What's the problem with jeff berlin?

Step · #1 07-13-2008, 04:51 AM

yes, I know there's a thread going on about norah jones' records with jeff berlin on it, but I wanted to make this a separate thread so I can be heard

why does everyone have a problem with jeff berlin? to me he seems like an uptight, but really good jazz bassist

did he do anything wrong in the past? are his opinions on stuff too extreme or something?

why all the hate?

fenderhutz · #2 07-13-2008, 05:36 AM

Arrogance. Pure and simple.

People see him as being arrogant, without good reason.

Gintaras · #3 07-13-2008, 05:42 AM

I saw him with BX3 and he played great and was very personable and funny on stage. He made a few jokes on stage about jazz bassists having trouble getting gigs.

res-doghouse · #4 07-13-2008, 06:04 AM

Yeah It's true what's with all the hate. I love the way Jeff Berlin plays and think he deserves way more respect than he gets. On another note I did see a video of him on youtube wearing a fanny pack

I think that's a small reason for some comments but does not justify any reason for dislike.

**bassybill** · #5 07-13-2008, 06:15 AM

At one time on TB he used to be a regular here, and help some strong opinions about a range of topics. He didn't like the way some people expressed disagreement (it's true that some folks on internet forums find it hard to disagree without getting agressive) so he just got all his stuff deleted and left.

I know that Jeff can be dogmatic about some things, but I try not to take too much notice when people rubbish him because of that. Whatever you think about his personality, he's a great player and deserves a lot of respect for that fact.

keb · #6 07-13-2008, 06:27 AM

Two words: stereo chorus.

Just kidding! I admire his playing bunches 'n' bunches. Like others have said, he just has some strong opinions about bassdom and his manner can sometimes ruffle a few feathers.

Barkless Dog · #7 07-13-2008, 06:34 AM

He's arrogant and over opinionated.

JMX · #8 07-13-2008, 06:37 AM

I just think he takes being opinionated a step too far at times, with issues that seem long dissolved against his favour (metronome) or are just ludicrous (I "invented" slapping/I was the first to record slap bass - FYI, this is strictly IIRC/AFAIK, I just paraphrased, so if he didn't say that, I won't doubt that!!!!!). It was also very unfortunate, that he deleted his complete forum here @ TB.

I also always wondered why he settled in Clearwater, Fl., of all places. Scientology?

Low Main · #9 07-13-2008, 07:00 AM

There are two Jeff Berlins. (At least two, maybe more).

If you like the brilliant, relaxed, funny, personable, knowledgeable, innovative world class player enough to welcome him into your bass life, you have to also accept the irascible, overbearing, combative professional wrestling aficionado along for the ride.

Can't have one without the other.

The folks in the long white coats are using the Jeff Berlin case study as a warm-up for a similar but more extreme multiple personality case study: Coach Bob Knight.

Audiophage · #10 07-13-2008, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Low Main

There are two Jeff Berlins. (At least two, maybe more).

If you like the brilliant, relaxed, funny, personable, knowledgeable, innovative world class player enough to welcome him into your bass life, you have to also accept the irascible, overbearing, combative professional wrestling aficionado along for the ride.

Can't have one without the other.

The folks in the long white coats are using the Jeff Berlin case study as a warm-up for a similar but more extreme multiple personality case study: Coach Bob Knight.

Lemme guess, there is a wall between them, one side being controlled by the Soviets? I've heard that somewhere before.

I think he has a thing about being what some would perceive as "brutally honest". People are so used to being given sugar coated criticism that they couldn't handle it and decided that he was being a douche. That's how I see it anyways.

And, I don't know anything about him inventing slap bass, thats new to me and certainly doesn't fall into the category of honesty. What a novel idea, lets hit our strings with our thumbs instead of lightly grazing them!

D.Don · #11 07-13-2008, 10:21 AM

Interesting thread discussing someone's persona on the internet as it was a living room discussion ... and how many of you guys really know this dude?

D.Don

CapnSev · #12 07-13-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMX

I just think he takes being opinionated a step too far at times, with issues that seem long dissolved against his favour (metronome) or are just ludicrous (I "invented" slapping/I was the first to record slap bass - FYI, this is strictly IIRC/AFAIK, I just paraphrased, so if he didn't say that, I won't doubt that!!!!!). It was also very unfortunate, that he deleted his complete forum here @ TB.

I also always wondered why he settled in Clearwater, Fl., of all places. Scientology?

Between the "I invented slap" the "I never need a metronome" and the "I was born this good" stuff he's always saying, I really don't want to even listen to what he plays.

Snarf · #13 07-13-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gintaras

I saw him with BX3 and he played great and was very personable and funny on stage. He made a few jokes on stage about jazz bassists having trouble getting gigs.

There's jazz players getting gigs. They're the ones who are able to stop soloing and go beyond walking so they can deliver a groove for a tune. I don't think Jeff is into other peoples' ideas of what's appropriate for a gig, I think he's more into pushing his own agenda. Which means he doesn't get as many gigs as he otherwise would. I guess that's why he's pushing Markbass so hard, that's probably one of his main sources of income.

This is just speculation, and I don't have anything against Jeff. Just drawing conclusions based on what I've read by him, and his Myspace bulletins.

Harper · #14 07-13-2008, 10:46 AM

I too met Berlin at a Bx3 gig and found him to be a very nice guy.

Besides, he's no more arrogant than Jaco was.

**Eric Perry** · #15 07-13-2008, 10:47 AM

I respect him as a player a great deal. He's one of the greats, no doubt.

As a person, he's a tool though. I can't even think of how man opinionated, overbearing, arrogant, condescending things he's said in the past. When there's someone like Wooten, who can be a monster player, and a genuinely nice human being, I have no desire for Berlin!

Oh, and there's that chorus!!!!

**Eric Perry** · #16 07-13-2008, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harper

Besides, he's no more arrogant than Jaco was.

I'm not sure if this is true or not. Jaco was certainly arrogant. But Jeff seems to just exude condescension from every pore.

Also, don't forget Jaco was diagnosed with BPD (manic depression) and had a well documented substance abuse problem (possibly to self-medicate?). I'm not excusing his behavior, but I have to acknowledge his diagnoses played a role in his demeanor and affect.

burk48237 · #17 07-13-2008, 03:53 PM

I have found a lot of times the really exceptional musicians I know have exceptional personality flaws. It could be from spending all of their HS years locked up in the bedroom practicing Phrygian modes, or it could be a cognitive deficiency that is compensated for by a superior ability in another area. From what I've seen the ones who are exceptional talent and not a bit "eccentric" are rare.

Jeff has on more then one occasion gone out of his way to let others know that he doesn't realize that not everyone is as dedicated or as much of a purist as he is. Some of us have lives. He is an exceptional player, who am more then willing to support by purchasing his CD's or attending one of his concerts or clinics. I doubt he would make my top 100 list of players I would hire to work in a band.

Philbiker · #18 07-13-2008, 03:54 PM

Anyone who plays fretless is just trying to imitate Jaco. Jaco defined the instrument and there is absolutely no way to play fretless without being a copy of Jaco. Slap bass has no place in education. The list goes on. I love the bass he designed and enjoy a couple of his records that I have.

bassteban · #19 07-13-2008, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.Don

Interesting thread discussing someone's persona on the internet as it was a living room discussion ... and how many of you guys really know this dude?

D.Don

Isn't this why they invented the internet?

On topic, the worst thing I can say about JB is that he once endorsed Crate, although it was so long ago that it was considered borderline decent stuff at the time.
The best thing I can say about him is that I really don't anything about him. I think he plays bass.

20db pad · #20 07-13-2008, 04:09 PM

Jeff keeps it real - he has strong opinions, a set way of thinking that doesn't dovetail nicely with a lot of established schools of thought, and will comment about all that in a brutally honest and unvarnished manner.

Berlin's a blowhard, but that part of his personality only seems to manifest itself in print or during a debate. I've never seen him act like that in person. He displays a passion and enthusiasm about his craft that's refreshing in a world where BS, slick talk, and charisma counts more than it should.