Bass Bar tune up

[ctregan]

Wile the top is off of my bass for some block rebuilding, It got me thinking about other internal repairs/maintenance I might consider at this time;

Do Bass bars need to be replaced over time? (This one is 60 yrs old)
Could The bass perform better with a new bass bar? (more focus and punch)
...Or should I just make sure its glued down tightly and leave it alone.

[ctregan]

I do not foresee taking the top off again for a long, long wile, so now is the time for inside work.

Here is some bass bar pictures from the flip side of the Cleveland American Standard bass.

Thanks in advance.

[Istar]

Well I might be no Luthier but I`d think changing the bass bar would change the sound.... a lot.

So if there is no real need to change it now I would leave it alone, that is if you like the way your bass sound now.

[sonix]

grammar

[ctregan]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Good advice.
This is a plywood top. I think the strength of plywood has kept the bass bar in good condition.

My thinking was a new hand made bass bar "might" perform better, than the old factory bar.

[Bob Branstetter]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

If the Top is not Sunk, leave it alone.

+1
There is a good chance that your new bar might even have a negative effect. I've seen it happen.

[ctregan]

The bass bar is 3/4" away from the top of the f hole. The bridge foot does not land directly over the bar, only half way.

Shifting the bar over towards the f hole it would correct this problem.

Also, by shifting the bar closer to the f hole, would that give the bass more E string volume?

[Mark Carlsen]

You can choose a bridge w. a different foot spread like a 1/2 size which might put the foot over the bass bar....I have had luck doing this on Kays and American Standards w. this very same problem. You will get more volume on the E string..

[ctregan]

Distance between upper f-eyes 148mm or 5 13/16"
Outside distance of bridge feet 152mm or 6"
Distance between bar and upper f-eye 3/4" or 19mm
Bridge feet center to center 4 1/2"
Bass center to bar center at f-hole notches 1 3/4"

A smaller bridge could be the ticket.

[Matthew Tucker]

You know Craig, why not just make a brand new top for it? You can do that. It would be more fun than repairing all those laminations. If the rest of the bass is sound, you'd end up with a nice hybrid and probably a better result at the end. And probably only a little more work.

I have a ply bass in better nick than that one, but the laminations are papery and although i could repair them, I decided to make a new top. Wood is sitting on my bench at the moment.

[arnoldschnitzer]

If time and effort are not considerations for deciding, I would replace the bar. Moving the bass bar over so that the bridge foot sits nicely over it will improve the volume and bass response. You will have a wider zone between the bass bar and soundpost to create more movement. This will not happen if you put a narrow bridge on the bass. I will say though that I have set up many old Standards with a 150mm bridge over the original bass bar and they all sounded good.

[ctregan]

[quote=Matthew Tucker;5992651]You know Craig, why not just make a brand new top for it? You can do that. It would be more fun than repairing all those laminations. If the rest of the bass is sound, you'd end up with a nice hybrid and probably a better result at the end. And probably only a little more work.

Good idea Matthew, kind of like a homemade hybrid.
A friend did suggest keeping the original bass bar and replacing all the other parts (joke)...... Its in rough shape but it is repairable.

Thanks for the input Arnold, Its tempting to tweak a few parts to help liven up the sound. Your description makes a lot of sense.

[Matthew Tucker]

Arnold and others ... is there any generalisation you can make about the effect of having a bassbar set too far from the centreline, ie; sitting under the outside edge of the bridge foot?

[MT Spaces]

Originally Posted by Gearhead43

Plywood top??!! Might as well burn it then, huh? You might catch a disease from it.

Whassup GH ? Are you bored cuz RABB isn't running tip-top? Why start a scrum here? Neither Bob B, K Smith, nor anybody else are giving CT any guff about his plywood AS top ..... As I see it they are all just giving different takes and perspectives on the repair. Ask yourself whether you are adding anything positive here or helping CT out .

[arnoldschnitzer]

Originally Posted by Matthew Tucker

Arnold and others ... is there any generalisation you can make about the effect of having a bassbar set too far from the centreline, ie; sitting under the outside edge of the bridge foot?

I think perhaps you end up transfering less pressure from the bass foot of the bridge to the bass bar, and may lose some bottom and projection as a result. Conversely, many makers do exactly what you have described, deliberately putting the maximum distance between the bass bar and soundpost.

[Gearhead43]

Originally Posted by Bob Knebel

Whassup GH ? Are you bored cuz RABB isn't running tip-top? Why start a scrum here? Neither Bob B, K Smith, nor anybody else are giving CT any guff about his plywood AS top ..... As I see it they are all just giving different takes and perspectives on the repair. Ask yourself whether you are adding anything positive here or helping CT out .

PM sent.

[Matthew Tucker]

Originally Posted by arnoldschnitzer

Conversely, many makers do exactly what you have described, deliberately putting the maximum distance between the bass bar and soundpost.

Well on my latest bass, I just dicovered that due to a small miscalculation on my part, I have placed the bass bar about 8mm further out than where I had intended to put it, centred under the bass foot. My first reaction was unprintable, but having just fit the bar a few weeks ago, I'm hesitating to plane it all off again. So ... I think I'm going to leave it as-is and get the top on as soon as I can. If the bass doesn't speak to me I suppose I can always pull it apart again.

[MT Spaces]

Originally Posted by Bob Knebel

Whassup GH ? Are you bored cuz RABB isn't running tip-top? Why start a scrum here? Neither Bob B, K Smith, nor anybody else are giving CT any guff about his plywood AS top ..... As I see it they are all just giving different takes and perspectives on the repair. Ask yourself whether you are adding anything positive here or helping CT out .

I want to Publicly Apologize to My Comrade GearHead for giving him sh&t here. I guess I missed some of the earlier posts that he was responding to. I, too, am a lover of Old American Plywoodies (owning 2 Kays and 1 Epiphone) and I also get distressed when Folks Denigrate The Genre .

So Sorry GH. I think it is Real Friggin' Cheezzey that posters here at TalkBass can jump in and flame someone or something ..... Then ..... Just as quick .... Jump back out and delete their post ..... Leaving us in a total burnt-rubber cloud and stink just like a NASCAR winner . That Really Does Stink !

[MT Spaces]

Wow ... This Thread died like a big-old Road-Kilt Skunk ... Huh . I was very interested in the original topic.

Please CT .... Report back On-Topic .... How are the American Standard Top and Bass-Bar doing ?

[ctregan]

Originally Posted by Bob Knebel

Please CT .... Report back On-Topic .... How's the American Standard POS Top and Bass-Bar doing ?

Putting all the pieces back together again takes a long time.... I'll try to post some "progress" pictures latter tonight.

Thanks for the interest.