Bass Wheels: Yes or no?

drurb · #1 04-27-2007, 01:46 PM

Searching through old threads, I could find only a limited amount of discussion regarding any risks inherent in using a high-quality pneumatic wheel, such as the Gaines wheel. There seems to be some disagreement among the experts about this. So, assuming one is being reasonable and not rolling over potholes and irregular surfaces, what are your thoughts?

**Bob Gollihur** · #2 04-27-2007, 02:10 PM

I've sold a ton of bass wheels over the past several years, always recommending the pneumatic Gaines for carved/more delicate instruments, or the budget one with the solid rubber wheel with a little "give" for laminated instruments. For safety's sake, I, too, would always recommend carrying the bass over particularly rough terrain.

I haven't had a single report of bass damage in relation to using a wheel, if that's any indication. While I suspect its use could aggravate or bring to light a problem in the wings, it seems to be rare.

theshadow2001 · #3 04-28-2007, 05:41 AM

You may or may not have seen the adds for this dealy on talkbass. Looks like it might take the stress stress away from the enpin block. Although it would be nice if it had pnuematic wheels but you cant have everything I suppose

arnoldschnitzer · #4 04-28-2007, 06:34 AM

I'd rather have the weight on the solid endblock than on the fragile edges. After all, isn't that what the endblock is there for?

theshadow2001 · #5 04-28-2007, 06:47 AM

Maybe your right arnold. I wasn't thinking of the weight of the bass itself but more if any bumps were hit you wouldn't get a lever type of effect. If you were pushing the bass forward for example and hit a bump there would be a force going back towards you through the wheel on the bass but your still pushing the bass forward causing a force in the opposite direction. Which would result in the stress on the end block I was talking about. The way those wheels are would seem to lessen that effect.

Im not sure if im made what I said to clear, or if its right but what the hey

Reuben · #6 04-28-2007, 09:39 AM

In any previous discussion I've seen on bass wheels, critiques of the concept are only ever theoretical. Real world experience seems to show that damage to the block from wheel use is extremely rare, especially with the quality of wheels available now.

The one time I ever damaged my block it was while losing my balance carrying the bass on a strap, without a wheel. I dropped it hard on a rock and the bottom of the bass started to cave within the hour.

I have been using a Gaines wheel since 1993 and have never had a problem. This is in NYC where wear and tear is extreme!

I know one bass player who insists that use of a wheel causes the molecules in the wood to revolve in the wrong direction, making the wood vibrate badly. I think this is an insane notion, but your mileage may vary!

drurb · #7 04-28-2007, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reuben

I know one bass player who insists that use of a wheel causes the molecules in the wood to revolve in the wrong direction, making the wood vibrate badly. I think this is an insane notion, but your mileage may vary!

So, in the southern hemisphere, they might revolve in the correct direction and enhance the sound of the bass.

theshadow2001 · #8 04-28-2007, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reuben

In any previous discussion I've seen on bass wheels, critiques of the concept are only ever theoretical. Real world experience seems to show that damage to the block from wheel use is extremely rare, especially with the quality of wheels available now.

The one time I ever damaged my block it was while losing my balance carrying the bass on a strap, without a wheel. I dropped it hard on a rock and the bottom of the bass started to cave within the hour.

I have been using a Gaines wheel since 1993 and have never had a problem. This is in NYC where wear and tear is extreme!

If they work they work. you cant argue against results

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reuben

I know one bass player who insists that use of a wheel causes the molecules in the wood to revolve in the wrong direction, making the wood vibrate badly. I think this is an insane notion, but your mileage may vary!

if ever there was a use for this smiley here it is

robobass · #9 04-28-2007, 01:48 PM

"I know one bass player who insists that use of a wheel causes the molecules in the wood to revolve in the wrong direction, making the wood vibrate badly."

I love that! That's why I don't use one. Also, I had a bag custom made with lead impregnated shell material to prevent the aliens from screwing up my tone with their neutrion bursts. You can recognise me on the street. I'm the guy with the copper mesh baseball cap struggling to maneuver his 300 lb. load without a wheel. Keeps me fit anyway!
Robobass

flatback · #10 04-28-2007, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldschnitzer

I'd rather have the weight on the solid endblock than on the fragile edges. After all, isn't that what the endblock is there for?

uh oh... I am in the market for a new wheel and was seriously eyeing the KC strings carrier. I too have used bass wheels for a very long time with no endblock problems but it does shift off axis sometimes so that the bass ends up going in a different direction then me.
But Arnold is dead on as per usual. Thanks. Anyone know where to buy
6in retreads?

Eric Hochberg · #11 04-29-2007, 08:28 AM

I've been using the Kolstein stroller for thirty years of heavy use and no damage has ever been done. A big plus with this system is that you can stand the bass up on the endpin when you're waiting for the light to change...

Ike Harris · #12 04-29-2007, 10:49 AM

Just a quick thumbs up for the little cushy solid rubber Onxy from Lemur for small car-to-venue trips. Anything lengthy like NY multi-block hikes would require something a little tougher.

Ike

Slapfiddle · #13 04-30-2007, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flatback

uh oh... I am in the market for a new wheel and was seriously eyeing the KC strings carrier. I too have used bass wheels for a very long time with no endblock problems but it does shift off axis sometimes so that the bass ends up going in a different direction then me.
But Arnold is dead on as per usual. Thanks. Anyone know where to buy
6in retreads?

flatback,
i've been using the KC strings bass buggie and know that it is as safe as resting the bass on its edges, especially if you have a nicely padded bag. i really enjoy never having to remove the endpin like the old days.

Andy Allen · #14 04-30-2007, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ike Harris

Just a quick thumbs up for the little cushy solid rubber Onxy from Lemur for small car-to-venue trips. Anything lengthy like NY multi-block hikes would require something a little tougher.

Ike

I use the Upton Bass vesrion of this wheel - it seems identical to a friend's Onyx, but is considerably cheaper (or was at the time I bought it). I carry my bass to practice, lessons or gigs nearly every day and I can't imagine not having a wheel; I'd be really lost without it.

Normally I just have to move the bass between a parking lot and the building, but after last night's gig in Pasadena I couldn't be bothered to go get the car and bring it around to load it, so I pushed the bass (while pulling my amp cart) a couple of short blocks to the car. No problem, even with the cheapy wheel.

Andy

lloccmttocs · #15 04-30-2007, 06:11 PM

The bass buggie is amazing, I took it around Philidelphia for a weekend and got my share of laughing at the other bassists who had no wheel and had to walk down each block doing the lean back technique. I call it the scholiosis technique. I tried to show them an easier technique of holding it but they never listen to a word I say... Anyway the only problem I've had was my own fault, I was walking and I forgot my blind spot over the bass and missed the curb offsetting the wheel but it was a quick 5 second fix when I got to the show and even before the fix it was only off center meaning I had to turn it a different way then it went straight.

Plus it goes on and off like that! its so easy and quick I just put the bag on slip on the Buggie over the end pin and poof its done. I know they picture shows that you can transport it without the bag, but I havn't done it. It seems pretty safe, but I'm too anal to transport my bass without a case with our without a wheel anyway.

RCWilliams · #16 05-01-2007, 08:02 AM

I have a question, would it be appropriate for me, as the designer of the dblBass Buggie, to comment on its design features and our experience in its use, or would that be a nono?

M Ramsey · #17 05-01-2007, 08:23 AM

I spent $7 at a local flea market and bought a used golf cart that folds. The wheels are spring loaded, the tires are semi-pneumatic and I can bungy-cord the bass (in bag) to the cart. I bungy a short cord around the endpin and a couple around the shoulder/waist area of the bass and I'm set to go.

Over rough terrain, over smooth sidewalks. I have a handle attached to the top part of both my bags and I put the bass behind me as I walk. That way, I can see what the terrain, curb, sidewalk holds as I travel and the cart follows. if I need to stop, the cart will sit in a leaning/upright position, completely safe to sit, by itself, very stable.

There is minimal pressure in the mid-to-upper part of the back (safely away from the soundpost area). In my vehicle the folded cart takes up less space than a stool.

Last weekend at Merlefest, I negeotiated about 3/4 mile over curbs, sidewalk, grass, gravel with no problems. And my back didn't hurt either.

I'll never own a bass wheel.

drurb · #18 05-01-2007, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCWilliams

I have a question, would it be appropriate for me, as the designer of the dblBass Buggie, to comment on its design features and our experience in its use, or would that be a nono?

It seems to me that others have opened the door for you. I, for one, would very much appreciate hearing from you, especially your thoughts about where the weight of the bass is placed when using the buggie. From what I can tell, it is not directly on the ribs, but on the edges. Yes?

theshadow2001 · #19 05-01-2007, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drurb

It seems to me that others have opened the door for you. I, for one, would very much appreciate hearing from you, especially your thoughts about where the weight of the bass is placed when using the buggie. From what I can tell, it is not directly on the ribs, but on the edges. Yes?

Yeah I'd like to hear more about it too. It seems like a good design but arnold raises a good point about the block being a more suitable place to transmit the weight through.

RCWilliams · #20 05-01-2007, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drurb

It seems to me that others have opened the door for you. I, for one, would very much appreciate hearing from you, especially your thoughts about where the weight of the bass is placed when using the buggie. From what I can tell, it is not directly on the ribs, but on the edges. Yes?

you are correct the weight of the bass is on the edges of the plates the same as it is every time you lay your bass on the floor. usually the bass is in its bag if you go any where outside, the only time it would be unpadded would be if you were indoors and moving from class room to concert hall or something like that and adding a pad would be quite easy. The photo of the dblBass Buggie in the add (with out bag) was done because that way you can see it.

some people have a bit of trouble adjusting to the dblBass Buggie ( a bass buggy is a fishing boat) because their experience with a bass wheel requires them to maintain a firm two handed grip on their bass, where as the buggie handles more like a two wheeled dolly. I tried to design it so the buggie would do the work and you wouldn't have to.