Upgrades for better sound?

[Bassing around]

Hey all TBers,
this is my first post.

I recently got a humble Eurostring double bass from a music shop in Singapore (one of the few music shops here), and i was wondering if i should put some money into upgrading the parts that can be upgraded to produce a better sound. This bass will most likely stay with me for a long while so i am looking into optimizing the quality of the sound.

Any suggestions on which parts once upgraded can enhance the tone of the sound produced? Do list down the reason(s) why you believe so.

Thanks!
Calvin

[Cody Sisk]

If you're looking for drastic improvements at the level of instrument you bought, you're likely to be disappointed. Changes in setup will only make subtle changes in the sound.

If you do some reading here, there's a number of threads about different parts of the instrument: Endpins, tail wires, tailpieces, tuning machines, string choices, etc. Ideally you would find a good luthier and experiment but your choices might be limited based on where you live. Though I know very little about violin shops in Singapore. Perhaps someone here knows in which direction to point you..

[JtheJazzMan]

If youre new to contrabass then the best advice I can give is practice and patience.

It will take time to develop a good tone with your technique, and also your tastes in sound will develop over that time.

Then once you have developed you may want to explore different strings. The bridge will influence the string tone as well, though theres no hard and fast rules. (I prefer a hard aubert mirecourt bridge over softer standard bridges)

Other than that you may want to try a lighter endpin, or a marvin wire tailpiece.

But until youre sure you really need an upgrade, practice is cheap.

[fdeck]

On any bass, inexpensive or otherwise, I think it's a good idea to find out if a part is actually causing a problem before replacing it. Of course it's easy but expensive to try different strings. Another area to check is setup: String height and soundpost position are relatively easy to correct.

A book, "The setup and repair of the double bass for optimum sound" by Chuck Traeger is a worthwhile investment.

[fdeck]

Also, welcome to TB and to the world of the bass!

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Originally Posted by fdeck

Also, welcome to TB and to the world of the bass!

Francis, Francis, Francis You should be more responsible; welcoming a newbie with borderline Bass OCD to a future of living hell. You've been here long enough to see the symptoms: sleepless nights wondering whether that new tailgut wire or wooden endpin might open up the low end. Will a lighter tailpiece be better for pizz? Heck, maybe I'll ditch the tailpiece altogether. I should try a larger diameter, softer soundpost because I read that it might warm things up a bit. Although you don't show the symptoms, you have seen them in your bretheren. Lead not into temptation.

Calvin, of course this is all in jest!

Welcome to our world and all the best to you. I have found that different tailpiece cables, endpins, adjuster materials , afterlength and soundpost fit and position can have an audible effect on the basses I have tinkered with. Recently changing from nylon tailgut to aircraft cable and brass adjusters to aluminum showed gains in volume and clarity. Certainly strings are something to experiment with.

However, as our most illustrious Texan has said, the effects are subtle. One or more tweeks may improve the tone and playability of your bass but, after all the experiments are over, your bass won't be transformed into a significantly different instrument.

Probably the best thing you can do to improve a new bass is to play it. Then play it some more.

Also, most of your sound will come from your hands. As they strengthen and toughen up you will notice a significant improvement in your sound.

Enjoy it and welcome to our asylum!

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Originally Posted by JtheJazzMan

..............(I prefer a hard aubert mirecourt bridge over softer standard bridges)...............

What tonal differences have you noticed?

[JtheJazzMan]

The softer bridge makes my bass produce more mid range (around 2-4 kHz frequencies) Not a big deal when played pizz, but bowing on spiros turned my bass into an instrument of torture. The harder bridge makes the bow scratch much less noticeable to the ear, and much more pleasant.

The aubert mirecourt bridge makes a higher tone when you tap it (this was while it was a blank). It was higher than any of the other bridges the luthier had in his shop.

I think that hardness is the key to the frequency transmission, so Id guess the results should be similar on other basses.

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Interesting.
http://www.thebassshop.com/bass_accessories.html

I have heard that bridges that have been 'treated' sound better and the deluxe Aubert Mirecourt bridges are treated.
As I was told, the treatment involves soaking the bridge in a hardening solution. Smaller instrument bridges are more often treated, but it is costly and not justifiable for most bass bridges. Anton Krutz has a formula for a solution that can be brushed onto the bridge when it is on or off the instrument which he claims makes a significant improvement. The only downside he claims is the foul odor of rotten eggs. I suspect sulfer.

The quality and cut of wood is also much improved on the Mirecourt bridges; this raising the cost significantly.

Your comments regarding bowing spiros on your bass are very interesting. It was so troublesome on my bass that I finally gave up. My bass has a very clear, middy character with any string I have tried. This makes it great for pizz but arco is another matter. The bridge is an unmarked, plain grain bridge. I may just try a Mirecourt bridge.

Thank you.

[Bassing around]

Thanks all for the advice!

There's so much to learn about the double bass, it just blow my mind!
I think i might get the endpin changed, and see where i go from there.

This forum is awesome! (:

[buddyro57]

I think the advice from Dallas Strings is key; you should find a good luthier first- before doing anything to the bass. Locate the best upright bassist in Singapore (maybe the principal in a symphony orchestra or the bass professor in a university) and get a referral. I think that's your best first move.
JS

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Calvin,

The endpin is connected to the tailpiece wire. The tailpiece wire is connected to the tailpiece. Ever hear the tune about the ankle bone, leg bone, hip bone, etc.?

A good luthier can tell you whether a better endpin will improve the sound of your bass. Unless your current pin is slipping, a better one sure isn't going to change that.

[bigolbassguy]

If you can afford it - replace those crappy chinese strings. Just about anything else will be better. It will also encourage you to practice more. Of course - if you're new to DB, even changing the strings can damage your bass, so do some research to make sure you do it properly - and be prepared for some tired hands

[Andrew McGregor]

Yep: make sure the soundpost is set right first, strings second, tailpiece cable third, bridge fourth, and don't bother about the rest on a cheap instrument unless it needs changing for mechanical reasons.

So, to be clear, don't mess with the endpin unless it isn't stable.

[JtheJazzMan]

Originally Posted by clink

Interesting.
http://www.thebassshop.com/bass_accessories.html

I have heard that bridges that have been 'treated' sound better and the deluxe Aubert Mirecourt bridges are treated.
As I was told, the treatment involves soaking the bridge in a hardening solution. Smaller instrument bridges are more often treated, but it is costly and not justifiable for most bass bridges. Anton Krutz has a formula for a solution that can be brushed onto the bridge when it is on or off the instrument which he claims makes a significant improvement. The only downside he claims is the foul odor of rotten eggs. I suspect sulfer.

The quality and cut of wood is also much improved on the Mirecourt bridges; this raising the cost significantly.

Your comments regarding bowing spiros on your bass are very interesting. It was so troublesome on my bass that I finally gave up. My bass has a very clear, middy character with any string I have tried. This makes it great for pizz but arco is another matter. The bridge is an unmarked, plain grain bridge. I may just try a Mirecourt bridge.

Thank you.

Makes you wonder what would happen if you put a whole unvarnished bass into a chamber full of aerosolised hardener. Or something to artificially age the wood.

Hmm ideas, ideas.

[bass_snake]

Originally Posted by Andrew McGregor

Yep: make sure the soundpost is set right first, strings second, tailpiece cable third, bridge fourth, and don't bother about the rest on a cheap instrument unless it needs changing for mechanical reasons.

So, to be clear, don't mess with the endpin unless it isn't stable.

I' ll keep this in mind. I' m in a process of making my upright bass sound the best it can produce myself. I' m thinking of replacing the tail gut into an aircraft cable one.

Fred

[franzose]

You can try to use a carbon fiber endpin rod like this one for instance : http://www.uptonbass.com/Carbonfiber-Bass-endpin/

I did that and it opened up the sound of my DB in a very good way (I could not believe it make such a difference). For the price, it's worth a try

[bass_snake]

Cool! I should check that out. My end pin kinda moves a bit even when I lock it.