how important is image?

[uethanian]

here's a more philosophical question for you guys...

how important for image is image?

my personal thoughts: i think today, especially in the jazz world, there's a lot of musicians who just have the label of "great player." its not false, but look at it this way; the listener doesnt want to hear a group of "great players," he wants to hear a BAND. a band with style, individualism, a connotation, a mood...

for example, take marcus miller and stu hamm. i dont know about you guys, but i think marcus miller has style. the way he dresses, how he moves on stage, even his instrument (but lets not get into endorsement). stu hamm, on the other hand, isnt exactly wat you'd call "cool." miles davis was "cool." but stu hamm, not so much. now im not saying which guy is a better player (because im sure a lot of u would say stu), but take into account their successes. u could probably know who marcus miller is even if ur not a bass player. and he's pretty darn influential in jazz right now.

its kindof like, if ur in a metal band, u want to look and act the part. its simply better entertainment, and more convincing. but most people dont buy into guys who consider themselves to be "virtuosos" and "great players." so i ask, when ur a professional entertainer, is it too much to ask for to have a concept for your art?

[RWP]

IMHO, image is VERY important.

[John123z]

Unfortunately, image is even more important than talent. That's why all the really big money performers have carefully crafted images. Especially in the Hip Hop field. Hell, even the sports world is doing the same.

[alfredpunkjazz]

Image it is something important. But it is more important to use it as a tool and not use the music as the tool to achieve an image.

I hate to see guys that go to their gigs with the pijama or something like that... I mean, yeah, it's their act, but that only achieves disctraction from the audience from the main point of a gig.

[IanStephenson]

The main point of the gig is for the audience to home happy. Image is part of doing that - even if you don't like to hear that as a musician.

Interesting Stu Hamm was mentioned - I read an interview years back, and apparently he auditioned for Madonna. He didn't get the gig, presumably cause she didn't want a fat geeky looking guy on stage.

My wife really likes Stu's music - she's not into instrumental/muso stuff at all, but does like his stuff. She prefers Stu to Victor Wootens stuff, but when she saw the Satriani SF DVD she specifically said she was disapointed that Stu didn't look as cool as he sounded, and that Victor looked way better.

ian

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by uethanian

so i ask, when ur a professional entertainer, is it too much to ask for to have a concept for your art?

When you put it this way, I would have to agree completely. But for me, the key phrase would be "...for your art". Because one can be far more effective as an artist if one has a complete concept to get across, i.e. graphic identity, name of band, lyrical content of music, signature sound, any poetry or spoken word content to the songs, point of view, etc. etc. As long as it's used cohesively, consistently...and comes across as authentic & genuine - not used simply as a superficial affectation...

MM

[CamMcIntyre]

I have to say, yes image is important. It is one aspect that i am working on this semester [not thru school, but yeah].

I feel that image is important in both rock/pop & jazz, but in a different way. In rock/pop i think the physical side [body type/size, hair, general look] matter quite a bit to help get the audience to be more attracted to them.

Easy example for me-i've got a gig coming up at the Elbo Room here in Chicago where i'm playing in a rock group. The other 2 guys are rail thin emo-type guys.....i'm a chunky, long hair. For that show-i'm dressing typical rock show for me [black t-shirt, decent jeans....NOT tight jeans], but i know we aren't gonna quite look the same/together. Will this matter much for this show? I'm going to say not so much. If we were trying to get a following *as a band*-very possibly. However, with these guys i function as an on-call sideman.

Jazz-depends on when/where/and the kind of gig. Is it wall paper/dinner music? Everyone should be dressed similar-probably tuxes or nice suites, but i don't think body type/physical image matters as much. Is it at the Green Mill, Velvet Lounge, etc? Nah, as long as they can play.

To summarize-i believe that audience and venue have a lot to do with how much image matters and in what way.

[Munjibunga]

Excuse me. Where's the carrots? Invalid poll.

[Unrepresented]

Image is important.

It's why a dive bar only gets regulars and the "hip" dive bar gets scenesters.

The difference isn't in the tallboy cans of PBR they're serving or the dated dark interiors. It's the perception of value.

Same reason everyone's working hard to get pieces of printed paper or numbers on their computer screens.

Image doesn't mean that you're slickly packaged and perfectly groomed. Image simply means you've convinced someone that you're a product that they want.

[bigfatbass]

I voted, but not feeling it without carrots.

Image doesn't mean that you're slickly packaged and perfectly groomed. Image simply means you've convinced someone that you're a product that they want.

+1!







Also, to the OP, save the textspeak posts for your myspace page.

u sound teh loozerz. Not gud 4 ur image.

[fenderhutz]

Really depends on your audience. Trying to get signed? Playing in a wedding band? Getting paid to play?

The only time I didn't really care about my image to much was playing in a jukebox bar band doing covers. We all showed up in jeans and a t-shirt and never got a complaint.

If your in an original band labels want something they can market, if they wanted to sell records they could hire a bunch of studio musicians and send them on the road. They want a good image they can market.

Just my .02

[steve21]

Nothing is as important as lookin' cool.

[Asa Samuel]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

Excuse me. Where's the carrots? Invalid poll.

+1

[Baryonyx]

Originally Posted by uethanian

stu hamm, on the other hand, isnt exactly wat you'd call "cool." miles davis was "cool." but stu hamm, not so much.

So you don't like the shirts he wears. He's toured and recorded with the likes of Joe Satriani and Steve Vai and has a great catalogue of solo recordings. I'll let him know you think he needs to pay more attention to his wardrobe

[steve66]

IMO image is not important. If your good, there will be people that will notice.

[Yngwie 4String]

I dont know as much as I prolly should about jazz but in Metal you live and die by your imagery.

[alfredpunkjazz]

Originally Posted by Chris2112

So you don't like the shirts he wears. He's toured and recorded with the likes of Joe Satriani and Steve Vai and has a great catalogue of solo recordings. I'll let him know you think he needs to pay more attention to his wardrobe

I don't think that anyone is saying that Stu it is not a cool bass player, or something like that... But, come on, those shirts are ugly, LOL. Just that, talking about the shirt.

[bigfatbass]

I think your MTV mentalities are skewing the point. Ugly IS an image.

Slipknot is trying to be pretty?

I've worked full time as a bass player for over a decade based on the fact that the jolly fat guy in the loud shirt is a legit look as a roots bass player.

I knew a dude here in town who for months told everyone he was gonna lead the disco revival. This was YEARS before the disco revival. He said "I'm gonna have a live disco band called The Electric Chick Magnets and we are gonna pack the ladies in the clubs all night long."

After the better part of a year of wearing leisure suits to class (really, the cat dressed like Don Knotts on Threes Company) collecting friends/musicians who also liked the disco funk, the next thing you know he had a band.

And, a $2000 a night weekly gig at the best venue in town packing the place with 18-23 yr old hotties. Line out the door and down the block.

The point being, at first he was just that dork in the pants suit endlessly raving about music no one else seemed to care about (sorry Adam, if you ever happen to see this! You knows I luvs ya!). He stuck with the 'vision', found the right players, changed his name to Maurice Love, and left his mark on the Syracuse scene for years to come.

He had chops, and a good idea, and an image that he turned into product.

[00Funk]

Image is EVERYTHING, Especially in your minds eye. Your imagination. The image you have of yourself is crucial. I see myself as Double O funk. One of the best funk players of all time.
Im not there yet, but I know I will be. I really didnt start practicing till age 43. I think bt age 50 I will be half way decent

[Musiclogic]

Society is image driven, mainstream music is image driven, bussiness is image driven, entertainment is image driven.

Is Image important??? for the most part in society today, Yes. It's helpful to get noticed, and make inroads. If you are not Trendy, and a Slave to fashion in society today, you are ignored. It has been this way in the music world for as long as there has been a music world. If you don't look the part, the A&R guys, don't take notice, the clubs ignore you, etc...

Welcome to the real world. It's all visual, and pretty much equates to the amount of lame music, movies, comedy, literature, and the degredation of todays society.

They didn't label this the Trash and lazy generation for nothing.

Glad I never bit into the Shepherds Pie served to all the Sheep of society....LMAO