The Praise and Worship Band Bassists Club part 23

[PilbaraBass]

It can be a ministry, should be a ministry, but often ends up being an ornament...
Step 1... The team needs to desire worship ... Needs to BE in worship (not just at church, all week)...

Step 2... It's for HIM
Step 3... Repeat step 2. Infinitum

[SoVeryTired]

Originally Posted by PilbaraBass

It can be a ministry, should be a ministry, but often ends up being an ornament...
Step 1... The team needs to desire worship ... Needs to BE in worship (not just at church, all week)...

Step 2... It's for HIM
Step 3... Repeat step 2. Infinitum

Like it! Although I'd add a step 2.5 in there (with step 2 being much more important) - it's for 'them' before 'me'.

[english4bw]

Originally Posted by dDaddybass

Are you splitting the signal out of you reddi, to foh and to an amp?

Yes. I use an XLR AB/Y splitter cable.

[steve_rolfeca]

Originally Posted by HereIGoAgain

...My church likes to talk about the concept of "vertical worship." By that, they mean that the song words have to directly cross-reference to the sermon. I don't know if that's a "human-made rule" or if it's Scripturally founded. In many ways, I feel this limits our song selection to the, as I would say, the K-Love standards.

If the sermon series was about the evils of pornography, could we use Ozzy Ozbourne's "No Bone Movies?" Could we use "House of the Rising Sun" to help illustrate the dangers of gambling? How about Pink Floyd's "Money" to illustrate a sermon regarding serving two masters?

...am I making sense or is there some bigger picture thing I'm missing?

I think the idea of vertical referring to music that speaks directly to God (truly an offering of praise, rather than ministering to us and our needs), is the more common usage. But as long as you understand each other, that's just a sidenote.

Your second comment is interesting. Perhaps a better question might be why does it need to be a "rule", and in what ways would it/could it be un-scriptural?

Our message consists of the way the ushers behave, the bulletin, the music, and how we treat people the test of the week, not just the sermon. To me, it seems like common sense to keep all those parts consistent.

But there's much more to planning worship than buzzwords like "vertical", or even the words of the songs.

As a sideman, I tend to like songs because of the way a particular line, or even just the groove, affects me. But leaders with a real gift for leading worship think about a lot of other stuff:
- What mood does the arrangement invoke?
- How does the song sit within the rest of the set?
- Is it chosen to shock, tittilate, or teach?
- Will the congregation receive it the way it was intended, or will it be misunderstood?
- Will it evoke other, unintended feelings or memories for parts of the congregation?

When choosing secular songs to add context to worship, there are even more things to consider. For example, does it have cultural associations with a movie soundtrack or even a commercial, that might trigger old baggage for a significant minority within the group, and derail your message? Are you doing it just to be hip, when there might be a better choice?

All that said, when all the thinking and planning is done, there still can and should be room for a little light-hearted fun in church. Wielded with skill, it can actually help to drive home a more sober message.

Also, if you believe that the Holy Spirit is active in worship, them there needs to be room for His leading during the service.

One of the things I love about the WL's at my current church, is the way they will pick up on a developing theme from testimony or prayers, and do a quick song substitution to suit. I also love those little surprises when various people involved in a service make "independent" last-minute decisions, only to find that they work together to create something beautiful and totally unexpected.

[astrobass63]

Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and I came across your club and it's so nice to see a place for praise & worship musicians. I play bass for World Harvest Church in Dublin, GA. we have four piece band, bass, drums, guitar, & keyboard. We do contemporary praise from Jesus Culture, Passion, Hillsong, etc... I really love being able to use my talent to bring glory to God and to usher in his presence. I feel it's an honer to be able to be a part of a group that can use their instruments
to worship our Father, when the anointing hits you it's like no other feeling! I would love to be a part in your club so I would like to request a number please, be blessed my brothers.

[Hauhnar]

Hey guys, can you suggest some songs for me please. My local church is planning to make a music album of the members who are musicians and they have requested me and my friends to contribute a song; we are all members and we used to play there from time to time as a "guest band".
We were thinking of doing a soul-full number but can't seem to find any;the thing is we don't really have much experience with contemporary worship music, we usually play our traditional/ "native" songs at church.
We were thinking along the lines of What's Going On by Marvin Gaye (not a gospel song but just for reference!)
if you could direct me towards some songs or artist in the RnB and Soul genre who play gospel music exclusively, or some Soul/RnB rendition of common worship songs from which we can draw some inspiration, i will be very grateful.

[Jhengsman]

Ever hear that just about every artist started as a church singer? Just about any R&B artist has done some song which may be used, some have done full out gospel albums along with their secular work. I would be afraid to say do this and leave someone out. Or just show my age and pick something from the 70s to the 90s which was a hit for say Curtis Mayfield, The Commodores, Blackstreet.......and so on. As producers of the album that local church must have something in mind, perhaps something you played as a guest already.

In the conemporary field you have Kirk Franklin, who is basiccally a hip hop producer who has samppled from many sources. Many hits from as far back as Howling Wolf have been converted into gospel songs. You also have R. Kelly who might add a song on his own but is a the main song writer/ producer for others. Although he is controversial to many Christians because of his secular work and lifestyle along with his legal problems

[dDaddybass]

Originally Posted by english4bw

Yes. I use an XLR AB/Y splitter cable.

Are you noticing any tone loss ? The guys over in the Reddi thread say they've tried similar techniques but not without tone loss. How are you running into your amp? What kind of amp?

[SoVeryTired]

On the new Hillsong United album... haven't heard it yet, the one person at church who has didn't like it all. I was unsure about Aftermath when I listened to it with my 'Sunday' ears - it's probably the least 'congregational' album they've done but conversely the one I most like to listen to for my own enjoyment.

[SoVeryTired]

Had two great services today. The planned setlist was:

Endless Light (Hillsong)
Forever Reign (Hillsong)
Beautiful Exchange (Hillsong)
Our God (Redman, Tomlinson etc) for baptisms
10,000 Reasons (Redman) for offering

We had to drop Beautiful Exchange from the main set for the baptism service and add a repeat of Endless Light and an extended version of Our God (with false ending) for the baptisms. It was for positive reasons though - we had 19 people giving their testimony and being baptised!

[TodB]

Originally Posted by HereIGoAgain

One of things I've noticed and have been struggling with for over a year is this: we call our P+W team a "ministry." To me, a ministry implies an attempt to reach people. The bits about limiting the song selection, Abelton, and many other topics make me ask the question:

Is a praise and worship team really a ministry or is it an ornament?

My desire to use music for the Lord has never been stronger. My desire to be an ornament has never existed.

Does the guitar player "worship" more or less than the guy who cleans the church bathrooms? You can make the case that the guy cleaning bathrooms worships more because his devotion is expressed in a way that is strictly service to others - making the church more welcoming for everybody who comes in the front door - while the guitar player's service and worship also happens to be plain old fun.

"Reaching people" is about a lot more than just getting to pick the songs. I don't want to be specific about one case because I can't read minds, but as a general concept it sure sounds like a lot of times when someone talks about their ability to worship being hampered because they have to accommodate other people it's more about not getting their own way, as opposed to being worried that God will be disappointed.

[praisebass]

Originally Posted by TodB

Does the guitar player "worship" more or less than the guy who cleans the church bathrooms? You can make the case that the guy cleaning bathrooms worships more because his devotion is expressed in a way that is strictly service to others - making the church more welcoming for everybody who comes in the front door - while the guitar player's service and worship also happens to be plain old fun....

Cleaning the bathroom not fun?

You obviously have not seen 'No Time for Sergeants' recently:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqg4...e_gdata_player

[Schmorgy]

Originally Posted by steve_rolfeca

I think the idea of vertical referring to music that speaks directly to God (truly an offering of praise, rather than ministering to us and our needs), is the more common usage. But as long as you understand each other, that's just a sidenote.

Your second comment is interesting. Perhaps a better question might be why does it need to be a "rule", and in what ways would it/could it be un-scriptural?

Our message consists of the way the ushers behave, the bulletin, the music, and how we treat people the test of the week, not just the sermon. To me, it seems like common sense to keep all those parts consistent.

But there's much more to planning worship than buzzwords like "vertical", or even the words of the songs.

As a sideman, I tend to like songs because of the way a particular line, or even just the groove, affects me. But leaders with a real gift for leading worship think about a lot of other stuff:
- What mood does the arrangement invoke?
- How does the song sit within the rest of the set?
- Is it chosen to shock, tittilate, or teach?
- Will the congregation receive it the way it was intended, or will it be misunderstood?
- Will it evoke other, unintended feelings or memories for parts of the congregation?

When choosing secular songs to add context to worship, there are even more things to consider. For example, does it have cultural associations with a movie soundtrack or even a commercial, that might trigger old baggage for a significant minority within the group, and derail your message? Are you doing it just to be hip, when there might be a better choice?

All that said, when all the thinking and planning is done, there still can and should be room for a little light-hearted fun in church. Wielded with skill, it can actually help to drive home a more sober message.

Also, if you believe that the Holy Spirit is active in worship, them there needs to be room for His leading during the service.

One of the things I love about the WL's at my current church, is the way they will pick up on a developing theme from testimony or prayers, and do a quick song substitution to suit. I also love those little surprises when various people involved in a service make "independent" last-minute decisions, only to find that they work together to create something beautiful and totally unexpected.

The lead pastor's reasoning for adding secular songs to every worship set is multi-faceted and I support it fully.

1. His goal is to get more people from the city where the church is located who may not believe or be regular church attendees to come to church and have SOME familiar element to help comfort them and ease the awkwardness they may feel coming to church for the first time.

2. He's very much about going out and being "counter cultural" and feels that we cannot do that while remaining ignorant current culture and implications or similarities it may have with his teaching.

[HereIGoAgain]

Originally Posted by Schmorgy

1. His goal is to get more people from the city where the church is located who may not believe or be regular church attendees to come to church and have SOME familiar element to help comfort them and ease the awkwardness they may feel coming to church for the first time.

This.


I wish this idea was more prevalent. Thank you for posting this.

[Crazy_Climer]

Originally Posted by HereIGoAgain

This.


I wish this idea was more prevalent. Thank you for posting this.

This is one of the primary styles of our Church. Not that we are "big city" by any means, but at http://rlcwenatchee.com, our pastor has been known to say, "are you saved? Then you aren't the one I'm trying to reach!" It isn't meant in a spiteful way, as he's a very good pastor, to those of us in the Church... but his focus is on those that historically haven't been "in the Church".

With that said, tonight (yes, we meet at 6PM-- fairly "non-standard" for a Church) was another wonderful worship set. I am weekly improving my comfort with the awesome instrument known as "Da Bass", and being able to worship with this sweet instrument in front of me. I am more and more thankful for this opportunity!

Tonight's set was:
Mighty Fortress
Sing Forever
Cornerstone
Came To My Rescue
Go

I must also say we (collectively) are very thankful for a new facility. We have moved our worship service from a local community center to the Wenatchee Valley Baptist Church building. It's a good collaboration between the two congregations, bringing the gospel to our little area of Central Washington. If you happen to be in town... stop by and say, "Hi!"

[PilbaraBass]

Hmmm... Interesting...
Look, there are PLENTY of secular songs with positive messages... I don’t think I have a problem with this. Some time should be spent evangelising, and the first step towards that is connection, for sure...

As long as ( and here’s the hard part), the “performance” and entertainment doesn’t take presence over the Real Reason (capitalised intentionally) people should congregate.

A healthy church needs the complete family... and that includes the newcomers, for sure.

[Samsound]

Wow. A 13 hour day today at church. Our sound guy is on vacay this week, so I filled in while one of our part time musicians covered bass. Arrived at 5:30 to trace a missing keyboard channel and set up. After 3 services I stayed to rehearse on bass for our 3-campus wide Life Group Kickoff gathering later on in the evening. We ran through the 2 songs, then WL picked us up a BBQ lunch. By then it was 2, and we had to return by 3 for a 4 pm start. That event ran until about 6, then tore down and left at 6:30. All on 2 hours of sleep. I'm beat, lol, but there was some awesome worship happening. It was really great to share our worship style with the 2 other campuses. I know I felt blessed, and heard the same from some of our guests. Looking forward to a relaxing 10 hours at work tomorrow.

[patrickm]

Jesus Reigns
Whom shall I fear
Always
I won't give up -(my Streamline tireless sounded really good on)

[totallyfrozen]

Originally Posted by HereIGoAgain

One of things I've noticed and have been struggling with for over a year is this: we call our P+W team a "ministry." To me, a ministry implies an attempt to reach people. The bits about limiting the song selection, Abelton, and many other topics make me ask the question:

Is a praise and worship team really a ministry or is it an ornament?

My desire to use music for the Lord has never been stronger. My desire to be an ornament has never existed.

Ministry: a person or thing through which something is accomplished : agency, instrumentality. (Merriam-Webster)

That said, you may recall in the Old Testament it was standard practice for the LORD to send the musicians out first (in the front of the marching column) of the Israelite army when they would march to war. It was THAT important. It was more important than the actual soldiers, really.

You may also recall that the highest, most beautiful created being the crowing glory of God's angelic hosts, Lucifer, was a musician. That was his job in the presence of God before he chose to rebel and spend the rest of this days tormenting the Earth as the Evil One we call Satan. So music is so important in the opinion of God (if you can even call His thoughts an "opinion") that his absolute pinnicle of His creation was a musican whose job it was to provide the musical worship in Heaven itself.

I think that if you are seeing the music service in the church as just an ornament and view other ministries as more important, perhaps you're attitude about the music ministry does not match what God says about it.

[ShowLow]

10,000 Reasons
Show Me Your Ways
The Solid Rock
Everybody Praise the Lord
Better is One Day
You Save (piano only - beautiful!!)

I got one quick run through each and that was it for rehearsal. The Spirit took it from there! This is quite the wild ride for a new bassist. What a privilege.