It's better to make music free of artistic respectability

[pklima]

I don't want to play artistically respectable music, or music that people whose lives revolve around music like. It's just not much fun, and you're only allowed to do artistically respectable things which places all sorts of weird restrictions on what you can and can't do. This is true for both covers and originals, and for all genres. Whenever any genre exists in both "true" or "real" and "false" or "fake" or "sellout" versions, I'll take the "false" every single time.

As Harris Berger wrote about audiences at rock gigs in the early 1990s in his "Metal, Rock And Jazz" book:

"Greg, a participant in an earlier study of mine, suggested that if I were interested in people watching at rock shows, I should start with a type he called the Slient Men. Musicians or critical listeners, these men are there to judge the bands, said Greg. Dressed in worn but not ripped jeans, work boots and T-shirts, they avoid both the self-consciously showy look of the commercial hard rocker and the self-conscious caralessness of the Seattle-type grungester. As the bands play, they stand off to the side of the dance floor and view the musicians with a critical glare; between the sets they position themselves at the margins of the action, leaning aginst the walls and avoiding the dance floor and bar area. Such men always go to shows with a friend. Arms folded across their chests or one hand holding a plastic cup of beer, they talk little and drink just slightly more. They gaze critically at both the musicianship of the bands and the boisterous displays of the participants. This observation, however, is not lecherous. While sexuality and spectacular display are major themes in all of these events, the disdain of the Silent Men's glances seems aimed equally at the loud and expressive men as well as the provocatively dressed women."

I don't want to play music those guys like. I'd much rather play music those guys virulently hate. Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fet40KV7OIc

Just wanted to get this off my chest.

[BigTuna]

this is pretty cool. I like the music. its so different and totally outta this world I kinda like it. the video is goofy but who cares. I personally find myself wanting to make music like say, this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ehy2JhRmME I just love the intensity of it and the primal connection. But I love a lot of different music. I'm in a band that covers a lot of AC DC and classic rock like that. I'm always looking to do something different though

I have some questions about that video. did you make that song? and those are some crazy basses. is that a three neck with 1 string then 2 strings then 4 strings? then the other double neck was a short scale and a normal scale. totally different sound

[pklima]

Haha. I can't even tolerate the tiny doses of artistic respectability found in rock or hip-hop! I do actually like playing classical on the rare occasions I get a call to do it, to be honest, even though I don't really want to listen to it.

[pklima]

Originally Posted by BigTuna

I have some questions about that video. did you make that song? and those are some crazy basses. is that a three neck with 1 string then 2 strings then 4 strings? then the other double neck was a short scale and a normal scale. totally different sound

Haha... It's a couple of country songs mashed together and done in a crunkcore style - only one verse is something we actually wrote. The tripleneck has 1, 2 and 3-string necks, and the doubleneck is two regular-scale necks. I do actually play the DB and the tripleneck on the recording.

I just don't want to make music for angry people or for people who are Serious About Music. Those aren't fun audiences. I probably could play death metal but only if it's something totally "false" that "true metal fans" hate.

[lunarpollen]

False dichotomy. The idea of there only being two kinds of music--music that's artistically respectable, and music that isn't--is ridiculous.

[baalroo]

Originally Posted by lunarpollen

False dichotomy. The idea of there only being two kinds of music--music that's artistically respectable, and music that isn't--is ridiculous.

agreed.

the OP is actually kind of sad, to be so quick to stereotype and simplify so broadly must be quite a strange way to live. apparently he doesn't want to be part of a small subgroup of srs musos who can only take srs music xtra srs, and thus swings wildly the other directions and overcompensates by trying to be extremely unserious and irreverent to the point of absurdity.

[pklima]

It's not a dichotomy, but a continuum - and I prefer the extremely non-respectable end of the continuum. That's just me, though. I'm that kind of person. I also like hideously loud shirts...

I am completely serious about this band, too. I seriously want non-serious people to enjoy it.

[baalroo]

Originally Posted by pklima

It's not a dichotomy, but a continuum - and I prefer the extremely non-respectable end of the continuum. That's just me, though. I'm that kind of person. I also like hideously loud shirts...

I am completely serious about this band, too. I seriously want non-serious people to enjoy it.

that's cool, but here's the rub: very few people are non-serious all the time and only enjoy non-serious music, but most people are sometimes non-serious and also sometimes enjoy non-serious music. To outright dismiss all those people who may be able to feel a wider range of emotion than just "non-serious" is kind of a shame isn't it? (that's only half rhetorical)

personally I prefer music that spans all the different varying states of seriousness, but if I had to pick one state I would choose "ambiguously serious," like when you listen and you can't decide if the band is being really serious or if they're just trying to MAKE YOU THINK they are being really serious. I think The Darkness, The Sword, and Clutch are all really good examples of this state.

[MIJ-VI]

IMO one should play that which moves one.

[over_the_moon]

Hah hah! I liked the masked rapper with the decorative plates on the wall behind him. Nothing says legit gangsta like decorative plates. If you listen to the audio without watching the video, it's actually pretty catchy.

[ggunn]

Originally Posted by pklima

I don't want to play artistically respectable music, or music that people whose lives revolve around music like. It's just not much fun, and you're only allowed to do artistically respectable things which places all sorts of weird restrictions on what you can and can't do. This is true for both covers and originals, and for all genres. Whenever any genre exists in both "true" or "real" and "false" or "fake" or "sellout" versions, I'll take the "false" every single time.

I know plenty of musicians who are quite serious about music that is far outside of the mainstream. I believe that yours is a straw man argument.

I played in a cover band for many years; we played corporate parties and weddings. It was relatively lucrative but the music was about as mainstream as it could possibly get. Read: boring to play. I bought a lot of nice gear with the proceeds, however, before I got to the point where I couldn't stand playing "YMCA" any more.

But I also have many gigabytes and tapes of very off-the-wall sessions I have participated over the past 30 years or so where whether it's even music or not is open to interpretation.

I do not understand the concept of "artistic responsibility"; I play what's appropriate to the situation, sure, but what that situation is varies hugely. I'll say this, though; playing music is communication between musician(s) and audience. If no one wants to listen to what you are playing, then what's the point?

[Febs]

Originally Posted by pklima

It's just not much fun, and you're only allowed to do artistically respectable things which places all sorts of weird restrictions on what you can and can't do.

It's ironic that you want to play music without "weird restrictions" and yet you're so quick to to lump others into artificial categories.

[thumpbass1]

Originally Posted by Febs

It's ironic that you want to play music without "weird restrictions" and yet you're so quick to to lump others into artificial categories.

#1!

[kesslari]

Quick, what's your D&D Alignment?

[BigTuna]

Originally Posted by ggunn

I'll say this, though; playing music is communication between musician(s) and audience. If no one wants to listen to what you are playing, then what's the point?

I don't agree. I think music is like a painting. Its a personal expression for the artist. Sure some artists make music or art because they know it will intrigue other people. example:nickleback. I despise them but whatever. I don't think its wrong of them to do that just like an artist making something for other peoples attention. But I think that most music is made because the people that made it liked it not because they thought the audience was going to like it. I could make a whole album and not show it to anyone because I could care less what they think of it. I might show them anyway because I'm proud of it but I'm not making it for them I'm making it for me. thats what I'm trying to say here. We're all entitled to our opinions though

[JohnMCA72]

Originally Posted by pklima

...
I don't want to play music those guys like. I'd much rather play music those guys virulently hate.
...

Not to worry. Those guys will never like anything you'll ever play.

[fdeck]

Originally Posted by pklima

As Harris Berger wrote about audiences at rock gigs in the early 1990s in his "Metal, Rock And Jazz" book:

"Greg, a participant in an earlier study of mine, suggested that if I were interested in people watching at rock shows, I should start with a type he called the Slient Men. Musicians or critical listeners, these men are there to judge the bands, said Greg. Dressed in worn but not ripped jeans, work boots and T-shirts, they avoid both the self-consciously showy look of the commercial hard rocker and the self-conscious caralessness of the Seattle-type grungester. As the bands play, they stand off to the side of the dance floor and view the musicians with a critical glare; between the sets they position themselves at the margins of the action, leaning aginst the walls and avoiding the dance floor and bar area. Such men always go to shows with a friend. Arms folded across their chests or one hand holding a plastic cup of beer, they talk little and drink just slightly more. They gaze critically at both the musicianship of the bands and the boisterous displays of the participants. This observation, however, is not lecherous. While sexuality and spectacular display are major themes in all of these events, the disdain of the Silent Men's glances seems aimed equally at the loud and expressive men as well as the provocatively dressed women."

This seems like a fictional caricature.

[brekfustuvluzer]

strange motives

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Originally Posted by BigTuna

I don't agree. I think music is like a painting. Its a personal expression for the artist. Sure some artists make music or art because they know it will intrigue other people. example:nickleback. I despise them but whatever. I don't think its wrong of them to do that just like an artist making something for other peoples attention. But I think that most music is made because the people that made it liked it not because they thought the audience was going to like it. I could make a whole album and not show it to anyone because I could care less what they think of it. I might show them anyway because I'm proud of it but I'm not making it for them I'm making it for me. thats what I'm trying to say here. We're all entitled to our opinions though

As a musician and a painter, I wholeheartedly agree. No one has to enjoy watching me eat a sandwich for it to taste good to me.

[Anthbass]

Originally Posted by fdeck

This seems like a fictional caricature.

I don't know, this could very much be me at a show (minus the friend and the 'disdain'). I view from the periphery, I enjoy looking at the gear that the band members are using, and I don't drink much, if at all. I think I see what the OP is driving at, but he would do well to realize that music is different things to different people. As a musician, I appreciate artisanship in music; it makes me feel all fuzzy inside. I also appreciate 'fun' music, self-deprecating or ironic music, and most any number of other tired adjectives used to describe a certain sound or genre. I do draw the line at anything that Bruce Lindfield would endorse, though...