Stripping/Refin: How long did it take?

[hdiddy]

I have been lusting after new basses but mainly annoyed by the finish on my Christopher. I like my bass, I like how it plays and sounds. I like the shape and size too. Still, I've always been tempted to refinish the bass myself and get rid of that awful nitro lacquer that came from the factory.

I've read through the posts on what's possible. Waterlox doesn't sound all that hard, and I'd use citrusstrip to get rid of the old finish. I have a garage and all so I have a space to do the work. I have a decent replacement to practice with while this would be done.

So... how did does it typically take to refinish the bass? 3 weeks?

At this point I would also be tempted to change the tuners out and put in some half plates. The old machines are on standard tyrolean style plates. They don't fit the shape of my pegbox perfectly either. Plugging the old holes probably isn't a problem as I have a dowel maker and can make perfect plugs for the old holes out of any wood.

What do you all think?

[Rebop]

I wouldn't do it to my main bass, but if you don't mind having it look like you did it yourself then go for it. Shouldn't take too long either. I can't imagine 3 weeks unless you only have 10 minutes a day to work on it.

[Aerdna]

The whole thing took me 4 days. I used spirit varnish (mostly shellac) which cures a lot faster that oil.

[Bob Gollihur]

Go for it.

And let it take as long as it needs to take, so you get the result that will make you happiest.

[hdiddy]

Sweet. Yes I plan on taking my time... gonna go for a nice dark red/brown tea color.

zomg. I forgot I always wanted hat peg tuners. *droooool*

EDIT: Bah, I think I will go with Sloanes (Italian wing style from Gage). The screw holes sit right next and below the worm unlike the plates I currently have. I'll drill new holes but won't have to deal with the headache of drilling into old screw holes that have been filled. Hopefully the peg holes will fit swimmingly with the new tuners. I might change the end pin and tail piece while I'm at it .

[hdiddy]

Ok after extensive reading, it sounds like the process of doing a varnish is more artistic and less scientific... There's just so much information it gets a little overwhelming. But after reading, the actual process sounds pretty simple and just requires the ability to work with colors and alot of elbow grease - or am I mistaken?

I think I will test on scraps of wood first. I expect to use painting oils, waterlox, and naptha (which I already have). How much waterlox will I need? I expect to do at least 6-7 coats if not more.

Also: when sanding with 250 grit in between coats, do I do it in small circular motions or with the grain? And the final rubout too?

Oh yeah... Mr. Schnitzernberger once suggested that one could use a water-based stain before the ground coat. I was thinking of doing something like a red stain with a yellow ground coat. What water-based stain should I use?

[arnoldschnitzer]

If you sand between coats with something like 250 grit (actually there is 220 and 240) you will remove most of the varnish and sand through the color in spots. Try wet-sanding with 800 grit, lightly in circles. You'll likely need a pint of Waterlox. Also get some Liquin (art store) to emulsify the colors before you try to add them to the varnish. Make sure any artist colors you buy are highly rated for lightfastness. For the base color use powdered dyes in water. First raise the grain and then lightly sand with 240 or 400. Go lightly or you'll make a blotchy mess. Because Waterlox is very thin, plan on 10-20 coats if you are looking for a deep color. Finish with 2-3 clear coats. Good luck.

[christ andronis]

hdiddy....I applaud your willingness to take this on. I've been wanting to do this to my 2nd bass (a Strunal hybrid) for a while but just can't get the courage up to start it. I am severely "wood challenged" so I'm not even sure where to start. Anyone, is there a good resource out there (online or a book) that I would be able to see if it's something I should attempt? I'm talking about "First, you lay a tarp down, take off the strings...." sort of basic primer.

Good luck on your endeavor...post before/after pics.

[MollyKay]

Originally Posted by Bob Gollihur

Go for it.

And let it take as long as it needs to take, so you get the result that will make you happiest.

Originally Posted by arnoldschnitzer

Because Waterlox is very thin, plan on 10-20 coats if you are looking for a deep color. Finish with 2-3 clear coats. Good luck.

Yep…what Bob and Arnold said.

Take your time…let the coats dry before you start the next one or you could get sticky drag marks. If you are going dark it will take several coats. Build your color slowly with lighter color ground color coats (yellows, orange, and reds) that is where the warmth and glow comes from in the finish. If you go too dark to quick you lose the “depth” in your color. Waterlox can be thinned but what you thin it with will change the final sheen of the Waterlox…when you purchase Waterlox it comes in a high sheen or semi-matte (I think…it has been a few months). Also be prepare to buy the best artist colors, the dark shade and red can be really expensive…as much as $39.00 a tube…so be prepared. Material cost should be between $150-$250 and time…allow 2 to 3 weeks total consisting of two hours on a week night (for drying time) and a few hours on the weekend. The best light to judge the color is natural sunlight so take it outside for a true test of color accuracy.

Enjoy the journey…it can be very trying of your patience…but also a true sense of accomplishment!

[hdiddy]

Thanks for the words of encouragement guys. I feel a little crazy taking this on but this really is all about looks - which is important as I like being inspired by things I make noise with.

One last question: since I'm putting on 10 coats - (I'lll probably start darkening after 10-12 coats) how long should each take to dry? Overnight? And if I'm lucky and there is no dust, I dont' have to sand between coats, yes?

[arnoldschnitzer]

Drying will probably take 24 hours if it is not too humid. You will need some abrading between coats. You can use a gray nylon scrubbing pad when you only need a light deglossing, sand when you need deeper flattening. Oil varnish is not like lacquer, which melts into the previous coat. For best adhesion you want to slightly rough up the surface (and smooth it) so the next coat comes out nice and forms a coherent layer.

[Rebop]

I feel bad for sounding so cynical in my post. Just make sure you practice first on some scraps; you should be fine. I've personally seen a lot of horrible stuff, but then again I'm in South Florida and people fail a lot more around here than anywhere else, I'm certain.

[hdiddy]

LOL. Yeah I know, it's really tempting not to test first but I owe it to myself to do it on scraps. I'm going to toy with the colors on a paint program (GIMP) and do some translucency to see what the colors will layer like so at least I won't go in completely blind as to the final result. I'm going to see if I can preplan the color layers and see what I get. Maybe it's a useless exercise but at least it won't take 20 days to complete but rather 20 minutes.

As for drying, things tend to be dry here in San Francisco. Not alot of sun but I think it'll end up ok. Outside it's been drizzling alot but San Francisco summer is coming (usually in October) when things get warm and sunny.

Right now, the color choices is more what I'm worried about. I'm going for a antique like look so I'm thinking of throwing on a coat of black or brown in certain areas to see if I can intentionally get a good splotchy look or in the corners and such. I really like the look of Brian Bromberg's wood bass so I'll be trying for something like that. I've always been crazy about the old uneven colors with accents of black in the old basses. We'll see...

[MollyKay]

Originally Posted by hdiddy

Right now, the color choices is more what I'm worried about. I'm going for a antique like look so I'm thinking of throwing on a coat of black or brown in certain areas to see if I can intentionally get a good splotchy look or in the corners and such. I really like the look of Brian Bromberg's wood bass so I'll be trying for something like that. I've always been crazy about the old uneven colors with accents of black in the old basses. We'll see...

…beware of straight black from the tube, like lamp black. It will make the color dark but it will also deaden the color. If you mix the primary colors of red, yellow and blue together you can get a rich deep brown…keep adding blue and it will get darker (but more purple too, be careful). The dark umber and burnt umber are good dark colors as well…just be careful if you add black…it will flatten out the color quickly…this is from color theory class 101…primary colors are red, yellow and blue…add white to tint lighter and add black to shade darker. The same effect can be accomplished by using opposite colors such as green & red, orange & blue or yellow & purple.

Finally a subject I can actually talk about…I knew that art degree would come in handy some day.

Enjoy and be sure to post pictures as you go…we still have lots to learn!

[hdiddy]

Eep... one potential problem. I'm doing this in my garage which sits below the living areas in my house. Are the fumes going to be bad? Also, the heater (old school gravity fed) and the dryer (yay flying lint!) are also in the garage. I know the dust will be an issue and I'll probably avoid doing a new coat when it's about to be run.... but is it safe with the heater like so? Ventilation in the garage is so-so. I can clear the air out pretty easily. I'm sure the GF will complain. :lol: