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06-03-2008, 03:32 PM
| | | | Jeff Berlin fired by Frank Zappa
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Ok, can someone explain to me why Frank would ever fire such an amazing musician? What happened exactly? |
06-03-2008, 03:34 PM
|  | Moderator
Endorsing Artist: Levy's Leathers Moderator | | Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Toronto/Niagara Falls, Ontario | | | Just a hunch.
But, I'm guessing that their personalities clashed. |
06-03-2008, 03:35 PM
|  | Modulus, Ampeg, and Boss oh my! | | Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Birmingham, AL | | | Did anything Zappa ever did, including lyrics, ever make any sense?
Side note: The sound guy at Workplay Theater in Birmingham, AL....well he was on Zappa's crew for many, many, many years....it's great to hear that guy throw out random Zappa strories.
Also, I bet if you email Jeff Berlin, he will tell you why...seems to be an open kind of guy. |
06-03-2008, 03:36 PM
| | Banned | | Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: New York City | | Quote:
Originally Posted by holytiamat777  Ok, can someone explain to me why Frank would ever fire such an amazing musician? |
The story as I understand it -- and my understanding is based on two sources: Jeff's description of the situation at a clinic he gave at Berklee in 1980 or 81, and Frank's description of the situation from his autobiography The Real Frank Zappa Book -- is that Jeff, knowing that he's such an amazing musician, basically went to Frank and said "I'm an amazing musician, I should get paid more than the other not-so-amazing musicians in your band." Frank paid all his sidemen the same salary, and told Jeff to take a hike if he wanted more money.
And lest anyone say something like "Berlin is an arrogant egotistical blowhard for thinking he's so much better that he deserves more money"
...he got the idea from Vinnie Coliuta, who made the exact same request and was also fired by Frank. |
06-03-2008, 04:09 PM
|  | C'mon man! | | Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Hawaii | | It was Frank's band period. Remember he tanked a whole tour because the other members didn't like his choice in bassist, Frank stood by his choice. 
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06-03-2008, 04:21 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Paintsville, KY | | Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy_monkey Did anything Zappa ever did, including lyrics, ever make any sense?
Side note: The sound guy at Workplay Theater in Birmingham, AL....well he was on Zappa's crew for many, many, many years....it's great to hear that guy throw out random Zappa strories.
Also, I bet if you email Jeff Berlin, he will tell you why...seems to be an open kind of guy. | Just about everything Zappa did definitely made sense, so I'm not sure what you mean. There was indeed a method to his madness. |
06-03-2008, 04:27 PM
| | Registered User
Endorsing Artist: Spector Basses | | Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mountains of Colorado | | I would have paid Frank to let me deliver cheeseburgers during rehearsal. 
Uhhhh, Mr. Berlin, I do believe that's the gift horse's mouth....
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06-03-2008, 04:30 PM
|  | I fling carrots | | Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Make a left at the Taco Bell | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoover ..."Berlin is an arrogant egotistical blowhard for thinking he's so much better that he deserves more money"... | That's exactly what I'd imagine coming out of Berlin's mouth!
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06-03-2008, 04:43 PM
|  | Registered User | | Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oak Park, MI | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Wilson Just a hunch.
But, I'm guessing that their personalities clashed. | Jeff Berlin, Having a personality clash with someone? Nah, that only happens to opinionated people.
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06-03-2008, 04:52 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Earth | | Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry Remember he tanked a whole tour because the other members didn't like his choice in bassist, Frank stood by his choice. | Wasn't that when he had Thunes on bass? I never understood why the others hated him so much, he seemed like an excellent bassist.
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Originally Posted by danjl131 oh by the way here's some fancy english if thats what ur looking for: You are an inept maestro. Have a jocular day, you unpleasant drip. | |
06-03-2008, 04:58 PM
| | Banned | | Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Central Southern Massachusetts | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneckumhaw Wasn't that when he had Thunes on bass? I never understood why the others hated him so much, he seemed like an excellent bassist. | Excellent bassist, but I heard he was the hateful type. |
06-03-2008, 05:08 PM
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Seymour Duncan/Basslines SMB-5A Endorsing Artist | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Cuernavaca 1 hr S Mexico City | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneckumhaw Wasn't that when he had Thunes on bass? I never understood why the others hated him so much, he seemed like an excellent bassist. | I don't know Scott Thunes, but I DO know that being on tour with any band is a WHOLE LOT MORE than just good (or excellent, for that matter) musicianship . . .
That whole "group dynamics" BS, if ya' know what I mean . . .  |
06-03-2008, 05:09 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Earth | | Quote:
Originally Posted by deaf pea I don't know Scott Thunes, but I DO know that being on tour with any band is a WHOLE LOT MORE than just good (or excellent, for that matter) musicianship . . .
That whole "group dynamics" BS, if ya' know what I mean . . . | True enough.
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Originally Posted by danjl131 oh by the way here's some fancy english if thats what ur looking for: You are an inept maestro. Have a jocular day, you unpleasant drip. | |
06-03-2008, 05:46 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: I'm a dyno man, N.of Detoilet | | | Frank liked Scott, and he liked what Scott was doing and told him so. The rest of the band hated him, and he, them. That band basically self destructed as in, "The best band you never heard in your life". (From the Zappa book, as well). Yup, flaky artist types with attitudes sometimes get ugly quick. Old story.
Josh
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06-03-2008, 05:47 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: San Francisco | | | I heard that he was fired for playing the "Charlie Brown" theme.
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06-03-2008, 05:48 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Ventura County | | | very interesting I didn't know this.
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06-03-2008, 06:01 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: May 2007 Location: NZ | | Quote:
Originally Posted by holytiamat777 What happened exactly? | Frank: "I've written a new song. Here, Mr Berlin, I've written your bass part out in tab."
Jeff: "#*!!*##@!"
Frank: [points to door]
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06-03-2008, 06:12 PM
|  | You don't want to do that. Trust me. Forum Administrator | | Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: atlanta ga | | | frank zappa using tab made me lol irl.
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06-03-2008, 06:20 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: May 2007 Location: Maracaibo, Venezuela | | | Scott was intolerant to the extreme, he even said in an interview that if someone tried to take a conversation with him to a "moronic" level, he would turn around and go away.
Jeff Berlin deserved that "raise", he is a true genius, and as much as i love Frank and his music, if he couldnīt afford Jeff it was his loss.
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06-03-2008, 06:24 PM
|  | Drunk on power... and beer | | Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Co. Kerry, Ireland. | | Quote:
Originally Posted by prattguy Jeff Berlin deserved that "raise", he is a true genius, and as much as i love Frank and his music, if he couldnīt afford Jeff it was his loss. | Sounds more to me like he was giving each member equal pay, rights etc, which IMO was the right thing to do.
I'm sure he could have afforded it.
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