How to think like a singer

[Depth_Charge]

After just playing bass live for years without even a mic in front of me, I've been learning to sing lead and backups to improve the package I can offer groups and "give me a voice" in any future groups I put together.

I usually learn to sing a song without the bass but once I'm relatively comfortable with the words/phrasing, I start playing the bass as well, hoping to improve both (in theory).

I've noticed that a lot of the time I miss vocal queues because I'm thinking about holding the bassline down and catch myself thinknig "shouldn't there be vocals" before realising that's me too now.

Are there any tricks to thinking like a singer/multi-instrumentalist, or is this something that will just take time to develop as I slowly progress?

[Emm9T]

I think Geddy Lee learns the bass first, locks himself away and plays it a hundred times until it becomes second nature before adding vocals. Personally, my singing is a lost cause...

[rosanne]

I don't know of any tricks. I try to get the bass part down first so I can then get the phrasing without interference from the bass groove. But it aint easy any way you do it. At least not for me. I'm trying to do less and less singing because it's not helping my bass playing. Singing backup is a lot easier tho.

[Smallmouth_Bass]

I would agree; the bass playing has to be automatic before you can actually concentrate on the singing. The good thing is it gets easier the more you do it.

[Smallmouth_Bass]

Sometimes I simplify the basslines too to make it easier.

[rosanne]

Originally Posted by Smallmouth_Bass

Sometimes I simplify the basslines too to make it easier.

I've also done this, but I'm not happy doing it.

[MNAirHead]

simplify... pick straight forward songs...

Bass and singing is one of the tougher combos.

[Depth_Charge]

A lot of the songs I'm now learning to sing are songs I've already gigged and thought I could play on auto pilot. I sure can when I'm monkeying about on stage!

I've always taken pride in playing covers as close to the original as possible, so simplifynig the lines does strike my pride/ego a bit and I have tried pushing past that limitation. Might be time to rethink my stance on that.

My primary motivation to learn to sing is to be able to cover a no-show singer on the spot intead of having to cancel because the singer didn't show. I wish it was to be able to sing, but its not really. Its a have to, not a want to. I don't know if thats taking on too much responsibility as a band leader, but I like low numbers and don't see another way of performing gigs when singers don't show up.

Thanks guys. As always your insight is most helpful!

[lowfreq33]

I've been playing and singing for a few years now. I was always able to do the "campfire" thing with guitar, that's easy. It's harder with bass because it's like playing lead the whole time. You can't just strum, it's too rhythmically specific.

I started just doing a backup here and there, then got thrown into the deep end a few tines where I had to do ALL the backups. I sort of found that the less I think about it the better. I used to just play the bass line until it was automatic, and then add the vocals. Lately, as I've been learning a bunch of tunes for a new project, I've found myself singing while I'm getting the line down. I guess it just gets easier with time.

One tip I can give you is to find the syllables that match up with odd accents on the bass and use that as a reminder of those. Like one tune I did with my last band had a tricky accent, but once I thought it out I just grabbed the "see" in "Tennessee" and it was all good.

[maxgrant]

There are two ways you can approach it. First way is like Emm9T says, burn the bass part in hardcore and get to where you don't have to think about it.

The other way is to think of it as if you are a multitasking computer. Take up an action from each of your two "threads" as your attention becomes free to do so. I think of it as interleaving the two parts together; some of the notes are played together, some are played in between playing other notes.

I also try to wing it with vocals while I practice as often as possible. You will be surprised at how much this improves your ability to think on your feet (and hands, and voice) all at once.

In the final analysis, there is no way to do it but to do it. All the time. Eventually it becomes second nature, and I often start rehearsing new songs these days with the vocals just dumped on top of my bass part, and I just bluff my way through it as my hands and tongue find their respective places. By the second or third runthrough I've pretty much got it, unless I've chosen to overlay a particularly off-time vocal on top of the bass. Then I rehearse just that bit over and over again until it flows.

[pklima]

Originally Posted by Depth_Charge

Are there any tricks to thinking like a singer

Sure. Look at yourself in mirrors a lot. Spend more money on clothes. Constantly monitor how much attention people are paying to you, and find ways to attract more attention. Treat the word "douchebag" as a compliment. Develop an awesome sense of your own awesomeness.

Then you will truly think like a singer. It definitely works for me.

[HeadyVan Halen]

Originally Posted by Smallmouth_Bass

Sometimes I simplify the basslines too to make it easier.

+1,000.
No matter what we think, 99.97% of people are listening to the vocals and not the bass anyway..
Now once you get to the solo, you can turn it loose.

In music where there are words, they are the focal point and should be made the most loud and clear.

[Rune Bivrin]

Thinking and music doesn't generally go well together.

So rather than start thinking like a singer you should stop thinking like a bass player. I've noticed that whenever I'm overwhelmed by the awesomeness that is my bass playing I'm very likely to screw up my singing. And vice versa.

Having said that, for me the "auto pilot" thing doesn't work very well. I like to be aware of what I do. Maybe that's because as a singer for 30 years I'm actually quite confident with the singing part. I don't know. I like to dive in and do both at the same time. Possibly simplifying the bass line initially while I work out how the vocals and bass interact.

[stingraysvt]

Backups in my old group were not a big deal because we played together for so long and I rarely even thought about the notes that were being played.... I could just cue in on what the singer was singing and hit the notes I needed to, nowadays, I have to practice a song with the 3 part harmonies our band is doing. Thank goodness we have 4 vocalists, I can lay off on songs where the groove is more important than my singing parts.

[jaywa]

Originally Posted by pklima

Sure. Look at yourself in mirrors a lot. Spend more money on clothes. Constantly monitor how much attention people are paying to you, and find ways to attract more attention. Treat the word "douchebag" as a compliment. Develop an awesome sense of your own awesomeness.

Then you will truly think like a singer. It definitely works for me.

Also... sing way ahead of the beat, forget/change lyrics, never sing the song structure the same way twice, always ask for more of you in ALL the monitors, and make sure you show up after set-up and leave before teardown.

That should be about it.

[Ubersheist]

Lots of good advice here. It works for me to know and totally own the bassline first, and then I play it pretty simply.

Also, as mentioned by HeadyVan Halen, it's true that no one listens to the bass line. They listen to the vocals. They come first. You can screw up the bass line and get away with it much more easily then if you screw up the vocals. People notice singing. Unless the bass line has a crucial melody or something, just make sure you hit the 1 on each bar, and you'll probably be OK.

I'm pretty good at compartmentalizing things in my head. As such, the rhythm for the bass can occupy one part of my head, while the singing can take up another. However, if it's a syncopated line, or has triplets or a triplet feel to it, I'm screwed. I can't seem to marry the two ever.

[ShredderMaximus]

Heck, look at Tom Araya from Slayer, I don't think he leaves that open E at any given song whenever they play live, not something I recommend but funny.
But yeah, I would just recommend starting on a relatively easy song, first just running over the lyrics in your head as you play, then humming the basic vocal melody, then humming in rhythm, to kinda singing under your breath, to eventually belting it out while ripping it up!

[Ayce]

I did that a few times, lead vocals/simple bass line, but mostly stuck to backup vocals, so the bass line didn't get messed up. I played for ages before I got a mic stuck in my face, so it wasn't that hard to do, for me at least.
I will agree that 99.9% of the audience is listening to the vocals or lead breaks, however, 100% of people dance to the drums and bass. If they go out of sync, the dancers get messed up, and sit down.
JME of course.

@Ubersheist
"You can screw up the bass line and get away with it much more easily then if you screw up the bass line." Huh?

[Ubersheist]

Originally Posted by Ayce

@Ubersheist
"You can screw up the bass line and get away with it much more easily then if you screw up the bass line." Huh?

Oops. I fixed it to read "You can screw up the bass line and get away with it much more easily then if you screw up the vocals."

[skwee]

Know both separately and immaculately. When you put the two together, pay attention to where the parts match up. Simplify the bass part where you need to, making sure the timing of downbeats are correct. Good luck.