Kay Bass Tailpiece

[Marcosmos]

I am having a '44 Kay Bass restored for my son-in-law. Would any one know where I could find an original tailpiece with the Kay inscription.

Also are they interchangable, or are they specific to the model?

Thanks in advance for advice, or a source for this part.

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by Marcosmos

I am having a '44 Kay Bass restored for my son-in-law. Would any one know where I could find an original tailpiece with the Kay inscription.

Also are they interchangable, or are they specific to the model?

Thanks in advance for advice, or a source for this part.

Check Kays web site...whatever it is...sorry I can't be of more help.

[bpclark]

Try http://kaybass.com/

[Marcosmos]

To Paul W and bpclark,

Thanks, I'll try the web site and contact the owner of the website.

[Paul Warburton]

I see you can just buy the emblem....Congratulations !

[MollyKay]

Hello...from what I know (and it isn't much) the Kay script metal emblem being reproduced is not the correct emblem for your bass. The metal script emblem was used some time after 1952. The correct emblem is a decal, I have a 1943 Kay and the emblem would be the script Kay with the three vertical bars. If you are not a stickler for accuracy the metal script Kay will still look nice.

[jolasa]

Yep, decal used from 1937-1951.

Metal emblem logo used 1952-1969.

Here is the decal:

[Jake deVilliers]

Originally Posted by jolasa

Yep, decal used from 1937-1951.

Metal emblem logo used 1952-1969.

Here is the decal:

Hey JOLASSIE, when you steal images from someone's website ie. mine, its polite to credit the website and the tailpiece owner/photographer!

And you're disseminating incorrect information. That decal was used from 1938 to the early fifties, replaced by a shield shaped decal, still mostly in bronze powder, with the later style 'Kay' script.

The shield evolved into a horizontal oval with the same script into the early sixties when the background was dropped and only the script remained.

The metal script was a later sixties replacement on the more expensive bass models.

[james condino]

JAKE!

'My apologies; I've used that image a bunch over the last year. Whenever asked, I always referred to it as originating from "some dork on talkbass"....

From this point on, I'll always credit it as..." from some dork named Jake on talkbass.Checkout his website.......

Do you have a source for those dates? The one I've used ( Rodger's kaybass.com) tends to be more in line with Molly's info.

j.

[MollyKay]

These are photos from my Kay bass collection that I can factually date the tail pieces. I know there are other versions of the Kay decals but I can say with confidence these are accurate based on serial numbers and manufacture dates from Roger Stowers and the Kay Bass website.

1953 Kay C-1





1950 Kay M-1B





1944 Kay M-1

[Jake deVilliers]

Hey Wendy, is that an ebony fingerboard on the '50 with the Brazilian tailpiece? And a Brazilian fingerboard on the '44 with the ebony tailpiece? Because if it is, then it isn't original. It doesn't appear to have the Kay style tailpiece hanger either.

And to be honest, that metal Kay badge doesn't look like factory installation either. They weren't the most accurate US instrument makers around, but that's quite an angle!

[MollyKay]

Good eye Jake!

I can give the run down on these basses and the back story.

The 1953 Kay C-1; that is the original maple fingerboard and maple tail piece. I have every reason to believe the script metal Kay logo on the tail piece is 100% correct for this bass. Kay made two types of script metal logos. One style has the pins down through the logo and one has the prongs out the back. The style with the pins down through the logo, I have two example of this style. One is from this 1953 Kay C-1 and one is from my 1953 Kay TV-1 bass.



I also have an ebony Kay tail piece from a 1950 Kay S-8, that example is the metal Kay script logo with the prongs out the back. In all three of these examples I believe they are correct to the basses and the tail pieces.





The 1953 Kay C-1 came from a one owner jazz player named John Johnson from Allentown, PA. This bass was bone original and very well cared for right down to the original Ampeg pick up and canvas gig bag. In my workshop blog I tracked the complete restoration of this bass right down to the contents of the gig bag with a set list of songs on 3X5 cards. I have no reason to think this bass is not 100% correct. As far as Kay tail wires, we replace all of them with the Clef brand hi-tech tail guts. We like the tail gut for its light weight, adjustability and strength. The tail wires have fractured and fail us more then once during a restoration. I save the tail wires, but there really are better more functional hangers for a bass.

The 1950 M-1B, she is a looker for sure. This bass had a replacement ebony fingerboard; it was replaced before we owned it. So yes, the bass has a non-original ebony fingerboard with a factory original rosewood tail piece and decal. It is reasonable to expect vintage basses to have had replacement part over the years, especially if they were gigged often. We have no problems with repairs or non-original parts provided the repairs are well done and keep the bass healthy and playable. The replacement ebony fingerboard on this bass was a very high grade, jet black and the bass was super easy to play. So agreed, non-original ebony fingerboard with an original rosewood tail piece and 1950’s decal.

The 1944 M-1, with this bass being manufactured during WW2, all bets are off for a matching fingerboard and tail piece. During war time they used what was available. This bass has a drop dead gorgeous piece of Brazilian rosewood for the fingerboard. I think the tail piece is actually an ebonized piece of rosewood or it could be ebony. We would need to weigh the tail pieces or scrape the surface to be sure. Again, I think this bass is the real deal and original. This sweetie sat silent for over 40 years in a gentleman library in Michigan. The bass has hardly any signs of abuse or play time. I have no reason to think she isn’t correct for a war time bass. During that time, they made do with what was available.

I try to give the best information I can when it comes to basses and my efforts to document and research the American made plywood basses. You can be miss lead easily by reproduction parts or a bass that has been assembled from dumpster dive parts. With 40 basses in my collection, all under one roof, I spend a lot of time looking, studying and documenting the nuances of my basses. I speak from my experience and I am always open to learn more. If this becomes my dent in the bass universe...cool. I am here to learn and share.

[james condino]

As much as we bass nerds get all worked up over the small details of these old basses, back in the day, Kay was....well...pretty much known for cranking out cheap student junk as fast as humanly possible. The out put and pace of the factory floor was amazing and if you look at their work across the spectrum- basses, guitars, and other instruments, you find that quality control and consistency was fairly relaxed. If you needed a black tailpiece and only had a brown one and it was time for lunch, guess what went out the door...I can say that having worked in a production instrument factory a long time ago and remember what it was like when the beancounters would come out onto the shop floor and try to tell us how to build instruments ....

Wendy's got the coolest collection of old plys around! I can't imagine trying to explain to my spouse that, yeah, I already have 40 old basses, but somehow I just need this one more and everything will be different!

j.

[tomshepp]

Originally Posted by Jake deVilliers

Hey JOLASSIE, when you steal images from someone's website ie. mine, its polite to credit the website and the tailpiece owner/photographer!

And you're disseminating incorrect information. That decal was used from 1938 to the early fifties, replaced by a shield shaped decal, still mostly in bronze powder, with the later style 'Kay' script.

The shield evolved into a horizontal oval with the same script into the early sixties when the background was dropped and only the script remained.

The metal script was a later sixties replacement on the more expensive bass models.

That somehow looks strangely familiar...

[Jake deVilliers]

Originally Posted by tomshepp

That somehow looks strangely familiar...

[MollyKay]

Originally Posted by james condino

...somehow I just need this one more and everything will be different!

j.

One more bass no longer makes it different. It just makes it better. They are all for the sake of research and preservation.