Jeff Berlin comments on his own interview

jonster · #1 11-14-2011, 07:49 AM

See Jeff's personal commentary on his recent interview with FBPO. All clear now? You be the judge!

Jeff Berlin interview

fourstringburn · #2 11-14-2011, 08:02 AM

Jeff Tells it like it is...what's the problem now?

Dr. Cheese · #3 11-14-2011, 09:15 AM

When it comes to music education, i agree with Jeff Berlin although I am a fairly ignorant player. If you want to make a living as a musician, you need a music education to maximize all of your possibilities. It is way too easy to focus on people like Pino Pallidino who don't read or folks like Jaco who basically taught themselves, and assume that it anybody can do it too. The fact is that those people are truly gifted much the same way a great athlete is gifted. Heck, Emmitt Smith was powercleaning 275 lbs. for reps when he was 14 or 15, simply because he was blessed with a powerful body that responded as soon as he went into a gym. Similarly, some people have big ears and pickup music very quickly with little or minimal training. Most of us just aren't that good, and Berlin's approach is best for us.

As for his "comments" about TB, so what? He's banned for life, there is no point in him dwelling on the issue.

bassbrad · #4 11-14-2011, 09:29 AM

I enjoyed the interview and also agree with Jeff on the necessity of music in music education. If you wanted to be a writer it would be important to know how to spell and write a sentence with correct syntax and structure, before trying to be creative. If you want to be a great basketball player you need the fundamentals- dribble, pass then shoot. It concerns me that such a great player has become a pariah for sticking to his guns on this important subject.

This week I have been listening to a live trio recording with Kazumi Watanabe, Bill Bruford and Jeff that is simply mind blowing.

Roscoe East · #5 11-14-2011, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bassbrad

This week I have been listening to a live trio recording with Kazumi Watanabe, Bill Bruford and Jeff that is simply mind blowing.

Thread drift: Kazumi's Splice Of Life album with Bruford and Berlin is some of the most infectious "fusion" I've ever heard. It's probably been 15 years since I last heard that album, but I don't think a week goes by that I don't find myself humming one of the melodies from that album.

pnut166 · #6 11-14-2011, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

As for his "comments" about TB, so what? He's banned for life, there is no point in him dwelling on the issue.

What ? Why ?

Dr. Cheese · #7 11-14-2011, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pnut166

What ? Why ?

He was in a big fight a while back, and he consistently broke a bunch of rules, and was banned. He returned, got in more big fights, broke more rules, and was banned again.

JAUQO III-X · #8 11-14-2011, 09:48 AM

Jeff Berlin is kool with me and always has been.

I think he upset kats who just don't care to at least take note to what he says.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

He was in a big fight a while back, and he consistently broke a bunch of rules, and was banned. He returned, got in more big fights, broke more rules, and was banned again.

Yes cheese but it's not like he was fighting himself. It takes two to tangle and in Jeff's case in was a pile on.

Dr. Cheese · #9 11-14-2011, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAUQO III-X

Jeff Berlin is kool with me and always has been.

I think he upset kats who just don't care to at least take note to what he says.

Yes cheese but it's not like he was fighting himself. It takes two to tangle and in Jeff's case in was a pile on.

Jauqo, I know a thing or two about getting in fights on TB and being banned.

People did egg Jeff on, but as I learned, fighting back tit for tat leaves you exposed to punishment, even you did not start the fight. Report thread is your friend, and even leaving TB alone for while makes sense sometimes.

**ShoeManiac** · #10 11-14-2011, 10:00 AM

I watched the video interview. And Jeff makes extremely valid points. Is he abrupt at times? Sure. But that's not the message. And the message is that there are plenty of amazing players who are self taught, or have little in the way of formal musical training. Are they able to function at a high level? Sure. Pino was mentioned, and so was Jaco. Paul McCartney doesn't read. And outside of the realm of bass, Dennis Chambers, one of the most phenomenal drummers on the planet, does not read.

The argument could absolutely be made that a formal musical eduction might only enhance the talents of musicians who are self taught and do not read music. Being completely conversant in the language of music would make it that much easier for them to convey their ideas to other musicians, and could even enhance their work. I think this is the essence of what Jeff was getting at. But perhaps because he doesn't suffer fools, Jeff becomes the focus of any kind of backlash and his argument falls by the wayside.

I watched the video and was left with the thought that if I had a greater understanding of theory and better sight-reading skills that I would be a better musician. Sometimes you need to seperate the message from the messenger.

Roy Vogt · #11 11-14-2011, 10:08 AM

I've never had a problem with Jeff, although I don't always subscribe note by note to his teaching methods and bring plenty of my own ideas to the party. I will say that observing his students (such as Denny Jiosa's bassist Jon Von Boehm here in Nashville) and spending a great deal of time with him in person at trade shows and his school, he is extremely passionate about music education and it shows in the excellence of his students and his own Art.
I took a lesson with Bill Dickens in Chicago a while back, and Bill has several pages of musical ideas and examples he got from Jeff that he practices daily. If someone I respect as much as Bill puts that much stock in Jeff's ideas and practices who am I to criticize the man?

odin70 · #12 11-14-2011, 10:17 AM

Its really not Jeff ideas, thats the problem.. but the way he promotes them. The perma ban from TB was imo well deserved. Having said that..it was lots of fun to follow the drama.

Tampabass · #13 11-14-2011, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roscoe East

Thread drift: Kazumi's Splice Of Life album with Bruford and Berlin is some of the most infectious "fusion" I've ever heard. It's probably been 15 years since I last heard that album, but I don't think a week goes by that I don't find myself humming one of the melodies from that album.

I remember that, and I remember exactly where I bought it - at the old Tower Records store on 4th and B'way in NYC

5StringBlues · #14 11-14-2011, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odin70

Its really not Jeff ideas, thats the problem.. but the way he promotes them.

Indeed.

I think alot of us,certainly myself,were getting alot of good info from Jeff while he was here.

But when he started refering to those who didn't toe his line perfecly as "hillbillies" he lost quite a few.

You can disagree with someone without resorting to name calling.In real life anyway,not so sure about on TB anymore.

basswave · #15 11-14-2011, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAUQO III-X

Jeff Berlin is kool with me and always has been.
.

+1

Some people get put off by His strong personality.
I meet Jeff a handful of times and I like him.

odin70 · #16 11-14-2011, 10:26 AM

Splice of life is good but Spice of life is my favourite

Roscoe East · #17 11-14-2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odin70

Splice of life is good but Spice of life is my favourite

Doh! Sorry for that; I used to work at a recording studio in Boston called Splice Of Life, so I confused the Kazumi Watanabe album with that studio name.

Yes, the Kazumi album is called Spice Of Life.

There's also a follow-up album (also featuring Berlin & Bruford, plus Peter Vetesse on keyboard) called, rather unimaginitively, Spice Of Life 2. iirc, it was nowhere near as good as the original.

butcher · #18 11-14-2011, 12:09 PM

I think that we should all endeavor to be better than we currently are, and certainly formal education is one vehicle that will get you there. Equally as important though is to put yourself in diverse musical situations - playing with people at different skill levels in different genres - finding an appreciation for aspects of each of them.

However, I'm not sure I completely agree with some of his rants. Clearly he is passionate about his craft which is admirable and certainly in order to play the way he plays, proper technical music education is required.

I have had formal music education on a different instrument and am always thoroughly impressed by people who can play incredibly complex material incredibly fast and incredibly clean (Vic Wooten, Billy Sheehan, Jeff Berlin, etc.). But... outside of that I don't really enjoy listening to much of that.

I do, however, find myself catching a little riff on random songs by "no name" musicians and thinking "wow! that was really interesting - ho did they come up with that??" and then being frustrated that you can't find any information about them.

brydo · #19 11-15-2011, 10:58 AM

I missed the article in Bass Player that Jeff refers to. What was his criticism towards music schools, exactly (that students aren't getting what they pay for)? I attended a university that stressed classical music with numerous courses in written and aural theory, composition, performance, etc. Assuming he's referring to not that such institution but rather the types of schools you hear about in Bass Player... what do they teach at those places if not at least the music fundamentals?

etoncrow · #20 11-15-2011, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odin70

Its really not Jeff ideas, thats the problem.. but the way he promotes them. The perma ban from TB was imo well deserved. Having said that..it was lots of fun to follow the drama.

I agree with every word of this. I also agree with a lot of Jeff's philosophy but if he could chill his arrogance a bit he could sell it much better.