Wooden endpin

[LouisF]

Here's an interesting (to me anyway) factor -- I generally use Johnny Atomic wood pins or a carbon fibre pin on my basses. On another bass I was using in rehearsal briefly, I pulled out the extremely long and heavy metal rod and the Atomic I use when playing standing up.

Instead of the usual "opening up" I get with the lighter pin, the bass seemed totally anemic. Then I realized it had one of those Wittner "space age" tail pieces. I think in this case the combination of light pin and TP worked against the bass and I put the long rod back in to gain mass back in the sound.

Louis

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by LouisF

Then I realized it had one of those Wittner "space age" tail pieces.

= heavy?

I just made my tailpiece a bit lighter, just trying to see what that will do to the sound, as I indicated in another thread. I'm pretty sure the stiff tailpiece setup I had before was choking up the sound a bit.

George

[Jack Clark]

Originally Posted by swingingoodtime

Ergo: "I reckon go for the bodgy rig" = "I suggest you have no hesitation in rigging together a structure of questionable quality and permanence..."

Ah. Something we might call jerry-rigged over here. Yep, that's what I have in mind. Won't be able to pursue this until Friday, though. Let you know what happens.

Edit: Well, I installed a solid maple dowel this weekend, and I can't say I notice any difference at all in the sound. Maybe it's because the endpins are about 16" (~40cm) long, I dunno. But I like the looks of it better, anyway.

[LouisF]

The Witner is very light, and the Atomic endpin has a hollow aluminum core (which unlike the long steel rod) only goes a couple of inches up into the bass. I think (guess) there needs to be some mass somewhere to vibrate, but the combination of the two - light TP and light EP - on this bass anyway, made for a noticeably more anemic sound.

LF

[swingingoodtime]

Originally Posted by George700DL

Foster's?

Fosters? You gotta be kidding me!

Sorry, George; no offence! But Fosters (Lager) is, well... swill. Actually, that's a bit harsh. It's just very... ordinary. I'll admit, there was a time when it was drunk quite frequently down here (late 70's, early 80's), but fortunately the Australian beer palate has matured somewhat since to much better stuff and the local makers have kept pace (James Squire Amber Ale or Golden Ale, for example. (insert Homer-esque aaarrghhhh-beeeerr noises here) Or any number of other boutique beers. (Gotta admit though; I don't care for Tasmanian beer; way too florally. Kinda makes me feel like it should have a paper umbrella in it))

We still have good old reliable yobbo-beers (VB, for instance). But Fosters is like Jacob's Creek wine; it 's the stuff we won't drink, so we send it all overseas instead. (Sorry folks!)

(I guess I should qualify that both the Fosters & Jacobs Creek companies make other stuff that is, in fact, very good. We just don't tell you about it, because if anyone's going to get smashed off their t!ts drinking it, we'd rather it be us than anyone else)

As for XXXX; that's the stuff we send overseas because we won't drink it, but really wouldn't be surprised to find that you weren't drinking it either...

[George700DL]

Originally Posted by swingingoodtime

Fosters? You gotta be kidding me!

Sorry, George; no offence! But Fosters (Lager) is, well... swill. Actually, that's a bit harsh. It's just very... ordinary. I'll admit, there was a time when it was drunk quite frequently down here (late 70's, early 80's), but fortunately the Australian beer palate has matured somewhat since to much better stuff and the local makers have kept pace (James Squire Amber Ale or Golden Ale, for example. (insert Homer-esque aaarrghhhh-beeeerr noises here) Or any number of other boutique beers. (Gotta admit though; I don't care for Tasmanian beer; way too florally. Kinda makes me feel like it should have a paper umbrella in it))

We still have good old reliable yobbo-beers (VB, for instance). But Fosters is like Jacob's Creek wine; it 's the stuff we won't drink, so we send it all overseas instead. (Sorry folks!)

(I guess I should qualify that both the Fosters & Jacobs Creek companies make other stuff that is, in fact, very good. We just don't tell you about it, because if anyone's going to get smashed off their t!ts drinking it, we'd rather it be us than anyone else)

As for XXXX; that's the stuff we send overseas because we won't drink it, but really wouldn't be surprised to find that you weren't drinking it either...

I know, I fully realize that what's on TV doesn't reflect reality I just wanted to hear you say "smashed off their t!ts".

My family comes from the Czech Republic, so Plzen ("Pilsner") is the norm. But I actually prefer the more local Yuengling.

George

[basswraith]

Here is a maple endpin we made back in Texas for Jeff Bradetich's Guadagnini during Thanksgiving week. Julie Vinsant from FortWorth Symphony turned this maple on her lathe. We had some help from Joel MacMillan as well. It took allot of thought to get it just right. The length had to be just right. The pin fits into a Lignum socket we used from old wood my grandfather gave me. He used it to make Judge's gavels.
All fits were tappered just in case we had to go a modern endpin. We stained the maple to compliment the color of the bass. In the end it looked like the bass and endpin could have come from the same shop.
Jeff was using a broom stick before this. I think this was a step up..and yes it did have a positive effect on sound.

Michael Hartery

[swingingoodtime]

Wow, that's cool. Although, it seems quite fat compared to the usual stick-config', but I'm guessing it still weighs less than a metal endpin? (Particularly as, if it's fixed, there's no extra 'retracted' section to add weight).

A step up from the wooden-broomstick sound, or the original metal EP? If the former, then that intrigues me...

[Karl Beck]

Hi there I just posted a reply with pictures for your drumstick end pin question, I hope it helps
I have experimented with various types of end pins and I can tell you that nothing beats a maple or hickory
drumstick. I changed ( on my plywood bass ) a spruce sound post to a oak hard wood sound post and a metal end pin to a wooden ( drum stick ) one and the sound change was incredible....
I also added one to my 1920 carved Juzek ( just the end pin )and it just made it louder....

[nickidame]

Originally Posted by swingingoodtime

Reviving an older thread here, but...

I'd be interested in hearing people's thoughts (on the endpin difference, not my crappy playing! I've only been learning for

Attached are pizz mp3's; will post arco's next.

My computer here is set up for sound editing... So, I'm very used to comparing tone.

Because of the (relative) complexity of the piece. The audio samples were difficult to evaluate - For my purposes, I would have preferred to listen to an open "A" string.

Then you could have checked for measurable things like tremolo and decay.

The arco samples (IMO) were difficult to weigh.

However, the pizzicato samples were (to my ear) much easier to distinguish.

The wooden version seemed a little richer and more well-rounded. The tone was a little more "plummy". The sustain also seemed to be a little muted which gave it (not surprisingly) a more acoustic quality.

The metal version had a little more brightness (shimmer) - I didn't measure it on a scope, but I'd lay odds that the decay was longer.... I'd also take a bet that if you looked on scope, the "attack" would be a little sharper.

How much of this is because of the raw qualities of the pin... and how much is due to the physical feedback from your instrument (that you respond to and which in turn causes you to modify your playing) is impossible to say.

But I guess it's a moot point.

Anyway, for what it's worth on the pizz... I hear a difference.

N.

[swingingoodtime]

Hi Nichola,

Thanks for that; useful feedback that's much appreciated. I agree; I find the metal pin gives more low-end 'umph', whereas the wood pin is more about tone. Not sure which I like better. Interestingly, the wood pin flexes slightly, and I can get a low freq resonant wobble going in it; about 3-4 Hz. Not sure if this affects anything; it technically shouldn't but then I can't tell if there are any harmonics of this that are at play. Could be. I'd be interested to try a CF pin to reduce both weight and flex.