Can I Talk GC Down From Their Price?

[Kmonk]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

Handyman: NO, it has to do with MAP pricing. I explained this.

It is against the law for a company to say a store has to sell something at a given price.

About not seeing them as a "Friend", you're dead on. Never look at them as being your buddy. They are a commission based salesman and can be written up for not meeting the "fade point". Do this several months in a row and you're gone.

Ever wonder why they push the Pro Coverage so hard? If the sales guy does hit a certain "PC attachment rate" he looses 1% commission.

In 2007, the Supreme Court ruled in the case of LEEGIN CREATIVE LEATHER PRODUCTS, INC. v. PSKS, INC., dba KAY'S KLOSET that manufacturers and retailers can enter into "minimum selling price agreements".

[Herrick]

Originally Posted by dhagler

My local GC has a Fender Mexican 70s Jazz Bass, ash body with maple neck and black blocks and binding, listed at either $849.99 or $899.99. I looked at the tag and saw that it became part of their inventory in April 2012. I also looked at the current Fender offerings and that bass is no longer listed in that color. So, I'm thinking to myself, "Self, you could offer them $600 cash and walk out with that bass."

I think that if the bass is no longer made in that color, then it would be more desirable/rare & worth a bit more...unless it'a a color most people dislike and it's been sitting in the store for a long time.

Got2SadowskyNYC that was an interesting post. I always wondered how that worked out.

[mjac28]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

edbass. The situation you described is BLATANTLY against policy and the manger can get in some major hot water with the district manager and corporate.

Allowing the use of a coupon on a brand that has specified that they want to be excluded can cost GC the vendor. They take this VERY seriously. Some stores have being put out of business getting caught doing this.

I get those deals over the phone all the time when I complain and Guitar Center isn't worried about most vendors because being the biggest chain of it's type carries some weight. I agree with your other points.

[Marley's Ghost]

Originally Posted by msaone

1.6 billion? Which congressman does their books?

They are owned by Bain capital.

And that's all I am going to say. Google is your friend.

[Durockrolly]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

GC doesn't haggle the price. They can offer a coupon, price match a competitor, use a competitor's coupon etc.

Price matching is not common because of a thing called "minimum advertised price" or MAP. This happens all the time. Notice that an Apple product is the same price where ever you go? Electronics, certain brands of clothing etc. are the same. The item is MAPed.

A company can not tell a retailer what they can sell something for. This is called price fixing and is illegal. They can tell a retailer what the MAP is. This is perfectly legal. It's in the store's best interest to sell at MAP because it keeps what is usually a very low profit margin intact. In Fender's case the store is generally making about 20% of the tagged price. (Tagged price and suggested retail price are different.)

They shouldn't match with sales tax included, because this is not part of the selling price. Blame your state and city for this. Some stores may do it but it is against the GC policy. People can get written up and possibly fired for it.

They can take freight into account, but this usually is not in the customer's favor because of MAP. For example let's say something is $100 less online but there's a $50 freight change. You'll only get a price match $50 discount.

Keep in mind that when you use a coupon, price match etc. that the sales guy is payed based on commission. Although some of the commission is based of the actually selling price, the bulk of the sales guy's pay is based off the profit (that 20% I mentioned above). Depending on when he was hired he's getting either 7% or 10% of the profit. So when you go for a deal you're actually taking money out of someones pocket. Someone you probably would call a "friend".

A note about Will's claim that they are $1.6 Billion in debt.

GC and it's sister companies are one of the largest PRIVATELY held companies in the USA. This information is either made up by him or someone else. If it's actually true, then someone has violated a confidentiality clauses in their employment contract and can be sued. Since there is rumor that GC is wanting to go public, this would be called insider information it's illegal to disclose at this time.

Just so you know, I worked for GC for almost 2 years. I recently quit. I will be happy to answer any questions about their policies. After my time there I refuse to do business with them. It wasn't a pleasant experience.

This is true!

[Not yet]

Originally Posted by Kmonk

Not anymore. I have a good friend who has been a manager with GC for more than 10 years. He told me that over a year ago they stopped negotiating prices. They use Ebay and other resources to decided prices on used gear and stick to it pretty firmly. The selling prices on new gear is often times dictated by the manufacturer. I also had managers at 2 other locations tell me the same thing. You might be able to get 10% off but there is no way they are going to take $300 off of a $900 bass. In fact, even if they try to give you a discount, their computer system limits how much of a discount a manager can approve. I returned a defective item that I purchased online for $129. The current price is $249. When the manager tried to sell me the replacement at a price of $129 the computer wouldn't let him take more than $45 off of the $249 price. I watched the entire process and saw a message pop up that stated that the maximum discount was $45. I had to call customer service and get them to do it. The reason GC put store level limits in place is because in the past many employees were giving deep discounts to friends and family members and sometimes giving discounts to other customers in order to make a sale and reach their sales goal.

Just did it a month ago, 100% wrong

[Not yet]

And FYI there's MAP pricing and Unilateral.... Big difference depending on brand and line w/in a MFG

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

And we found the lawyer.

Let me clarify because I didn't know I was going to have to put on my legalese cap. They Can come up with a contract, BUT they can NOT as a matter of selling their require the retailer to sell at a price. The kicker is the CONTRACT. Out side of a the contract they can't.

I don't know of one company, other than some "prestige" lines, that have this clause in the dealer agreement. All dealer agreements have MAP pricing clauses, save some very small companies. These companies can't do business with GC because they can't produce the numbers that GC requires.

Yes GC does have some sway with vender because of it's size. This is why they can get limited exclusive pedals (like the golden cello) or special colors of guitars or amps etc. There are somethings venders will not tolerate. For example, Apple and Bose are ALWAYS on the excluded list. Do you really think they care about GC? The people that are going to buy their products will regardless.

Also, these are very low margin brands so it's in the stores best interest to not allow coupons. Apple's profit margin is about 10%. There ain't no room for coupons once you figure the store had to pay to ship it to retail.

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

Bain Capital doesn't OWN GC. Never did. They did prop the company up several years ago through capital investments (i.e. loans) because it was about to go under. It's standing on it's own now.

If GC would have defaulted on the loans then Bain would have taken it. Remember Mars Music? It's what happen to them.

[Not yet]

For those really interested look into unilateral pricing, it is not a contract as much as cost structure that dealers choose to participate in or not... And can be dependent on specific product lines

And don't have a lawyer hat. At the end of the day GC business model supports deal making like a used car lot... It makes good sense to take advantage of it for yourself.... Or showroom and buy new product on ebay. It your money

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

Not Yet. Again, as I've stated 3 times now, just because you were allowed to do it doesn't means it's not against company policy.

No one is allowed to make "deals" period. You can be written up and fired for this including the guy that made you this deal. Private message me the store and the name of the associate and I'll forward the info on to the district manager over that store. You can go back in about a week or so and see if you get that special deal. You won't.

If you can get away with going 100MPH in a school zone doesn't mean it's legal to do so.

[Not yet]

Get right on it.... I'll make sure to pay sticker on next car I buy too. You may be right, I may be right, but enough... Time to get into fearful bashing now

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

Be careful buying new product on eBay. If it's not an authorized dealer the company will not honor the warranty. Read the warranty card if you don't believe me. The first question they will as you if you call will be "Where did you buy it?" If you say eBay it's end of discussion with very few exceptions. You can know the legit dealers by the price because it's the same as what you'd have at a store.

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

I am 100% right.

I was one of the top sales people in my store consistently. Sometimes even the top. I was in the top 20% of the sales guys in the chain. I was finally gaining on the top 10% when I left. I was knocking down about $30,000 a year. That's a lot of gear seeing as I was in a smaller store. I was in line for management.

I hated the place so I left before I got any deeper. So much so that I won't even shop there. The crap and stress ain't worth the money.

That said, I'm pretty sure I know the policies better than you.

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

Oh. One other way to get an instant 10% off is trade in anything.

Here's a funny loop hole in the trade discount. You don't have to accept their offer to get the 10% off. Some stores may require you to, but according to the policy the discount is NOT contingent on you accepting their offer. It's not something they advertise, but I personally let several customers do this if it meant closing the deal.

And this is REALLY funny. You can trade in a Boss DS1 that they may give you $5 bucks for and you can get 10% off a $3000 Les Paul. You just got $305 for a Boss DS1. In this case, it's worth spending $20 on a new one for sole purpose of trading it in.

Every 3 months or so they do a "Trade in Expo" the discount is raised to 15%.

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

GC doesn't haggle the price. They can offer a coupon, price match a competitor, use a competitor's coupon etc.

Price matching is not common because of a thing called "minimum advertised price" or MAP. This happens all the time. Notice that an Apple product is the same price where ever you go? Electronics, certain brands of clothing etc. are the same. The item is MAPed.

A company can not tell a retailer what they can sell something for. This is called price fixing and is illegal. They can tell a retailer what the MAP is. This is perfectly legal. It's in the store's best interest to sell at MAP because it keeps what is usually a very low profit margin intact. In Fender's case the store is generally making about 20% of the tagged price. (Tagged price and suggested retail price are different.)

They shouldn't match with sales tax included, because this is not part of the selling price. Blame your state and city for this. Some stores may do it but it is against the GC policy. People can get written up and possibly fired for it.

They can take freight into account, but this usually is not in the customer's favor because of MAP. For example let's say something is $100 less online but there's a $50 freight change. You'll only get a price match $50 discount.

Keep in mind that when you use a coupon, price match etc. that the sales guy is payed based on commission. Although some of the commission is based of the actually selling price, the bulk of the sales guy's pay is based off the profit (that 20% I mentioned above). Depending on when he was hired he's getting either 7% or 10% of the profit. So when you go for a deal you're actually taking money out of someones pocket. Someone you probably would call a "friend".

A note about Will's claim that they are $1.6 Billion in debt.

GC and it's sister companies are one of the largest PRIVATELY held companies in the USA. This information is either made up by him or someone else. If it's actually true, then someone has violated a confidentiality clauses in their employment contract and can be sued. Since there is rumor that GC is wanting to go public, this would be called insider information it's illegal to disclose at this time.

Just so you know, I worked for GC for almost 2 years. I recently quit. I will be happy to answer any questions about their policies. After my time there I refuse to do business with them. It wasn't a pleasant experience.

GCs financials are made available to the public. http://biz.yahoo.com/e/120327/142755310-k.html And they will offer discounts to anyone with the balls to ask.

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

They generally will not do deals on used items until 90 days after the buy in date, but this is at the manger's discretion. If you want 10% off of something that's only been there for 10 days you're not gonna get it. Most things don't make it this long.

Again, you have to have the balls to ask. I never fail to get a discount.

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

edbass. The situation you described is BLATANTLY against policy and the manger can get in some major hot water with the district manager and corporate.

Allowing the use of a coupon on a brand that has specified that they want to be excluded can cost GC the vendor. They take this VERY seriously. Some stores have being put out of business getting caught doing this.

No they haven't. They can and do offer discounts every day to those willing to ask.

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

I am 100% right.

I was one of the top sales people in my store consistently. Sometimes even the top. I was in the top 20% of the sales guys in the chain. I was finally gaining on the top 10% when I left. I was knocking down about $30,000 a year. That's a lot of gear seeing as I was in a smaller store. I was in line for management.

I hated the place so I left before I got any deeper. So much so that I won't even shop there. The crap and stress ain't worth the money.

That said, I'm pretty sure I know the policies better than you.

Nope. Just walked out of GC today with a 15% discount on QSC gear. Lots of it.

With all due respect to your experience with GC, you're just making stuff up.......

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

Bain Capital doesn't OWN GC. Never did. They did prop the company up several years ago through capital investments (i.e. loans) because it was about to go under. It's standing on it's own now.

If GC would have defaulted on the loans then Bain would have taken it. Remember Mars Music? It's what happen to them.

Look at the notes of the summary financials I posted. A subsidiary of Bain owns 100% of GC.

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by dhagler

My local GC has a Fender Mexican 70s Jazz Bass, ash body with maple neck and black blocks and binding, listed at either $849.99 or $899.99. I looked at the tag and saw that it became part of their inventory in April 2012. I also looked at the current Fender offerings and that bass is no longer listed in that color. So, I'm thinking to myself, "Self, you could offer them $600 cash and walk out with that bass."

Based on your experience, do you think GC will bite?

I don't think you'll get that much of a discount, but you'll certainly get something.

[mjac28]

And that's the sound of the thread closing.......

[Mojo-Man]

I have never payed full price on any bass I ever bought from GC. New or used.
As some people have said, online discounts. Musician Friend prices 15% to20% off.
If I'm buying from GC I always bring cash.
I request the manager, an offer a cash price.
8 out of 10 time they accept offer. Another thing is go the last few days of any month. The need to make monthly quota's.
The are more likely to say no the first week of any month.
I've gone in offered a price on a bass, been turned down.
Gone back a few days later, offer accepted. In any deal, someone needs to be willing to walk.