Hadrien Feraud, his Phrasing and Melodic Sensibilites

[GrindYourMind]

So I've been on a gigantic Feraud binge and no matter how I try, I cannot seem to emulate his phrasing and general sound. The really fast runs I can do (technique wise) but they never end up sounding like HIS very fast runs. I've come to conclude that the use of Symmetrical Diminished scales and all around chromaticism helps, but he straddles this line between almost completely atonal and beautiful melodicism that is well...stupefying.
I'm not trying to clone the guy, I just want to be able to evoke his style at will and I've found it much harder than other bassists. I've been practicing some octatonic stuff with a metronome, trying to bring up to his (blinding) tempo and attempting to transcribe phrases of his from Youtube. Anyone have any other tips?

[narud]

funny, i just got through emailing a buddy a transcription im working on of a namm solo of him playing an f clef. i didnt write out the lick right before because its a pretty easy descending lydian dominant thing, but this one is a bear. im like halfway through the line.

[ashtray9]

Yikes, I'm still having trouble with jaco. Good luck!

[narud]

Originally Posted by GrindYourMind

So I've been on a gigantic Feraud binge and no matter how I try, I cannot seem to emulate his phrasing and general sound. The really fast runs I can do (technique wise) but they never end up sounding like HIS very fast runs. I've come to conclude that the use of Symmetrical Diminished scales and all around chromaticism helps, but he straddles this line between almost completely atonal and beautiful melodicism that is well...stupefying.
I'm not trying to clone the guy, I just want to be able to evoke his style at will and I've found it much harder than other bassists. I've been practicing some octatonic stuff with a metronome, trying to bring up to his (blinding) tempo and attempting to transcribe phrases of his from Youtube. Anyone have any other tips?

ill add this. while ive never heard you play, theres nothing wrong with your fast funs sounding like yours rather than his. im only learning this stuff as an exercise in dexterity. find the vocab that you like to use. he didnt even sound that out a few years ago. now its bass gymnastics with allan holdsworth sounding lines

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Originally Posted by narud

funny, i just got through emailing a buddy a transcription im working on of a namm solo of him playing an f clef. i didnt write out the lick right before because its a pretty easy descending lydian dominant thing, but this one is a bear. im like halfway through the line.

What tune is this from? I have his solo album along with the McLaughlin and Lagrene albums he's on, but don't recall anything called "Too Much Stretching."

[narud]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

What tune is this from? I have his solo album along with the McLaughlin and Lagrene albums he's on, but don't recall anything called "Too Much Stretching."

haha, i just needed to name it something in sibelius. i wasnt planning on posting it. just happened that this thread popped up the same day i was writing this out. its from a video of him playing a white f clef i saved off of youtube.

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Well email it to me then, darnnit- I want to hear it now

[narud]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

Well email it to me then, darnnit- I want to hear it now

it got taken down. its 18 megs though. ill up it on rapidshare in a bit and post a link.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by narud

. now its bass gymnastics with allan holdsworth sounding lines

That's unfortunately how I hear his playing. It might just be over my head (actually, I know it's probably even over my listening level, much less playing level!), but I sure don't hear a lot of 'music and phrasing' in his playing (LOT's of sixteenth notes!), especially on his CD (and to be clear, I LOVE Holdsworths playing, in small doses anyway). Lot's of chops though, and I agree, that would be a dexterity workout in a BIG way.

Amazing player though, just don't dig it at all. Kind of like Tommy Kennedy on steroids, which I never thought I would get to say about anyone

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Originally Posted by KJung

That's unfortunately how I hear his playing. It might just be over my head (actually, I know it's probably even over my listening level, much less playing level!), but I sure don't hear a lot of 'music and phrasing' in his playing (LOT's of sixteenth notes!), especially on his CD (and to be clear, I LOVE Holdsworths playing, in small doses anyway). Lot's of chops though, and I agree, that would be a dexterity workout in a BIG way.

Amazing player though, just don't dig it at all. Kind of like Tommy Kennedy on steroids, which I never thought I would get to say about anyone

If you want to hear him in a less "reaching" role, check out Bireli Lagrene's "Electric Side" album. The first tune "Hips" is currently one of those songs I keep playing over and over.

[VroomVroom]

LOL @ the Tom Kennedy reference. I agree, although I do hear some sparkles of magic in there. I suspect I'll grow to like the guy more and more over the years.

FWIW, here's what I do with cats like this...where I hear stuff I dig, even in small doses. I just listen, and sort of absorb by osmosis, if you will. That way I pick up what I "need" in terms of inspiration, and apply it to my own playing with my own perspective (for better or worse) right from the beginning. The first example that comes to mind is Oteil Burbridge. I listened to the ARU "In a Perfect World" recording hundreds of times, yet I never sat down and transcribed any specific lines. Looking back a few years later, I probably owe Oteil a sincere apology for robbing him blind.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

If you want to hear him in a less "reaching" role, check out Bireli Lagrene's "Electric Side" album. The first tune "Hips" is currently one of those songs I keep playing over and over.

Bought it, and no offense, hate it. I already deleted it from my iPod and gave the disc away. Something just not quite right IMO. Again, pure IMO, but that cut (if I'm remembering the right tune) sounded like Tower of Power with the flu or something.... kind of a 'metronomic, middle of the beat' approach to gooving that just lays there for me.

Again... I only am speaking here as a listener. I wish I could even THINK about playing with that kind of skill. I'm sure Hadrien will not lose any sleep over what I think of his playing.

PURE IMO on this

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Hey, it's cool- lots of people have disagreed with me in the past. As I always say, it's perfectly within your rights to be completely wrong

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

Hey, it's cool- lots of people have disagreed with me in the past. As I always say, it's perfectly within your rights to be completely wrong

Yeah, pure personal preference for stuff at this high of a level. It's not 'good or bad', but more if it says anything to you musically or 'emotionally', and that of course can vary a lot across listeners.

[JimmyM]

ALl I can tell you is don't say anything bad about his tone or he'll send you a nasty PM

[bassrique]

Originally Posted by narud

funny, i just got through emailing a buddy a transcription im working on of a namm solo of him playing an f clef. i didnt write out the lick right before because its a pretty easy descending lydian dominant thing, but this one is a bear. im like halfway through the line.

Thanks for the transcription. Got any more?

[narud]

Originally Posted by bassrique

Thanks for the transcription. Got any more?

not of solos. i usually dont write this stuff out, but it was so abstract, i knew if i didnt, i wouldnt remember it. ive got the rest of the lick transcribed and when i get some more time ill write it out and replace the attachment.

[narud]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

Well email it to me then, darnnit- I want to hear it now

heres the video. i was writing out the lick from 8 to 16 seconds.
http://rapidshare.com/files/21708979...at_NAMM_09.flv

[GrindYourMind]

Originally Posted by narud

ill add this. while ive never heard you play, theres nothing wrong with your fast funs sounding like yours rather than his. im only learning this stuff as an exercise in dexterity. find the vocab that you like to use. he didnt even sound that out a few years ago. now its bass gymnastics with allan holdsworth sounding lines

Again, not trying to clone the guy, I just find that emulation leads to incorporation which leads to one's own voice and I've found Feraud's sound harder to emulate than most of the thunderchop soloists out there.

Also gotta get my right hand ring finger up to snuff for the Garrisonesque bubbling lines. I go R-M-I while playing normally, Th Up, Th Down, I, M while playing double thumb and all of this leads to me leaving my poor ring finger out while I play closed palm.

Oh and his tone is always like a carrot caked wrapped in butter, deep fried, dredged in powdered sugar and run through a sweet Markbass rig. It's sweet.

edit - That run from 8-16 seconds is pretty loony.

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Originally Posted by narud

heres the video. i was writing out the lick from 8 to 16 seconds.
http://rapidshare.com/files/21708979...at_NAMM_09.flv

Thanks man