snobbery on the increase?

[dreadheadbass]

ok this isnt a rant about anyone on this site its not aimed at any individuals what so ever in fact i'm sharing my views with you guys because you all seem to have your heads screwed on!!!
but something i'm noticing more and more as my band plays live is "bass snobbery" and what makes it worse is its coming from so called "fellow" bass players!!
1st off my band has gone from pub gigs to playing bigger venues with more bands supporting or being supported by us.
at 1st it was a good laugh but now were playing with more "serious" bands i'm noticing a distinct change in attitudes.
its got to the stage now where i dont bother chatting to other bass players at gigs because all they want to do is talk about how much greater there warwick is than my bass or how there tracy elliot cabs are so much better than my "sh***y" ashdown cabs
the fact i play rings round these people onstage doesnt seem to matter anymore it seems a bass guitar is now a fashion statement rather than an instrument and unless it has "musicman" or "fender usa" written on it, or if its in any colour other than pink, white or sunburst its a heap of junk for an amerture and should be treated as such
what makes it worse is bassists now seem to be so protective of there gear they never help each other out anymore i asked to borrow kettle lead off a lad 2 gigs ago and he refused to lend me 1 even though i'd lent him a battery and a roll of ducktape
it tends to be the younger generation but some of the elders are just as bad too!!
i remember the good old days when everyone would bring part of a rig and share it between all the bands playing, one band would provide the amp, the other a cab, drummers would allow other drummers to use there kit etc it made the whole night more enjoyable and faster for getting bands on and off stage

anyone else noticed a shift in attitudes among bassists?? is snobbery on the increase?

[meev992]

To me, I think the issue is becoming more cynical about other musicians. For me, I just don't have faith because of the way I have been treated, as well as my gear, in the past.

[Auzzie-Phoenix]

That's just a shame. People in general shouldn't act like that. I could understand the loaning of gear thing, if the people had stuff walk off all the time. But putting other people's gear down because of the brand or color, etc... It's not commendable in the least. I haven't run into this, as I don't go to shows and don't play in a band. But if it is happening, these people need to learn to be tuned in on a person's playing and not their gear. Being supportive and friendly to other players should be the attitude that people take.

[dreadheadbass]

Originally Posted by meev992

To me, I think the issue is becoming more cynical about other musicians. For me, I just don't have faith because of the way I have been treated, as well as my gear, in the past.

i'm losing the faith too i thought music was supposed to be about HOW you played not WHAT you played
i always thought half the fun was earning your instrument not turning round to your rich dad n saying "daddy buy me a warwick and an ampeg amp"
i've been snubbed at for a lot of things i think the worst was the bloke who tossed my bass into the corner of the room to get at his hardcase when i asked him why he felt the need to throw my bass in such a manner he casually stood up and said "what you moaning about if it breaks it gives you an excuse to buy something decent" before laughing and walking off
*dont worry the last laugh was mine i threw a half eaten kebab in his case when he wasnt looking and gave it a good shake*

[thumpbass1]

I'm glad I'm an old fart baby boomer doing the blues and
blues/classic rock scene. I'm lucky to work with musicians
who act like a community for the most part.

I feel for you friend. I've found players that have to trash
talk other folks choice or brand of gear to usually not be
self confident people to start with. The worst of the breed
are the ones that can't play for crap but they did buy gear
and they can't wait to brag about what they own. I'd just
shrug them off and move on.

Now as far as lending gear to another band that is a touchy
issue. I've no problem letting someone run through my amp
rig or using some other bit of non instrument bit of gear.In
my small part of the world most of my peers are very kind
and respectful types and for many I would have no trouble
letting them strap on one my basses. When it comes to
a stranger off the street or a drunk in a club I'd have to say
no.

It sounds like you are dealing with a lot of younger bands
full of attitude and b.s. but are also not composed of self
confident; let alone mature minded people to start with.
Snobs can be found everywhere but you just need to not
give them a second of your precious time and move on.

[Stereo Joe]

I know what you mean. In between sets at a pub show, a guy was making snide comments about my 'mexican' jazz bass and how it was inferior to the US models. Never mind that I actually had a Highway One bass which IS made in the US. I didn't bother to correct him. I just ignored him.

Next time someone says something snobby like that, you need to challenge him/her to a good ole' fashioned bass-off!!

[mccartneyman]

I've been playing for 43 years, but I haven't been hanging out with younger bassists for the last 20 years or so, so maybe I'm not qualified to answer, but I'll offer an opinion. I will offer that from 1965 through 1985, when I did most of my professional playing, guys in other bands never really competed over equipment. Mainly, we were interested in finding out how equipment worked. If I played Fender and someone else played Ric, I didn't tell the Ric dude that he was an idiot.

Here's one possible expanation for the snobbishness you observe: Today's "kids" -- from age 12 to say, 30 -- have all grown up in a materialistic, limited-attention-span society. They are driven by acquisition -- every video game system; laptop and desktop computers; TVs and VCRs in every room; cellphones; MPs players in all shapes nd sizes. Everything has to be better faster, smaller or bigger than what someone else has. My friend has a 14-year-old daughter who received a new cellphone for Christmas. When I arrived on Christmas Day with a more upscale version of the same phone, she was POd and demanded that her mother buy her a new phone. I think that, logically, this attitude spreads to those who play music. So, who do we blame? The parents (us) who raised them, or the kids themselves? Attitude and snobbishness is something that will never go away.

[BuffaloBass]

Welll generalizing is inaccurate BUT, if I may be allowed,

Dreadhead, is it coming form older folks to, or did you just say that? The reason I ask is that I'm finding the younger gens often much more superficial and materialistic than my generation. So without any real mojo, whatyya think they sqwak about? Materialistic nothingness, based on some dreadfully superficial feeling to be needed.

Do be mad at them bro, feel sorry. I say crap like " Sounds all in your hands man" all the time. Maybe they'll get it, or maybe they wont.

Kinda like telling an evangelical, hey lay off, Kingdom of Heaven is Within! Now get the eff out! Either they'll smile or they'll take ofense if they're very insecure.

McCarntneyMan and I posted simultaneously, with the same thought.

Therefore it must be truth. It is a generational thing.

[DZIB]

It's insecurity. Period.

[dreadheadbass]

Originally Posted by BuffaloBass

Welll generalizing is inaccurate BUT, if I may be allowed,

Dreadhead, is it coming form older folks to, or did you just say that? The reason I ask is that I'm finding the younger gens often much more superficial and materialistic than my generation. So without any real mojo, whatyya think they sqwak about? Materialistic nothingness, based on some dreadfully superficial feeling to be needed.

Do be mad at them bro, feel sorry. I say crap like " Sounds all in your hands man" all the time. Maybe they'll get it, or maybe they wont.

Kinda like telling an evangelical, hey lay off, Kingdom of Heaven is Within! Now get the eff out! Either they'll smile or they'll take ofense if they're very insecure.

McCarntneyMan and I posted simultaneously, with the same thought.

Therefore it must be truth. It is a generational thing.

i better clear up the "older generation" thing here before people get upset when i say the older folks can be just as bad i'm NOT on about experienced players (such as yourself) that have lived the music for decades its generally blokes in there mid 40's or 50's that have hit a mid life crisis and bought a sports car and then decided they'd learn to play an instrument and form a band
were talking the sort of upper crust buisness man who buys a top of the range bass not to play but to sit in the corner of his office to show his clients his "wealth"

i dont want people thinking this thread is aimed at them on here the sort of people i'm dealing with dont know this site exists and even if they did they wouldnt join because any half decent bassist would see right through them (and there's a LOT of good bass players on here)

its gettin me down our next gig is with a band thats so far up its own backside its hard to tell who's who between them all they probably have close to $8000 worth of kit but they play 4 chord proggressive rock with no frills or solo's and view every other band as inferior

[GlennW]

Originally Posted by DZIB

It's insecurity. Period.

Exclamation point!

My punction is more powerful than yours.

[barebones]

Originally Posted by GlennW

Exclamation point!

My punction is more powerful than yours.

Compunction-punction, what's your function...?

Matt

[rappa29]

Originally Posted by dreadheadbass

i've been snubbed at for a lot of things i think the worst was the bloke who tossed my bass into the corner of the room to get at his hardcase when i asked him why he felt the need to throw my bass in such a manner he casually stood up and said "what you moaning about if it breaks it gives you an excuse to buy something decent" before laughing and walking off

Man that is F'd up! I don't care if it's a Squier, SX, Sears or homemade frankenbass, I would NEVER treat someone else's gear like that! It's simple respect (or in this case lack of) for other peoples' property. What a jerk!

You shoulda 'accidentally' knocked his bass off it's stand or 'accidently' spilled your pint on it!!

Eh, but that would just be stooping to his level and wasting a good pint!

Fortunately I have not met any musicians like this or gear snobs. We always had musician types at our gigs. Most of them friends and they were always invited to sit in a song or 2. None of them ever made any negative comments about the SX P/J they had to play on or the GK (head), Avatar and Ashdown (cabs) hodge podge rig that they were forced to play through.

Actually would get compliments on the SX.

[emblymouse]

Originally Posted by DZIB

It's insecurity. Period.

Bingo! That the truth beneath all jealosy, attitude and snobbery. The biggies 2 steps up from where you're at aren't concerned with this crap, they know better and are more secure in their talent.

[AlunJWDavies]

It's funny, I think it's been there with bass players all along and I've been playing
for 30 years. Drummers seem to always get along. Guitar players. Keys. It's always
the bass players so now I'm wary at first. Still, some of the stories about people trashing instruments. Not cool. The gear thing is hilarious though. The inverse rule seems to apply a suprisingly large amount of the time. The better the gear, the less likely the player is a monster. Until you get to the point where they give the stuff for free of course Oh yeh, I lived in London in 05. There were some really nice people there but when the attitude was bad, it was really baaaadddd.
My Canadian accent(you a bleepin' yank?) probably didn't help

[BuffaloBass]

It does boil down to insecurity, as does racism... BUTT

DreadHead, your bloddy nailing me to the wall bro... I am a "mid level exec ", I did have my old PEavey T40 here at the office for a while ( 10 minutes with the bass is like an hour away from numbers - it was a great diversion), and I think I am having a mid life crises because my wife tells me I am insatiable " You're suppsed to be getting LESS horny ".

SO that mexican Fender sucks. You really ought to get a real amp man. Oh, I cant beleive you still play only 4 strings...

Stuff like that!?

Ribbin' on ya bro. Never judge a book by its cover, and I'm living proof. You'd NEVER guess whats inside if you simply saw my outside. I dig that.

But I see your initial observation in many aspects of life, and its isnt only Gen X, so I'm not picking on them.

Its folks that have such a weak definition of who they are, that they rely on other people's opinions, or focus on the physical "mirages: to quell their insecurities ( big house, fancy car, etc etc).

One think I;ve learned is how to control other flks influence on me, adn I specifically mean negative influences - the positive ones you dotn want to control, you just want MORE of them.

1) I try and keep my ego in a "locked box". Something I learned through martial arts. I dont put it "out" unless I need it out. You'll find that you dont need it much.

2.) when you react to a negative influence, you have, unconsciously subject your ego to it. Now maybe you did it consciously, but I might suggest that you CONSCIOUSLY dont let your ego get involved. DO NOT REACT to the negative influence.

In my "musical life" I defer to Mother Music. She "commands" me. I play for her, and I also can "guard" her by my respeonses like..

" You think its a better amp, eh? Well, THEY tell me its all in the fingers anyway. I'll work on that first. " Which is self-depreciating, not an affront to the other person's ego, and if they PAY ATTENTION they get a nugget of wisdom out of it. An absolute/universal truth, i.e., its NOT a truth only to me, i.e, I prefer Lakland 5 string necks to all others.

But the first thing is to consciously guard against negative influences in our lives. It beomces much harder to do, when the negative your gaurding against is someone very close to you, btw. But still an essential survival tool for us human-types.

[BuffaloBass]

BTW, for the record, some dood throwing my axe across the room... sorry I aint perfect - BIG EGO out instantaneously and he wouldnt know what hit 'em. Wonder if I'd try and knock him clean out, or just down to the ground.

But I wouldnt say a word.

[perfektspace6]

Originally Posted by dreadheadbass

i've been snubbed at for a lot of things i think the worst was the bloke who tossed my bass into the corner of the room to get at his hardcase when i asked him why he felt the need to throw my bass in such a manner he casually stood up and said "what you moaning about if it breaks it gives you an excuse to buy something decent" before laughing and walking off

Holy S**t If someone "tossed" or otherwise intentionally physically harmed one of my basses there would be an immediate fight. That's crazy.

I haven't run across much of the snobbery that has been mentioned playing with the 18-30 crowd. Can't say I don't make a comment to a band mate if I find someones tone especially bad but never to the player themselves.

[DZIB]

Don't worry. That a-hole will get his due one day. Maybe someone should hit him in the face with a Les Paul!!!

[Jazzdogg]

Originally Posted by dreadheadbass

ok this isnt a rant about anyone on this site its not aimed at any individuals what so ever in fact i'm sharing my views with you guys because you all seem to have your heads screwed on!!!
but something i'm noticing more and more as my band plays live is "bass snobbery" and what makes it worse is its coming from so called "fellow" bass players!!
1st off my band has gone from pub gigs to playing bigger venues with more bands supporting or being supported by us.
at 1st it was a good laugh but now were playing with more "serious" bands i'm noticing a distinct change in attitudes.
its got to the stage now where i dont bother chatting to other bass players at gigs because all they want to do is talk about how much greater there warwick is than my bass or how there tracy elliot cabs are so much better than my "sh***y" ashdown cabs
the fact i play rings round these people onstage doesnt seem to matter anymore it seems a bass guitar is now a fashion statement rather than an instrument and unless it has "musicman" or "fender usa" written on it, or if its in any colour other than pink, white or sunburst its a heap of junk for an amerture and should be treated as such
what makes it worse is bassists now seem to be so protective of there gear they never help each other out anymore i asked to borrow kettle lead off a lad 2 gigs ago and he refused to lend me 1 even though i'd lent him a battery and a roll of ducktape
it tends to be the younger generation but some of the elders are just as bad too!!
i remember the good old days when everyone would bring part of a rig and share it between all the bands playing, one band would provide the amp, the other a cab, drummers would allow other drummers to use there kit etc it made the whole night more enjoyable and faster for getting bands on and off stage

anyone else noticed a shift in attitudes among bassists?? is snobbery on the increase?

I'm seeing more of an attitude every day that I like to call "I've got mine; screw you!" ; this seemingly pervasive attitude is in evidence on the roads, is manifested in the decline of business ethics and political conduct, and, sadly, seems to be finding its way on to the stage as well.

If nothing else, when these gear snobs start talking, you can smile to yourself in the knowledge that these folks have done you a favor by revealing a part of their true character; otherwise, I'd ignore 'em.

BTW, what's a kettle lead?