What happened with Ian Hill in Priest?

[peaveyuser]

Seriously I'm listening to their old stuff quite a bit now. "Run of the mill" in particular, the bass lines are crazy good! Busy yet tasteful and just add so much to the song and yet now Judas Priest is plagued with 8th note repetitive basslines. Don't get me wrong I love the music but after hearing the bass from before I know its not a case of the Ian Hill not being good enough, very solid bass player.


Anybody to share thoughts?

[John Wentzien]

I always thought the earlier stuff was best (pre- British Steel)
But I'm just old and in the way......

[Massenburg]

The reason being for very simple bass lines with most 80's metal:
Its what the style calls for. 80's hair metal is very vocal and guitar based music. Bass is just there to provide bass, not cool bass riffs. otherwise the music would be to0 busy. a common rule that everyone should know:

Only one thing in a band can be featured at a time. Everything else has to play it simple.

[peaveyuser]

Priest ain't hair metal, nor ever was.

[Massenburg]

Haha 80's metal. You know what I mean. Same rule applies.

[badstonebass]

The same reason Gene Simmons changed, the music changed and therefore his role changed.

[Rezlax31]

Ian seems to be a very humble guy who just feels it is best for the band to stand back and let K.K., Rob, and Glenn provide the showmanship. It is unfortunate because he really knows how to groove.

[bongomania]

Originally Posted by badstonebass

The same reason Gene Simmons changed, the music changed and therefore his role changed.

The music got worse so he had to become less of a creative performer and more of a product manager?

[Sneckumhaw]

Maturity and becoming a seasoned, "tasteful" bass player are the absolute worst things that can happen to a cool bassist.

[Massenburg]

Haha ure being sarcastic right sneck?

[RUDEONTOUR]

i am going to dig out the vinyl and check ians older **** out, what i already know is that alot of bassist's from 80's era metal allowed themselves to get buried in the mix, and i'm sorry but any bassist with an y talent and a good bass and rig can bury a guitar player, and as a result alot of drummers forgot what it meant to be part of a rythym section, so many times trying out drummers for some of the bands i have played in over the last 15 years, the inabilty to follow the basslines instead of the rythm guitar, even if i pointed my SUNN rig right at the drummers head, was a joke!

[Valerus]

I like Sad Wings era

[Sneckumhaw]

Actually I'm not at all. "Tastefulness" is, at its best, something we should all strive for in our own ways. But when it comes to, say, Adam Clayton vs. Chris Squire (or later Ian Hill vs. early Ian Hill) I will opt for the latter, thank you very much. Tastefulness is too often a code for dullness.

[Geddyfleaharris]

Originally Posted by Massenburg

The reason being for very simple bass lines with most 80's metal:
Its what the style calls for. 80's hair metal is very vocal and guitar based music. Bass is just there to provide bass, not cool bass riffs. otherwise the music would be to0 busy. a common rule that everyone should know:

Only one thing in a band can be featured at a time. Everything else has to play it simple.

I guess someone should have told Iron Maiden and Steve Harris all that.

[neuromancer]

Originally Posted by Massenburg

The reason being for very simple bass lines with most 80's metal:
Its what the style calls for. 80's hair metal is very vocal and guitar based music. Bass is just there to provide bass, not cool bass riffs. otherwise the music would be to0 busy. a common rule that everyone should know:

Only one thing in a band can be featured at a time. Everything else has to play it simple.

I don't think Priest was "Hair Metal," and they were around doing it long before the 80's.

Listening to a classic like "Tyrant" (just to name 1) says (imo) that bass can be cool, effective, worthwhile and still not busy at all. I definitely feel that it makes the song sound better than the "don't bother putting much effort and then bury it" approach that they've taken on a lot of their 80's and 90's albums.

I can't help but think there are a hundred different degrees between "too busy" and "why bother?" And honestly, I don't think the bassline on "Tyrant" is overly busy, just effective.

[Would'e?]

Yes Ian was a more melodic player back in Priest's earliest days.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXBnAhMDFdI

But the band changed quite a bit from the early heavy psychedelia (as in the video above) to lean and mean rock in the late 70s and early 80s, to power metal in the mid 80s, pop metal in the late 80s, to all our speed metal in the 90s to whatever the heck "Nostradamus" is today.

Ian has changed his playing style to keep pace with the general sort of changes the band was making.

[lug]

Originally Posted by Sneckumhaw

Maturity and becoming a seasoned, "tasteful" bass player are the absolute worst things that can happen to a cool bassist.

+1 think of Michael Rutherford of Genesis

[Would'e?]

Originally Posted by lug

+1 think of Michael Rutherford of Genesis

That's what happens when a tasty bassist becomes a mediocre rhythm guitarist.

[john turner]

Originally Posted by Geddyfleaharris

I guess someone should have told Iron Maiden and Steve Harris all that.

+1. there's no excuse - priest always had room for ripping bass lines. their absence took away from the music, imo, and i think it's one of the reasons why priest's popularity declined as the 80's went on.

i saw maiden open for priest for screaming for vengeance (maiden was supporting killers). talk about amazing show - maiden totally dominated, even with dianno. they were a machine, a locomotive. i sorta felt sorry for priest heh (even though halford, tipton and kk downing can definitely more than hold their own, the differences in the rhythm sections between the two bands were -glaring-.)

[john turner]

Originally Posted by Sneckumhaw

Actually I'm not at all. "Tastefulness" is, at its best, something we should all strive for in our own ways. But when it comes to, say, Adam Clayton vs. Chris Squire (or later Ian Hill vs. early Ian Hill) I will opt for the latter, thank you very much. Tastefulness is too often a code for dullness.

it's not a code, it's an excuse. folks embellish their laziness by claiming "they grew up and got taste", when in reality "they grew old and got lazy".

music isn't about note count, it's about communicating and resonating emotions. understanding the rolesa of "simple" and "busy" in this situation is what makes a good musician. whenever i hear folks talking about how they "Grew up and got taste" it makes me wonder if they approach keys and modes the same way. "i don't play in "a aeolian" any more because i've grown up". doesn't make sense.