Low end growls, mid slightly less - more wood removal?

[George700DL]

So with my new bass I observed that the A string (in my case the lowest) absolutely growls, which is great. The D and G strings are a little bit quieter. I suspect part of the reason is the gut strings - mine are "village" strings, directly from Transylvania, and maybe the gauges are less than desirable.

But could a general statement be made about graduations/plate thickness when the low end growls more than the rest? I was worried about the opposite happening - if the bottom end was quieter, I'd think the top is too stiff.

Before I take the top off (if ever), I'll play around with soundpost placement and bridge tweaks (I didn't remove much wood from the bridge, othere than fitting the feet, cutting the curve, and thinning it a bit).

I realize this is a very general quesion that may not have a specific answer. Nonetheless...

George

[Matthew Tucker]

"growl" is usually a function of string height and tension. For a growly sound you need to have the string vibrate in a nice controlled way just under your stopping fingers.

For volume matching, I'd experiment with sound post placement, yes, but also string tension. Does it sound better if you tune the D and G up a semitone or two? Maybe you need more tension to drive the top? Maybe you need less? Try a steel string and see what happens.

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by Matthew Tucker

"growl" is usually a function of string height and tension. For a growly sound you need to have the string vibrate in a nice controlled way just under your stopping fingers.

For volume matching, I'd experiment with sound post placement, yes, but also string tension. Does it sound better if you tune the D and G up a semitone or two? Maybe you need more tension to drive the top? Maybe you need less? Try a steel string and see what happens.

Thanks Matthew, good pointers. It seems that when I drop the D to like a C or something close, it gets better. That led me to realize that it could the D in general that is a bit quieter (even when played on the A string). I guess it might be a number of things.

For starters, I'll start tweaking the bridge. I know that on my viola, altering the bridge had a huge impact on the sound (volume and quality). I don't know if that kind of detail is discussed in double basses. For starters, I'll increase the arch of the feet (cut more wood in the middle), and enlarge the heart (upward). Then maybe cut a new soundpost. The one I fitted is about 1 centimeter behind the treble leg, and in line with it East-West-wise - but on the very end (East), in other words, more in line with the end of the foot, not the dead center of it. My reasoning was - larger vibrating area. I know it's not exact science...

George

[arnoldschnitzer]

To emphasize the lower strings, move the soundpost away from the bass bar. To emphasize the upper strings, move the soundpost toward the bass bar.

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by arnoldschnitzer

To emphasize the lower strings, move the soundpost away from the bass bar. To emphasize the upper strings, move the soundpost toward the bass bar.

Thanks Arnold - I've been meaning to move the post a bit in so that at least it's in line with the center of the foot as opposed to the edge (about 7mm in I suppose). I'll turn and fit a new post.

It appears that the G string is also slightly louder than the D string. But the D note in general seems to be quieter. Before I write more, I need to make a few adjustments.

Thanks for the tip.

George

[Matthew Tucker]

If its only the D note that is weak then that indicates that it may be being damped by something in the body of the bass ... essentially a wolftone. Is the D oscillating wildly or hard to "start" when you play arco? I'd try a heavier/lighter tailpiece and soundpost placement before messing with your bridge too much.

[forester]

+1 SP
i may not be up to date on your instrument but i recall you mentioning putting a cheapy bridge on it, it might not stand up to, too much whittling.

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by Matthew Tucker

If its only the D note that is weak then that indicates that it may be being damped by something in the body of the bass ... essentially a wolftone. Is the D oscillating wildly or hard to "start" when you play arco? I'd try a heavier/lighter tailpiece and soundpost placement before messing with your bridge too much.

It sounded like the D didn't have much meat to it, compared to other notes.

But I believe I resolved this - I cut a new soundpost (#5) and fitted it more south-west of the original position. It is now its full thickness behind the treble leg, and in line with the leg (not the edge of the foot). The soundpost is around 21mm in diameter, turned from the same wood I used for the top. This one just snapped into position - I checked around with a mirror, and it seems to fit well - didn't need much fiddling around.

I also removed some wood from the bridge - where the legs meet, and also the heart area was increased. It seems like things are a bit louder now overall, and the D is more up to speed. That's the impression I get now. But maybe I just forgot what it sounded like before It seems OK now.

Thanks for the tips.

George

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by forester

+1 SP
i may not be up to date on your instrument but i recall you mentioning putting a cheapy bridge on it, it might not stand up to, too much whittling.

It's a Teller (German). The grain seems pretty tight on it. I think it was under $30, but looking at it, I would not classify it as cheapo (but then I don't know what I'm looking for, other than the grain).

George

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by George700DL

It sounded like the D didn't have much meat to it, compared to other notes.

But I believe I resolved this - I cut a new soundpost (#5) and fitted it more south-west of the original position. It is now its full thickness behind the treble leg, and in line with the leg (not the edge of the foot). The soundpost is around 21mm in diameter, turned from the same wood I used for the top. This one just snapped into position - I checked around with a mirror, and it seems to fit well - didn't need much fiddling around.

I also removed some wood from the bridge - where the legs meet, and also the heart area was increased. It seems like things are a bit louder now overall, and the D is more up to speed. That's the impression I get now. But maybe I just forgot what it sounded like before It seems OK now.

Thanks for the tips.

George

I might have been overthinking this...today I found this post here (I highlighted Ken's relevant terminology in red - about 1/2 way down the page):

Soundpost?

What Ken describes is exactly what was happening with my bass - the open A string rattled windows when bowed, and the D did not by comparisson. It seems that my A0 really is the frequency of open A. It's pretty wild, since I obviously never planned for this (I wouldn't even know where to start...). So it may well be that the D is fine, just not as cool as the A sound.

With this latest soundpost tweak, things seem to be more balanced - but I'd hate to sacrifice the "whoomf!" of the A in order to balance things As far as I can tell, the A is still powerful.

George

[Square Bear]

Originally Posted by George700DL

So with my new bass I observed that the A string (in my case the lowest) absolutely growls...

this may be an issue to take up with your local animal control...

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by Square Bear

this may be an issue to take up with your local animal control...

Nah, I like it.