Does Jeff Beck Count as Jazz/Fusion?

Scalestein · #1 04-05-2007, 08:11 AM

I plan on transcribing a tune off of Blow by Blow this weekend (since it's a long one) and just out of curiosity, would you consider this album a jazz album or at least a jazz fusion album or would you consider it more of a rock album with fancy playing?

burk48237 · #2 04-05-2007, 08:40 AM

It certainly qualified as Jazz Fusion when compared to some of the other fusion stuff (solo Stanley Clarke comes to mind). Ironically almost every interview I've read with Jeff he seems almost embarrassed by those albums. I personally think it's some of the best guitar work ever put to vinyl in any era. Remember a lot of the cats that played with him (Jan Hammer, Max Middleton) were considered to be "Jazz Cats". Hammer of course played with Mahivishnu Orchestra and Elvin Jones amongst others. On Wired Jeff even covers a Jazz standard (Goodbye Porkpie Hat). So I would say YES!

Scalestein · #3 04-05-2007, 09:41 AM

Cool, I forgot that he covers Goodbye Porkpie hat.

Embarrassed by those albums? Does he say which albums he is most proud of? I certainly liked his Yardbirds stuff and Truth but I would pick Wired and Blow by Blow over something like Guitar Shop any day.

markjazzbassist · #4 04-05-2007, 10:49 AM

yes i would consider those jazz/fusion. those are my favorite albums of his. all his stuff after IMO has been garbage. i can't believe he would be embarrassed of his "best" work.

i own all of them. wired, blow by blow, there and back, and live with jan hammer band.

side note: jan hammer is one heck of a keys and synth player. the way he wails on those moogs for solos and stuff is incredible.

lug · #5 04-05-2007, 11:07 AM

Wired and Blow by Blow DEFINED fusion.

Alan Vorse · #6 04-05-2007, 12:02 PM

While Beck's harmonic vocabulary is largely from the Blues, he did have Jan Hammer and Narada Michael Walden with him. That's 2/5ths of the Mahavishnu Orchestra (sort of). I say yes.

watspan · #7 04-05-2007, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lug

Wired and Blow by Blow DEFINED fusion.

+1 Blow by blow back in the day was the bomb! what a funky album--I loved the clavinet by max middleton on "you know what I mean"

jerry · #8 04-05-2007, 05:38 PM

I loved drummer Richard Bailey's playing on Blow By Blow, he was only 18 when he recorded that album.

bikeplate · #9 04-05-2007, 05:44 PM

HI

Hell yea. Love those records

Rob

Kevinlane · #10 04-10-2007, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lug

Wired and Blow by Blow DEFINED fusion.

+1

Word!

jmarcus2 · #11 04-10-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikeplate

HI

Hell yea. Love those records

Rob

Ah, it seems we are a ever decreasing group that knew and loved fusion at its best...

Modulrob · #12 04-10-2007, 10:06 PM

yeah, you can call it jazz fusion, or just about anything! Blow by Blow is one of my favorite albums ever. I scored 2nd row orchestra pit seats at his tour last year, and was flat out amazed watching his playing technique (picks with his thumb, his palm *always* on the whammy bar using it in very interesting ways). Seeing "Cause We've Ended as Lovers" at such close range was f'ing unforgettable, chills galore.

jerry · #13 04-11-2007, 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modulrob

yeah, you can call it jazz fusion, or just about anything! Blow by Blow is one of my favorite albums ever. I scored 2nd row orchestra pit seats at his tour last year, and was flat out amazed watching his playing technique (picks with his thumb, his palm *always* on the whammy bar using it in very interesting ways). Seeing "Cause We've Ended as Lovers" at such close range was f'ing unforgettable, chills galore.

I just picked up a official boot from last years tour from Beck's web-site, it has Pino and Colaiuta on it......yup, it's fusion.

It even has Cobham's classic 'Stratus' on it.

Basshole · #14 04-11-2007, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lug

Wired and Blow by Blow DEFINED fusion.

+1

Barkless Dog · #15 04-11-2007, 09:22 AM

Miles Invented it with Bitches Brew and Jeff Beck popularized it for the masses/rock crowd

about BB

Quote:

Some jazz fans and musicians felt the album was crossing the limits, or was not jazz at all. One critic writes that "Davis drew a line in the sand that some jazz fans have never crossed, or even forgiven Davis for drawing." [1]
On the other hand, many fans, critics, and musicians see the records as an important, vital release. In a 1997 interview, drummer Bobby Previte sums up his feelings about Bitches Brew thusly: "Well, it was groundbreaking, for one. How much groundbreaking music do you hear now? It was music that you had that feeling you never heard quite before. It came from another place. How much music do you hear now like that?" [2]

nysbob · #16 04-11-2007, 10:39 AM

He's always been a tough one to pigeonhole. He's damn good, though.

zombywoof5050 · #17 04-11-2007, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modulrob

..his palm *always* on the whammy bar using it in very interesting ways).

Unless of course he's playing his Tele (or Esquire or whatever it is).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modulrob

Seeing "Cause We've Ended as Lovers" at such close range was f'ing unforgettable, chills galore.

Here's a great version of it, and he is playing said guitar mentioned above:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsfL6ATX1i4
You know, that song is dedicated to Roy Buchanan (who played a Tele as well), so I really dig seeing this version of it!

Modulrob · #18 04-11-2007, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zombywoof5050

Unless of course he's playing his Tele (or Esquire or whatever it is).
Here's a great version of it, and he is playing said guitar mentioned above:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsfL6ATX1i4
You know, that song is dedicated to Roy Buchanan (who played a Tele as well), so I really dig seeing this version of it!

thanks for the post, but I'm now at a loss for words! This video was way uninspiring compared to what I witnessed, he seemed to be just going through motions on that one. Maybe it was the intimacy of an orchestra hall, or the rejuvenation of jamming with younger bandmates (all in their early 20's I'd guess) Good lord, he better have filmed some of those concerts for a DVD.

zombywoof5050 · #19 04-12-2007, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modulrob

This video was way uninspiring compared to what I witnessed, he seemed to be just going through motions on that one. Maybe it was the intimacy of an orchestra hall, or the rejuvenation of jamming with younger bandmates (all in their early 20's I'd guess) Good lord, he better have filmed some of those concerts for a DVD.

I have to disagree about the merits of his performance on this video.

While I can agree (somewhat) that the regular opening/closing parts to this particular version could maybe be considered 'run of the mill' and nothing particularly special (it seems that maybe he even goofed the arrangement a little after the solo, not sure), but his solo on this one is just great. Yes, his solo on this one really hits me just right!

I've seen Jeff play live at least five times now (was 2nd row center for the '99 tour), and it's always better when you're there.

Giraffe · #20 04-12-2007, 10:56 AM

(All my personal opinions, no value judgements intended!)

At the time he recorded those albums, I thought he was well in the mix of jazz-fusion. The elements were all there, and the compositions and arrangements of tunes like Stratus and Pork Pie Hat were what fusion was all about. That was really exciting music at the time, especially when played loud! It was all over FM radio, which was a big deal at the time.

Those Jeff Beck albums hold up much better than most similiar albums from that period. I think they sound a lot more sincere than contemporary Return To Forever albums, for example, which sound more stiff and contrived to me (in spite of the presence of legit jazz killers like Chick and Stanley).

JB has been a reference point for me since his stint in the Yardbirds, so take my comments with a pound of salt!