Keyboard Synth recommendations?

tranceFusion · #1 11-12-2008, 09:58 PM

I was about to get an EHX Bass Micro Synth but I was thinking that I would get a Keyboard synth instead because it would be more versatile, allow me to use it as a MIDI if I wanted to play with synth software in the future, and allow me to learn some basic piano chops..

Is it possible for me to find something decent under $500? I want it mostly for ambient noise and effects that would fit in a modern hard rock scenario, rather than actual bass lines. I would like the sound to be thick, warm and deep..

ric stave · #2 11-13-2008, 06:46 AM

Check out the Alesis Micron - very nice 3 octave full size key virtual analog synth.

tranceFusion · #3 11-13-2008, 06:59 AM

is this better or worse than the Alesis Ion for somebody who has completely no clue about what they are doing?

jim777 · #4 11-13-2008, 07:31 AM

Worse :-) The Micron is an Ion without the knobs, basically. I have an Ion and it is a blast to goof around with. It does noise very well, but also does Rick Wakeman minimoog lines beautifully as well. The Micron does have an arpeggiator, but if you can't use it the other Ion upsides make a much bigger difference. The ION is more fun, basically, but it's still plenty deep. You could get lost on either but far, far more easily on the Micron.

edit: And the last few IONs came with free gigbags, so if you get one off the 'Bay look for one of those

lukas86 · #5 11-13-2008, 07:36 AM

Micro Korg. should be pretty cheap new. Or Roland Juno.

If you can find one, get a roland TB303.

stingray56funk · #6 11-13-2008, 07:38 AM

My vote for a current model is the MicroKorg. It is fun especially with the vocoder.

jim777 · #7 11-13-2008, 07:53 AM

The ION has a vocoder

But try http://www.vintagesynth.com/forum/index.php for more research, that's a great site with a ton of info in the forum.

tranceFusion · #8 11-13-2008, 07:53 AM

Does the ion do fat, dark, and deep? I want to people to take a step when i play it.. I want to blow the other band members off of the stage

How does the microkorg compare in this realm?

jim777 · #9 11-13-2008, 08:10 AM

The ION is 8 voice, so it is definitely capable of doing deep and dark. But it's a VA like the MicroKorg, so it won't sound exactly like an actual analog. The MicroKorg is 4 voice, but is also a great little synth. My familiarity is with the ION really, so I'm unfortunately biased in that regard.

**Mark Wilson** · #10 11-13-2008, 08:10 AM

Off to Misc.

ric stave · #11 11-13-2008, 08:14 AM

Yes, the Ion would be easier to work with for someone with no synth experience - grab a knob and turn - looks more complicated, but the menu navigation on the Micron would be more confusing for someone with no programming experience.

My vote for the Micron or Ion over the Korg goes for the size of the keys - if you are eventually going to use it to play other type key parts, the Korg might be a pain.

tranceFusion · #12 11-13-2008, 08:27 AM

Is it possible on any of these synths to use an external input (my bass, a voice, or some random sample/sound clip) and apply the synth's effect to it? (and if so, what is this feature called?)

tranceFusion · #13 11-13-2008, 08:39 AM

oh yeah, and it looks like the Ion is out of production? Is this used market the only way?

bongomania · #14 11-13-2008, 08:41 AM

Important distinction: a synth is not an effect, it is a sound generator, an instrument. Some synths have the ability to run an external signal through their lowpass filter, but even then you have to have a sequencer, LFO, or somebody playing the keys in order to trigger any envelope or modulation on that filter- and a filter is cool but not quite the same as a "synth sound", and certainly nothing approaching any of the other sounds the keyboard can make. A few synths have a vocoder built in, which is a very fancy sort of filter used for "talking" effects, but there are problems there too. For one, it won't work well unless you play only treble notes or sing/vocalize very low notes. For another, you'd need a vocoder that can take not only your vocal input, but also an external instrument input to override the synth's own keyboard/tone generator controls. Not all keyboard synths have that ability, even if they have a vocoder.

Edit: For greater accuracy I should say that a modular synth can be used as an effects device, but a modular synth is much much much more in depth than you are ready for, I guarantee it. Plus not cheap.

tranceFusion · #15 11-13-2008, 09:00 AM

Thanks bongo.. My thinking is that at first I will use the synth for heavily filtered sound effects, and as I get better I will be able to play more melodic things and actually use the synth sound.

If I am really just asking for too much out of a single $500 box, or if I have the wrong device, please speak up

The problem with heavily filtered sound effects is that IMO they aren't going to sound as good with live instruments when they are digital. I was hoping there was some way to introduce some randomness into the digital onboard filters by using an analog instrument as input.

I guess the problem here really is that I don't have a particular use in mind for the synth.. just that I want a toy to goof around with to spark the creative juices when my bass playing hits a wall.

bongomania · #16 11-13-2008, 09:07 AM

I am saying when it comes to keyboard or MIDI controlled synths you have the wrong device altogether. You can play the keyboard (or sequenced synth) or you can play the bass; you can only do both with a lot of money and specialized equipment.

To get what it sounds like you're talking about, you want a pedal that was designed for processing an instrument input- if you search on 'synth' over in the fx forum you'll see what people are using for that purpose.

bongomania · #17 11-13-2008, 09:09 AM

Also since you mention sparking creative juices etc. look into the Moog Bass MURF.

MatticusMania · #18 11-13-2008, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

You can play the keyboard (or sequenced synth) or you can play the bass; you can only do both with a lot of money and specialized equipment.

Incorrect. I do both and it only took the cost of my synth and the cost of a Boss RC-2.

If you're looking for a synth, and not a synth pedal, I would say no to the MicroKorg. I was GASing for one for a long time, until I spent 5 minutes with the Novation XioSynth. You can get the 4 octave version for the same price as the MicroKorg or you can get the 2 octave version for $100 less. Its extremely easy to use and has SO many more usable sounds than the microKorg.

NJL · #19 11-13-2008, 09:55 AM

if you have a laptop, the synths on Reason sound great.. to my ears at least.. use a cheap midi controller..

jim777 · #20 11-13-2008, 10:14 AM

I haven't done it, but you should certainly be able to run your bass through the ION's vocoder input. I'll try it in a little while when I get a few minutes. But as previously noted, it isn't a bass synth however good a piece of gear it is.

And yes, the ION is discontinued so you need to find one used. Folks were hoping it would be replaced with a mono Andromeda, but that didn't happen (yet).