Can you just say your [bleep] message without swearing?

[peteroberts]

This is a long overdue rant.

You know, I don't claim to be a saint, in fact the occasional f-bomb gets dropped in my vicinity, sometimes to drive home a point among friends, but not really that often.

Not compared to some of the songs I hear today. Not even close.

In the '60's and '70's (well, early '70s anyways, 80s even) there were some very strong messages conveyed in the music, and people hardly said 'damn' or 'hell' in their songs. (remember the Pretenders' "Precious" in 1979? Totally shocking!) I know, things were different back then, but that's another story (why?). Nowadays, mf gets tossed around like it's an everyday word. I went to a concert not too long ago, and the opener was a rap/hip hop group and I swear, they said mf 5 or 6 times before they even started their first song!!!

Someone please explain to me why this is 'cool'... I don't get it

[JimmyM]

You don't have to get it. The audience that buys it gets it. The audience that doesn't get it isn't of any concern to them. And quite frankly, why should it? The last thing I would ever want as a songwriter is someone telling me I can't use bad language in my songs.

Not that I use it in the songs I write, but I'm producing (slowly but it's getting done) a guy who comes to my little home studio that writes songs that I think are hilarious, but he uses foul language and scatological references, and though some of his lyrics make me squirm a little, he's doing his music the best way he knows how. I would never dream of saying, "You can't say that in your song," because not only is it not my job to force a value system on him, I know his answer would be, "I just did and I'm not changing it." And he shouldn't have to.

Just remember, you always have the choice of listening or not listening. If you hear something that offends you, turn it off.

[peteroberts]

good point. Music is so personal that it depends on the person making it.

[slapcracklepop]

Music comes from the heart, its about expressing. If I want to tell my audience how angry I am, or whatever, I think a swear will bluntly put it in their minds alot better than any other words. Can you do it without swears? Sure, but if your expressing yourself and thats how you feel, why should someone censor the way you feel, your art, your music..

[hyperlitem]

your turning into your parents

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by slapcracklepop

Music comes from the heart, its about expressing. If I want to tell my audience how angry I am, or whatever, I think a swear will bluntly put it in their minds alot better than any other words. Can you do it without swears? Sure, but if your expressing yourself and thats how you feel, why should someone censor the way you feel, your art, your music..

"Sure, but if your expressing yourself and thats how you feel, why should someone censor the way you feel, your art, your music"

Because it encroaches on parental rights to keep thier kids from being exposed to vulgar language. Monkey see, monkey do!

A writer should not be censored but the media owes it to the general public to not broadcast offensive language.

Recordings should, generally, not be censored. They should be censored against exposing an unwilling society to socially condemned content if they are to be broadcast by the media.

Your opinion may differ.

[tplyons]

Music did fine without them for centuries. But sure, it's all about expression and a lot of music is getting angrier and angrier.

Doing a radio show is stuff, about half the 12 GB on my computer have words that can't be played on the air.

[cheezewiz]

It is just part of hip hop culture. It's just one of many things that makes hip hop culture appear moronic to old farts like me.

[Blackbird]

Originally Posted by cheezewiz

It is just part of hip hop culture. It's just one of many things that makes hip hop culture appear moronic to old farts like me.

I find it interesting that when thinking about foul language, hip hop was the first thing that came to your mind...

for want of a better smiley...

[bassmonkeee]

Originally Posted by pkr2

"Sure, but if your expressing yourself and thats how you feel, why should someone censor the way you feel, your art, your music"

Because it encroaches on parental rights to keep thier kids from being exposed to vulgar language. Monkey see, monkey do!

A writer should not be censored but the media owes it to the general public to not broadcast offensive language.

Recordings should, generally, not be censored. They should be censored against exposing an unwilling society to socially condemned content if they are to be broadcast by the media.

Your opinion may differ.

Encroaching on parental rights? Perhaps parents should pay closer attention to what their kids are listening to so my 32 year old ears aren't subjected to watered down product simply because Joe Parent can't bother to supervise his kid's intake.

You don't want your kids watching bad content on tv? Use the channel blockers that are common place these days.

Records with bad language have warning stickers. TV shows with bad language have ratings. TVs have v-chips. At what point is it no longer society's problem, and simply lazy parenting?

If, at the end of the day, you still can't escape naughty words on tv, or the radio, simply turn the stupid thing off, and make your kids read a book.

[cheezewiz]

Originally Posted by Blackbird

I find it interesting that when thinking about foul language, hip hop was the first thing that came to your mind...

for want of a better smiley...

Bird...I'm not sure what you mean. I definitely don't like what you are implying and think it is completely unwarranteed. Look at the original post. The poster referred to a hip hop/rap group he just saw. THAT, is what I was responding to.

[gottawalk]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

You don't have to get it. The audience that buys it gets it. The audience that doesn't get it isn't of any concern to them. And quite frankly, why should it?

Just remember, you always have the choice of listening or not listening. If you hear something that offends you, turn it off.

I agree that censorship is not way to handle music and art in general, but your statement of why should the audience that "doesn't get it" be concerned bothers me. Some of those people have children that will be exposed to that style of music or art and it behooves the parents and guardians to be informed and "concerned" so that they can steer their children in the values that they hold dear, but not totally censor things from the children without knowing what they're censoring. That's just beng ignorant, not being a guiding influence.

If you don't know, or understand something, you can't talk intelligently about it to kids.

So, yes, even the audience that "doesn't get it" need to be concerned about it.

[bigbeefdog]

Originally Posted by bassmonkeee

If, at the end of the day, you still can't escape naughty words on tv, or the radio, simply turn the stupid thing off, and make your kids read a book.

I'd love to.

Maybe you can tell me how I could "simply turn the stupid thing off" the 8-10 times I've been pumping gas into my car, with my (small) kids in the back seat, and some moron pulls up into the station with his boom-boom car stereo blasting "MF this, MF that"?

Or the time I took my kids into Circuit City, and had to ask the manager to have the same sort of crap turned off of the Sirius satellite radio display?

What you care to listen to in your own private space is fine. When it becomes unavoidable in public, then yes, it is "society's problem".

BTW, it is very telling that you consider it "watered down product" if the foul language ISN'T present....

[Matt Till]

It's the easiest way to let your parents know how angry you are.

[Mitchell Royce]

Originally Posted by tplyons

Music did fine without them for centuries. But sure, it's all about expression and a lot of music is getting angrier and angrier.

BS.

Music has just expressed anger in different ways. As far back as we can tell there's been music and poetry with lyrics that were far more vulgar than what you can hear in most gangster rap. The Romans were absolute masters of that art. Incest, bestiality, calling someone a homosexual and all others sorts of very vulgar things could come up in a single poem. The dis is not a recent invention.

I can understand that parents are concerned about their kids getting exposed to music with swearing(or swearing in general) but it's gonna happen one way or the oher. And no, that's not a sign of society's failure but part of the human experience everyone on this earth goes through. What a parent can do is to make clear the impact of uttering such a word and to instill some common sense in their children.

I would post references but that TB rule about no link leading to foul language prevents me from doing so. If anyone wants them, PM me.

[MODNY]

****?

[dancehallclasher]

Originally Posted by bigbeefdog

I'd love to.

Maybe you can tell me how I could "simply turn the stupid thing off" the 8-10 times I've been pumping gas into my car, with my (small) kids in the back seat, and some moron pulls up into the station with his boom-boom car stereo blasting "MF this, MF that"?

Or the time I took my kids into Circuit City, and had to ask the manager to have the same sort of crap turned off of the Sirius satellite radio display?

What you care to listen to in your own private space is fine. When it becomes unavoidable in public, then yes, it is "society's problem".

Society's problem, maybe. The artist's problem, no. Art has always mirrored life, and these people sing the way they speak. The times they are a-changing, and eventually people will realize that words cannot hurt you, and therefore there is nothing intrinsically bad about them. Until then, you have to deal with cursing and we have to deal with whining.

oh well.

[MJ5150]

When cussing is no longer seen as a way to express powerful emotions, then people will stop doing it. Until then, get used to it. I don't like it any more than you do.

-Mike

[bigbeefdog]

Originally Posted by dancehallclasher

Society's problem, maybe. The artist's problem, no. Art has always mirrored life, and these people sing the way they speak.

Exactly the problem. They sing the way they speak, and in both cases, they seem to have no respect for those within earshot who don't care to hear this sort of speak, or have their kids hear it.

Originally Posted by dancehallclasher

The times they are a-changing, and eventually people will realize that words cannot hurt you, and therefore there is nothing intrinsically bad about them. Until then, you have to deal with cursing and we have to deal with whining.

oh well.

Obviously you don't have children. Should you choose to one day, just wait until one of them goes to school and utters one of these words that you say there's nothing "intrinsically bad" about, a word they heard in a song. You'll get called to the school office, and then have to take a day or two off of work, without pay, to sit home with the child while they serve their suspension.

When you grow up, you'll understand. And your opinion will change - trust me.

[MAJOR METAL]

Originally Posted by tplyons

But sure, it's all about expression and a lot of music is getting angrier and angrier..

I tottaly agree Tim but i wonder what is going on with us as a society that is causing this.