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12-16-2009, 05:16 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | | "Pull Back" neck reset
I have an old Epi. B4. The neck seems solid, but clearly has moved a bit. The neck projection is quite low.
Of course, it would be great to pay a pro some $1000 to fix this, but then....well, that's kinda pricy for this old base.
Has anyone done their own "pull back" neck reset and is this something that might be tackled at home?
Pix here: http://s1002.photobucket.com/albums/...t=688a3276.pbw
Thanks for any thoughts you might have.
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12-16-2009, 05:25 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: May 2007 Location: Roseburg, Oregon, US | | Quote:
Originally Posted by rusag2 
Of course, it would be great to pay a pro some $1000 to fix this, but then....well, that's kinda pricy for this old base.
| Don't let Molly Kay hear you say that...lol |
12-16-2009, 07:05 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Flanning Don't let Molly Kay hear you say that...lol | Ms. Kay is one of my heroes, though she doesn't know it. But my wife....well, that's a different story. My wife has this crazy idea that our kids should go to college some day....or eat.....clearly she has no respect for these laminated pieces of American History.
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12-16-2009, 07:23 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: May 2007 Location: Roseburg, Oregon, US | | | I have the SAME PROBLEM with my landlord. He just doesn't seem to understand that the universe has priorities, and my bass is pretty high among them. |
12-17-2009, 01:32 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Syracuse N.Y. | | Quote:
Originally Posted by rusag2 I have an old Epi. B4.
Has anyone done their own "pull back" neck reset and is this something that might be tackled at home?
Thanks for any thoughts you might have. |
Pulling back the neck and inserting shims or wedges, could weaken the neck joint. There is also the risk of cracking the heel.
Your bass is almost 60 years old, I would highly recommend getting the neck reset, and returning your bass to its full potential.
Last edited by ctregan : 12-17-2009 at 05:11 AM.
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12-17-2009, 11:00 AM
|  | 'Woodworker - Witch Doctor - Luthier'
Owner/The Bass Spa, String Repairman/L & M Vancouver | | Join Date: May 2006 Location: Crescent Beach, BC | | Hey CT, I think he meant the old-style Martin guitar factory 'reset' where you loosen the back at the heel and slide the block down by pulling back on the neck. Then you trim off the overhanging back plate!
On a guitar you can re-cut the binding ledges to make it work but on a DB the purfling would pose a problem. I don't like the idea of introducing torque into the rim assembly either.  |
12-17-2009, 12:10 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Syracuse N.Y. | | | Thanks for clarifying the term "pull back", it sounded dangerous to me.
This thread made me think of a cello I am repairing; it has a maple shim under the heel (looks to be original), used to adjust the neck projection. No glue, just wedged in.
The shim idea, somehow works on 1/2 size student cellos ..... not a good solution for DB.
Last edited by ctregan : 12-21-2009 at 05:43 PM.
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12-17-2009, 12:43 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | | So, what do you all think it's going to cost me to have a qualified person reset this old neck? Ball park of course. $100, $500, $100, $1500, $5000? Anyone...anyone? See OP for link to pix.
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12-17-2009, 02:26 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Chicago | | | How high is your bridge now? That overstand doesn't look particularly low to me. How high is it? Is the neck loose? It appears fine in the pictures. |
12-17-2009, 03:07 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by ehochberg How high is your bridge now? That overstand doesn't look particularly low to me. How high is it? Is the neck loose? It appears fine in the pictures. | Currently, from the top of the bass to the top of the bridge is about 115 mm. Far short of what I understand is normal for a 3/4 bass. The neck is not loose, at least not while under tension with the strings. It feels quite solid and has a lovely (if soft) tone.
My other issue is that the slots in the nut are cut soooo low as to be non-existant. I can slide a business card underneath the E string, but not even one card under the D and G. So, a new nut is in my future too.
Good thing I got a good price on this thing.
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12-17-2009, 03:15 PM
| | Inadvertent Microtonalist | | Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, ME | | Quote:
Originally Posted by ehochberg How high is your bridge now? That overstand doesn't look particularly low to me. How high is it? Is the neck loose? It appears fine in the pictures. | This pic clear shows that the "bridge" is low reflecting a shallow angle.
You'll be springing for:
Fingerboard -- several hundred bucks just for the part; more for the dress-ification;
Nut -- part and related work
Bridge -- part and related work
Strings
AND THAT'S BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING ABOUT THE NECK ANGLE.
If you don't want to spend a thousand bucks, may I respectfully inquire whether this is really the bass for you?
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12-17-2009, 03:52 PM
|  | Registered User | | Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Toronto | | | Hi Rusag
There is definitely a potentially nice bass hidden in what you've shown us. The repairs that Sam Sherry listed, however, are probably in the $1500 plus range. They're not do-it-yourself, unless you've had lots of practice at it. As well, if you were doing all that work to improve the playability, you might want to remove the black paint and refinish it.
In short, to restore it is big bucks. You could keep it the way it is - maybe not such great fun to play on - or consider trading it to a luthier type for a ready-to-play bass.
Just some thoughts.
Paul (Eh_train) |
12-17-2009, 04:22 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by eh_train Hi Rusag
There is definitely a potentially nice bass hidden in what you've shown us. The repairs that Sam Sherry listed, however, are probably in the $1500 plus range. They're not do-it-yourself, unless you've had lots of practice at it. As well, if you were doing all that work to improve the playability, you might want to remove the black paint and refinish it.
In short, to restore it is big bucks. You could keep it the way it is - maybe not such great fun to play on - or consider trading it to a luthier type for a ready-to-play bass.
Just some thoughts.
Paul (Eh_train) |
Yeah, I'm going to try to restore the bass, but keep my budget under about $2K. Not sure I'll need a fingerboard. Something charming about the original that's on there. I think I'll probably go for a neck reset and bridge and strings. For now, I'm just playing it and enjoying!
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12-17-2009, 04:28 PM
| | 'Woodworker - Witch Doctor - Luthier'
Owner/The Bass Spa, String Repairman/L & M Vancouver | | Join Date: May 2006 Location: Crescent Beach, BC | | Quote:
Originally Posted by rusag2 Yeah, I'm going to try to restore the bass, but keep my budget under about $2K. Not sure I'll need a fingerboard. Something charming about the original that's on there. I think I'll probably go for a neck reset and bridge and strings. For now, I'm just playing it and enjoying! | In a perfect world you'd connect with a sympathetic luthier and have him/her pop the neck off for you. You could then refinish the bass and return it for re-assembly and setup.
Those Epi basses are usually nice and loud!  |
12-17-2009, 04:38 PM
| | Registered User
bass luthier, johnson string inst. | | Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: waltham, mass. | | | too bad its too low to shim the f.b.
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12-17-2009, 05:05 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake deVilliers In a perfect world you'd connect with a sympathetic luthier and have him/her pop the neck off for you. You could then refinish the bass and return it for re-assembly and setup.
Those Epi basses are usually nice and loud! | +1 I like that idea. Like it a lot. I now have a direction for my life!
Thanks mucho
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12-17-2009, 07:14 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Tokyo, Japan | | regarding the neck, what I would have done is pull the neck forward, put a shim/block between the butt of the neck and the button, and have the sides of the neck pocket shimmed accordingly. Then you would have the bridge height you want, and not change the angle the strings break over the bridge. This is called "raising the overstand" and was done to my old Italian bass long before I got it. It's been fine for the 20+ years I've had her. Attachment 149645
Sorry, the picture's a bit fuzzy. I should have used macro mode. Anyway, you get the idea.
I would also immediately take that bridge off the bass. The feet are supposed to sit directly over the bass bar, and about the same spot on the other side. Bridge feet which are too wide might be pressing down the inner side of the f-holes, and maybe could damage the top....
Good luck.
Last edited by Brent Nussey : 11-19-2010 at 06:02 PM.
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12-17-2009, 11:54 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Nussey regarding the neck, what I would have done is pull the neck forward, put a shim/block between the butt of the neck and the button, and have the sides of the neck pocket shimmed accordingly. Then you would have the bridge height you want, and not change the angle the strings break over the bridge. This is called "raising the overstand" and was done to my old Italian bass long before I got it. It's been fine for the 20+ years I've had her. | I get what you're saying. I think that the point is to change the angle that the strings break, in order to more efficiently transfer the energy from the string to the bridge. My understanding is that because it's so flat, I've lost a lot of volume.
I'm in Los Angeles, so I'm going to have a couple professionals have a look at it and see what they think.
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12-18-2009, 07:55 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Tokyo, Japan | | | So what's the breaking angle? |
12-18-2009, 10:48 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Nussey So what's the breaking angle? | I have not measured the angle to determine the exact degree. However, my bridge is about 30% shorter than "average" for a 3/4 which, logically, means that when my strings break over bridge, that angle is much flatter than is normally considered optimal. I do not undertand much about the physics involved, but the geometry is pretty obvious: My strings break over the bridge much more flatly than normal. The base also has lovely tone but very little volume. I have been giving to understand that this particular setup would contributed to low volume.
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