Monk Montgomery's Rig

[Sterrance]

Does anyone know what kind of amp Monk Montgomery played through when he used his P-Bass?

[bassbrad]

It was likely some Fender amp and head but that was way before the Bassman amps were introduced. Monk was also one of the early Jazz Bass players and in the 60's he used a VersaTone amp and later a Polytone.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by bassbrad

It was likely some Fender amp and head but that was way before the Bassman amps were introduced. Monk was also one of the early Jazz Bass players and in the 60's he used a VersaTone amp and later a Polytone.

Huh? The Bassman came out in 1951, shortly after the Precision. Piggyback Bassmans cane about ten years later, but I'm betting Monk's work with Lionel Hampton was a Bassman combo.

John

[JAUQO III-X]

I know you said P-bass.

[ugly_bassplayer]

As far as I know, he played mostly a jazz.....I could be wrong but.

[JAUQO III-X]

Originally Posted by ugly_bassplayer

As far as I know, he played mostly a jazz.....I could be wrong but.

He played a P bass early in his career. And he was the first bass player to play a electric bass starting in 1951(and it was a P bass).

[Sterrance]

Originally Posted by JAUQO III-X

I know you said P-bass.

I'm not good with amps; is that a Bassman combo?

[bassbrad]

Originally Posted by JTE

Huh? The Bassman came out in 1951, shortly after the Precision. Piggyback Bassmans cane about ten years later, but I'm betting Monk's work with Lionel Hampton was a Bassman combo.

John

Bassman amps may date back that early but were pretty rare, the 4x10 combo amps didn't come out until '54

Fender Bassman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

The amp pictured looks like a Standel to me.

[One Drop]

Originally Posted by JAUQO III-X

He played a P bass early in his career. And he was the first bass player to play a electric bass starting in 1951(and it was a P bass).

Actually he took over Roy Johnson's bass chair with Hamp in '52, having played DB only until he was asked to use the Precision that Hamp had bought and given to Johnson to play.

As to being the first, I don't even know if Johnson was the first either; probably more likely the first who was with a big well known band. Leo was traveling around in those days trying to put his bass in as many musicians hands as possible and there were probably a few others who bought them very early as well.

[JAUQO III-X]

Originally Posted by One Drop

Actually he took over Roy Johnson's bass chair with Hamp in '52, having played DB only until he was asked to use the Precision that Hamp had bought and given to Johnson to play.

As to being the first, I don't even know if Johnson was the first either; probably more likely the first who was with a big well known band. Leo was traveling around in those days trying to put his bass in as many musicians hands as possible and there were probably a few others who bought them very early as well.

Monk may not have been the first but it was always mentioned in pretty much every book or article that I have read that Monk was the first to use the electric bass and that Hampton brought the bass for Monk to play.

A friend of mine by the name of Eugene Howell( he was a studio bassist and guitarist for Chess records) had a 1953 P bass that he bought new in 53. He knew Monk and told me that Monk was the first and he said that because no one had heard of or seen any bass player with an electric bass that it was indeed a huge deal.

But like I said Monk for what ever reason was always being marketed as the first.

[PhiDeck]

Originally Posted by JAUQO III-X

Monk may not have been the first but it was always mentioned in pretty much every book or article that I have read that Monk was the first to use the electric bass and that Hampton brought the bass for Monk to play.

A friend of mine by the name of Eugene Howell( he was a studio bassist and guitarist for Chess records) had a 1953 P bass that he bought new in 53. He knew Monk and told me that Monk was the first and he said that because no one had heard of or seen any bass player with an electric bass that it was indeed a huge deal.

But like I said Monk for what ever reason was always being marketed as the first.

One Drop is correct. Roy Johnson played the Precision before Monk did. Monk is often wrongly credited because he was the first to play the Precision on a released recording (1953):
Lionel Hampton In Paris LP

Read this and the next page:
The Bass Book: A Complete ... - Tony Bacon, Barry Moorhouse - Google Books

[Sterrance]

Originally Posted by PhiDeck

One Drop is correct. Roy Johnson played the Precision before Monk did. Monk is often wrongly credited because he was the first to play the Precision on a released recording (1953):
Lionel Hampton In Paris LP

Read this and the next page:
The Bass Book: A Complete ... - Tony Bacon, Barry Moorhouse - Google Books

I've always thought that while he wasn't the first to use it, he was the first player of significance to the jazz scene.

The sound I'm going for is the one he gets on "Fingerpickin'" by Wes Montgomery. I feel he does a good job of getting a nice mellow sound that is good for straight-ahead jazz, without mimicking the upright bass.

[GM60466]

Versa-Tone

[MR PC]

Originally Posted by One Drop

Actually he took over Roy Johnson's bass chair with Hamp in '52, having played DB only until he was asked to use the Precision that Hamp had bought and given to Johnson to play.

As to being the first, I don't even know if Johnson was the first either; probably more likely the first who was with a big well known band. Leo was traveling around in those days trying to put his bass in as many musicians hands as possible and there were probably a few others who bought them very early as well.

yes and considering that most of Leo's buddies were playing Western Swing around SoCal, and that it's been written that he created the p-bass with that particular type of musician/music in mind

early on, i'd guess that Monk used whatever was available, maybe even a Pro Amp, with the single 15" with 2 6L6....that does make a nice tone, but the players were blowing drivers right and left back in the days (open back cab) his solo album (Reality) sounded like a combo of direct and maybe something like a miked polytone or an open back tube amp to me. damn i wish i still had that vinyl, the music was sorta philly scmaltz with strings, but his playing was heavenly, much like wes really!

[Sterrance]

It sounds to me like he's almost trying to mimic Wes's sound, just in a lower register. Does anybody else agree?

[bassbrad]

Dunno if he was trying to mimic Wes' sound or going for the epic jazz guitar tone of the day, Tal Farlow, Herb Ellis an many other had a similar tone. Monk played with his thumb like Wes did and that could certainly make some difference.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by bassbrad

Bassman amps may date back that early but were pretty rare, the 4x10 combo amps didn't come out until '54

Fender Bassman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

The amp pictured looks like a Standel to me.

Of course, but the BASS was pretty rare too. According to Jim Roberts' book "How The Fender Bass Changed The World", production of Fender basses was less than 200/year through the middle of the '50s, increasing to maybe a thousand a year by the end of the decade.

Part of what made the Fender bass the leader was that it was the first electric bass that also had a relatively viable amplifier with it. Even though the very first one was something like 25 watts and a single 15, it was better than what else was around at the time.

The photo in the link is obviously a much later photo of Monk. It's a Jazz bass with blocks 'n' binding going into what does appear to be a Standell, although it also looks much like a Randall too. And Randall makes sense, because it was the company started by Don Randall, the head of Fender Sales. Mr. Randall is at least as responsible for Fender's success it seems as Leo, Freddy Taveres, and Forrest White. He did a lot of the artist contacts.

So later Monk was using other things, but his early recorded work with Lionel Hampton wasn't a Jazz (because the Jazz was still many years away) and was likely a Bassman combo.

John

[Petethebassman]

Originally Posted by JTE

Of course, but the BASS was pretty rare too. According to Jim Roberts' book "How The Fender Bass Changed The World", production of Fender basses was less than 200/year through the middle of the '50s, increasing to maybe a thousand a year by the end of the decade.

Part of what made the Fender bass the leader was that it was the first electric bass that also had a relatively viable amplifier with it. Even though the very first one was something like 25 watts and a single 15, it was better than what else was around at the time.

So later Monk was using other things, but his early recorded work with Lionel Hampton wasn't a Jazz (because the Jazz was still many years away) and was likely a Bassman combo.

John

John, I have a double LP of the Lionel Hampton recordings made in September 1953 in Paris with Monk Montgomery on Fender bass, it's this one: The complete 1953 Paris session - Lionel Hampton | Paris Jazz Corner

The recording quality is quite good and Monk's bass comes through loud and clear: the tone and playing style is very much like the upright bass playing of the early-1950's. The gatefold sleeve has no pictures of Monk with a Fender Precision and obviously the front cover pic of Lionel Hampton is from the 1970's as there's a Sunn amp in the picture.

[Sterrance]

Originally Posted by bassbrad

Dunno if he was trying to mimic Wes' sound or going for the epic jazz guitar tone of the day, Tal Farlow, Herb Ellis an many other had a similar tone. Monk played with his thumb like Wes did and that could certainly make some difference.

Can anyone else confirm that Monk played with his thumb? I wasn't aware of this and always thought he played fingerstyle.

[One Drop]

Originally Posted by Sterrance

Can anyone else confirm that Monk played with his thumb? I wasn't aware of this and always thought he played fingerstyle.

Yes he did play with his thumb, but not exclusively. Maybe he played fingerstyle more as the decade progressed?