassists and drummers..............
GRATUITOUS FILL PLAYING
that phrase alone pretty much sums up the entire matter, but let us dive a little deeper and more courageously into it..............
by definition, the word "fill" is, well, just that. filler.......not "meat" or substance.
filler.......taking up space, with no substance (feeling a little uncomfortable?)
we (almost all do it).
in particular, during funk grooves, this tendency becomes especially acute.
have you noticed that most of us have a tendency to play a fill every 4th bar during funk grooves? we all have a tendency to do it.................
from my exposure to african music,( soukous, in my experience) the bass relentlessly repeats the same figure over & over.......while some of you may think this is boring ( i did at first) what actually happens is that a trance.... energy field..... begins to build....this can and will produce an amazing feeling in the audience/dancers.....there's nothing like it.
in these situations playing a fill will Destroy the trance field and make you the drummer/bassist sound like JACKASS ..1......and the bandleader will start cursing at you......in french.....it also will piss of the dancers......you're SO not getting laid at that point.......
to instant remedy this, i propose the the quick fix of.......

NO FILLS 16

RESIST the evil temptation to put that fill in every 16 beats...(usually on beat 2 of every 4th bar)........
drummers.............please avoid the dreaded groove-stopper fill and the cymbal crash on beat 1 of the next bar..........it's as if i'm walking along.......then RED LIGHT! STOP! wait for that fill to to finish, and start walking again........ that **** drives me nuts as a bassist
well, to illustrate (and out myself).....
a few days ago i was playing as a sub on a jazz-funk gig. big stage sound system, etc..........i noticed FILLS 16 happening, as they usually do.....i was doing it, too......like a
bunch of pathetic liitle orgasms every 4 bars, draining away the vitality of the groove......
i caught myself NO FILLS 16, BITCH! and FORCED myself to stick to my bassline........repeat .....repeat........repeat........build..........re peat........
lo and behold the band solidified.......became more focused & coherent .............WOW.......what a huge difference..........
i have noticed also that if i stick to my line & NO FILLS 16, when it comes time to take a..........(ouch) bass solo, i have more energy and ideas available to me (having not spent myself with all those pathetic liitle ejaculations)......and my fellow musicians seem to be
more willing to give support......strange, but it does seem to make more sense
SUGGESTIONS---------------------

ask yourself.....is this "fill" necessary?
is it CONTRIBUTING TO FORWARD MOTION? or is it a GROOVEKILLER?............
wait..........don't fill.................wait..............wait....... ............wait.................wait............. build..............wait...................build... .........BREATHE!...........keep those shoulders down and relaxed...........wait...................breathe.. ........................wait..........ok,now drive the band
into the next section of the song with a powerful melodic idea............not a fill.......

have fun with this...........strip away all that extraneous ******** and watch how your fellow musicians and audience members will think you are a genius.........and Miles Davis will be smiling as bright as the sun

RECAP-------------------

NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16.................had enough yet? NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16 NO FILLS 16.......................DAMMIT BITCH, NO FILLS 16................................
PUT AN END TO GROOVE STOPPERS.................forward motion, forward motion........ AREN'T YOU SICK OF STOP LIGHTS? do you like stop and go traffic?

whew.........i'm tired ;*)

THE IDEAL BASS PLAYER----------------------

weighs 2000 pounds
has the mind of Einstein
the agility and strength of Bruce Lee
the soul of Africa
the Heart of Mother Theresa
& the Funk of James Brown

Brad and I are involved in a project together were he plays sax and I play bass. I mentioned the bass player article and he said he was writing it to himself. He just caught himself doing it too much and it messed with the groove and the people dancing.

DRay521 · #9 08-03-2008, 01:26 PM

I agree with that to a point, but I think it depends on the situation and the music. I'm in a progressive jazz trio, where everybody's kind of feeding off of each other in the improv sections. If I don't ever do fills, I'm getting replaced with someone who can fill the space.

buckminster · #10 08-03-2008, 01:31 PM

I just experienced this with an Afrobeat band I was sitting in with. I am no Afrobeat expert, but I've got good ears and can groove. I refrained from fills during our gig, partly out of respect for the music and partly because I couldn't come up with any fills on the spot that would groove just as hard as the ostinatos I was playing. After the gig, the regular players in the band commented on my lack of fills, and that it was good thing, because their regular bass player plays alot busier and drops the groove every once in a while. And in Afrobeat dropping the groove is a very bad thing...Of course I did find some places where I could work in a few 16th notes

, but I never lost the driving feel of the tune.

masmasbasso · #11 08-03-2008, 01:33 PM

Brad is talking about the relentless groove types of music. Dance music. Not something like jazz that is conversational between players.

It's about committing, not getting bored and then throwing in lots of fills. Just dig in deep.

Lorenzini · #12 08-03-2008, 02:52 PM

I'd like to also post a complete polar opposite to this whole idea of bass playing, brought to you by Andrew Gouche himself. I think this style of groove it actually fits for Gouche to play this way, not to mention he is so respected that he can get away with this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTUJ6vV2VSo

I'm just putting it out there, because it'll make very interesting conversation.

buckminster · #13 08-03-2008, 03:00 PM

His fills are very musical (bluesy, soulful, whatever you want to call it) and fit with the tune. He's also accompanying the pianist and the drummer in a subtle way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorenzini

I'd like to also post a complete polar opposite to this whole idea of bass playing, brought to you by Andrew Gouche himself. I think this style of groove it actually fits for Gouche to play this way, not to mention he is so respected that he can get away with this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTUJ6vV2VSo

I'm just putting it out there, because it'll make very interesting conversation.

buckminster · #14 08-03-2008, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masmasbasso

Brad is talking about the relentless groove types of music. Dance music. Not something like jazz that is conversational between players.

It's about committing, not getting bored and then throwing in lots of fills. Just dig in deep.

That's exactly what I'm talking about. If you're getting bored with what you are playing, then you're not thinking about the music in the moment. Focus on really locking your part with another player, focus on your tone, focus on your volume, listen to the rest of the band...Of course this approach applies to all kinds of music, but it's especially important when playing simple parts.

svtb15 · #15 08-03-2008, 03:25 PM

that may be one of the best articles that i have ever read on TB. I found myself guilty of this on my gig today... Thank you John.

Quote:

Originally Posted by masmasbasso

This is the original unedited article from Brad's MySpace.

Brad and I are involved in a project together were he plays sax and I play bass. I mentioned the bass player article and he said he was writing it to himself. He just caught himself doing it too much and it messed with the groove and the people dancing.