I'm cracking up!

owen_liam · #1 11-15-2009, 06:48 AM

Hello there!

Disaster struck me this morning. I was playing at a local church and I thought I'd take the DB with me. It's a Stentor Conservatoire and is no more than 5 years old. I bought it recently and have been trying to get to grips with it - I am relatively new to the DB world.

Anyway, I neglected to take my stand with me. It's a church I thought. There won't be drunk people and it won't be dark like a regular gig. This was bound to end in disaster and, sure enough, the bass got kicked over and now has a scary looking crack down the back.

The bass was on its side. Basically, the perpetrator saw the bass, went to go round it but kicked the end pin really hard. The bass went forwards onto its front and I heard a crack. I thought the bridge was damaged, but it actually appeared fine. Closer inspection revealed a 6 inch or so crack running with the grain down the back, near to where the sound post would sit. Peering inside, I could see that the sound post had been bashed off of it's saddle (not sure what the terminology is here) and the force of it moving had caused the crack.

I'm out of my depth here. I obviously need to take it to a luthier, but is there anything I could/should do before then because I can't do it immediately. I've slackened the strings to reduce the tension on the sound post. Is that enough for now?

Is this a really serious injury or is it the kind of thing that we all have to expect to happen every now and then? Is it an easy repair or am I looking at lots of damage in the wallet department?

Gutted.

I guess the moral of the story is to always use a stand!

Any help and advice you can give will be very gratefully received.

RWP · #2 11-15-2009, 06:58 AM

Sorry about your bass. I had a bass fall over in its stand once, broke the neck off.

Is the guy that kicked it over willing to pay to have it fixed?

owen_liam · #3 11-15-2009, 07:04 AM

I don't know: I kind of don't want to burdon him with it. I took the risk of not using the stand - although that doesn't sound like a guarantee from your experiences - and I probably could have positioned it more carefully. I know the guy and he's not exactly loaded (he's a church minister!), so I'm thinking that I'll foot the bill and chalk it down to experience.

That has to depend on what needs doing and how much it costs though...

RWP · #4 11-15-2009, 07:12 AM

I don't have any advice about the repair but things like this are always difficult. Does he know he damaged your bass? Maybe he could have a special collection for a bass repair fund.

Armbruster · #5 11-15-2009, 07:13 AM

Well, most musician's aren't exactly 'loaded' either. He's guilty for the accident and should at least pay some of the bill.

owen_liam · #6 11-15-2009, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armbruster

Well, most musician's aren't exactly 'loaded' either. He's guilty for the accident and should at least pay some of the bill.

True. I'll see what the repair costs first though. S**t happens!

William Hoffman · #7 11-15-2009, 07:40 AM

is it a flatback? did you put the sound post back up? how "slack" are the strings just now? if it were me i would not put any pressure on the sound post at all until you can get to your luthier. the crack in the back might be a straightforward glue+clamp job. did it cause any damage to the inside of the top?

owen_liam · #8 11-15-2009, 07:46 AM

It is a flatback (I think - the top and ribs are carved). The sound post has not collapsed entirely. I've loosened the strings but not entirely. Should I slacken them right off and let the sound post drop?

As far as I can tell the top is ok. I can't see inside but there doesn't appear to be any damage visible. The crack on the back seems very clean - no wood has splintered or come away from the body.

draftsmann · #9 11-15-2009, 07:56 AM

I'm not competent to offer any useful advice in regard to fixing the crack, but I'd suggest you find out whether the church carries public liability insurance that might cover the cost of repair.

reedo35 · #10 11-15-2009, 07:58 AM

It's hard to tell without some pics, but from your description, you are looking ar an 800-1000 Luthier job, especially with the soundpost location of the crack. That's not really something you can just shove some glue in and clamp it like a seam repair. To fix it right, the top will probably have to come off, and then the crack will probably need to be cleated together. Also, if I were you, I would just take the bridge off and let the soundpost drop until you can get it to a luthier.

uprightben · #11 11-15-2009, 08:43 AM

Go ahead and slacken the strings completley, if you have a crack in the sound post area any tension could make it worse. This is a fairly serious injury, but as far as cost as repair goes, rates vary from luthier to lutheir. Just make sure you take it to someone competent.

eh_train · #12 11-15-2009, 08:48 AM

Hi

Sorry to hear about this! Cracks around the soundpost are tricky, because there's a lot of pressure on both the top and the back. Matthew Tucker's link shows the proper way to fix a crack on the top: Sound post crack patch - fitting pics
I imagine it would be similar for the back, except you would use hardwood rather than tonewood. There's going to be time and expense involved. Good luck, and let us know what happens.

Paul (eh_train)

RWP · #13 11-15-2009, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eh_train

Hi

Sorry to hear about this! Cracks around the soundpost are tricky, because there's a lot of pressure on both the top and the back. Matthew Tucker's link shows the proper way to fix a crack on the top: Sound post crack patch - fitting pics
I imagine it would be similar for the back, except you would use hardwood rather than tonewood. There's going to be time and expense involved. Good luck, and let us know what happens.

Paul (eh_train)

That is an amazing repair, no wonder it would take time and expense. Thanks for that link, helps us understand what happened.

**Matthew Tucker** · #14 11-15-2009, 01:04 PM

Owen I'd rather put the bass on its side than use a stand any day. Less far to fall. Just have to remember that endpins and scrolls are trippable. Bass up close to the
wall/piano with the bridge facing the wall.

The church will have property insurance (public liability doesn't cover this), so get a quote and see if the church will pay.

Alternatively, claim on you own insurance if you have it, maybe even your home contents insurance (which should cover you even on a gig) and ask the church to pay the excess.

You may need an inlay patch if the crack is near the soundpost. In any case, the top will almost certainly need to come off for the repair. unfortunately that's not going to be cheap. Get cracking on the insurance front!

William Hoffman · #15 11-15-2009, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owen_liam

It is a flatback (I think - the top and ribs are carved). The sound post has not collapsed entirely. I've loosened the strings but not entirely. Should I slacken them right off and let the sound post drop?

As far as I can tell the top is ok. I can't see inside but there doesn't appear to be any damage visible. The crack on the back seems very clean - no wood has splintered or come away from the body.

if i were you, i'd take the strings off. the sound post will fall, no biggie, it can be put back up after repair. you will then have little choice but to take the bridge off for the interim. if you don't it will fall off. hehe. find a luthier who is a "bass luthier" -- it is a serious crack and its location at the sound post requires work. it's difficult for me to say whether that means the top has to come off, but matthew apparently thinks it must. i was thinking it may be possible to rub in full strength hide glue and clamp it. hide glue is "strong stuff" and will cement a crack like that, but let the luthier who sees it decide.

owen_liam · #16 11-15-2009, 02:13 PM

Thanks so much for your advice and sympathy guys! The strings are off and the bridge is down. The sound post is still kind of wedged up inside, but the tension is off so there's not much more that I can do. I'll take it along to the luthier and see what they say: I guess there are so many variables involved that it will take someone who knows to look at it and make their minds up.

I'm proper gutted though: only had the bass a short while and I was just getting into it! Oh well...I did say on here when I bought the bass that it felt as though I were beginning a new life of expense and inconvenience! I have to see it as part of my DB character building experience!

**Matthew Tucker** · #17 11-15-2009, 02:59 PM

I read quickly and thought the bas was roundback bass. If the crack is under the soundpost on a roundback, just gluing it together is not likely to be a durable repair. But I just re-read the reply that the bass is a flatback, so the comment that the post was "knocked off its saddle" probably refers to the crossbar brace, and the crack might just be in the plate, and the crossbrace might still be intact and distributing string pressure, so the repair might be able to be done from outside. so yes, luthier needs to have a look to determine if the crack can be glued from outside or whether it needs a more invasing operation!

owen_liam · #18 11-22-2009, 01:36 AM

Hi guys. Just wanted to say that my bass is currently at the luthier getting repaired. He had a look and initially was concerned - he thought the crack was under the sound post and that the top would have to come off to perform some major surgery. To be honest, that would write off the bass (it's only really worth a grand at the most). However, closer inspection revealed that the crack was actually a little way away from the sound post patch (I found out that the bass is a roundback btw...probably should have realised that it wasn't a flat back by the way the back isn't flat!) and that a few studs could mend the crack - a mere £50 repair. The only danger is that the repair should fail in the future, but it's worth a go to keep the bass alive!

So, yeah, thanks for the advice guys. You were all there for me in a time of need!

owen_liam · #19 11-28-2009, 05:38 PM

Hello fellas.

Got my bass back from the luthier today. He's patched it up and got it playable again. He's done a very neat job and seemed pretty confident that it would keep the bass going for a long while yet! You can still see the crack on the back, but it's not too bad.

It cost me £55! The bass may be harder to sell on in the future, but I have no intentions of doing that anyway. All I have to do is cross my fingers and hope the repair doesn't fail.

In the meantime, I'm off to insure all my basses to the hilt!

Thanks again for your advice and support - it's great to be able to tap into your experience and knowledge!