Go Back   TalkBass Forums > Bass Guitar Forums > Bass Guitar Forums > Miscellaneous [BG]
Register Rules/FAQ/CUP Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Miscellaneous [BG] Music-related discussion, not specific to the bass or any other forum


Supporting Membership
Thank You

Latest Supporting Member
Donate to Upgrade Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 10-26-2010, 01:38 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Send a message via AIM to BryanM
Music Education: Do I take the Leap?

Sign in to disble this ad
I'm posting here for the advice of fellow TBers, hopefully some who've made this or a similar decision. I have an associate's degree in education and about 20 more credits from a 4 year school towards a degree in mathematics.

I was able to maintain a 3.6 through getting my Ed degree and enjoyed the majority of my classes but when I went on to the 4 year university I found that I couldn't keep my GPA up and didn't do well in or enjoy my classes in mathematics.

I'm 26 years old and have been a musician for the past 12 to 13 years, primarily supporting myself from it for the past 2 years or so and when I sit down and really ask myself what I want to do with my life or what my dreams are I only really come to the conclusion that I want to give others what music gave me when I was 13 or 14.

I don't have much in the way of financial obligations preventing me from doing so, and I'm considering applying to and hopefully enrolling in a standard 4 year music education program and would like to know any advice that could be given. If any of you have gone back to school as young adults (older than the typical college population) in a more traditional sense, rather than night and weekend school, your insight would as to whether it can or should be done would be greatly appreciated.

Too long; didn't read version: I'm 26 and want to enroll in a music ed program as a traditional student, advice or tips?
__________________
Pittsburgh Club member #3; Carvin Club member #27;
SX Bass Club member in good standing
  #2  
Old 10-26-2010, 02:55 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: South Florida
Supporting Member
Do it now, get your teaching cert. sounds like you have something to offer..................................
  #3  
Old 10-26-2010, 03:04 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Oslo, Norway
I took five years of music education, and i must say it was a bad deal. If i was at your age i would do something that would bring me some money in the long run..like computers. Thats how i see it. You can still be a musician.
  #4  
Old 10-26-2010, 08:43 AM
BassChuck's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Cincinnati
Supporting Member
Do it. But also get certified in math.
__________________
Never confuse beauty with things that put your mind at ease. -Charles E. Ives
  #5  
Old 10-26-2010, 09:43 AM
MalcolmAmos's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Deep East Texas Piney Woods
Supporting Member
I went back and finished my BS in Business Administration in 1983 at the age of 48. Best thing I ever did, well besides marrying my Wife and having a small part in the birth of our Daughter.

Yes get the teaching certificate. Certified in math will let you pick and choose where you teach.

Go for it.
  #6  
Old 10-26-2010, 09:45 AM
Jim Carr's Avatar
Dr. Jim
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Denton TX, Kailua HI, New York
GOLD Supporting Member
The Long Answer...

I went back to school in my 50's to change from teaching music at the University level to teaching music in public schools K-12. I wanted to leave the "sabatical replacement/1-2 year appointment track," and find something more stable and better paying. I did.

I must say that in my life, I have either taught (or taken) darned near every music course offered by a typical large university music department. A lot of the stuff I took toward certification was worthwhile, some not so much.

After getting the requisite courses done on top of my 3 music degrees, (BA, MA, and DMA), I was hired and taught for 3 years before relocating at the beginning of the current recession. I am not now teaching—just gigging as jobs are scarce—and consider myself basically retired at age 60.

Teaching music in public school is worthwhile, and pays better than Academia (really). It far is more work than anything else I have ever done. This includes writing UNIX software on Wall Street for floor traders on the NYSE, teaching programming at Bell Labs, and teaching theory and other music topics at Columbia, Stanford, and San Francisco State—not to mention being a cabbie, truck driver, textile mill worker, circuit board assembler, and sanitation worker.

I taught music to kids K-4, violin for 3rd and 4th graders, and Rock Lab—an after school rock band class for middle school and high school kids.

I loved the kids, though it could be challenging. The parents were supportive and helpful. I found that my biggest frustration was my colleagues. They were generally all burned out, unable to understand what I was doing, and viewed music classes as their break time. In effect, they felt that if my work did not raise standardized test scores, it probably didn't matter much.

Sometimes people ask me about the differences between teaching little kids and college kids. There are a lot of obvious differences, but the cognitive work of hearing, understanding, moving to, and articulating music in a group or individually is unchanging for all ages.

I have a few questions/comments:

Do you sing well—meaning you can match pitch expertly, and can you read or at least echo back a vocal melody 100% accurately.

Do you read well? Really well? Your classmates will kick your behinder if you don't—meaning they will sail past you in an eye-blink.

Do you play piano well-enough to handle basic music at sight? Do you play guitar? I found both indispensable, not just as a teacher, but as a student, too.

What would be your major instrument? Please don't say bass guitar. I love bass, I live bass, but IMHO you need experience playing in an orchestra, chorus, or wind ensemble—though Jazz Band might do it, if you are really reading every note in your part except solos, and have a very skilled director.

Where are you going to go to school and what branch(es) of Music Ed. interest you?

Are you prepared for the demands of getting a degree and getting certified? IMHO, your age is not a factor, except the girls will think you are cool.
__________________
Sadowsky RV4 P/J
Valenti Fretless 5 #19
1850 Tirolean Upright
55 & 71 P-basses
Lakland 55-01D
08 Fiesta Red RW Jazz
Crest CA6/ART tube channel
Mesa M9
Epifani UL1 410 & 210, NYC 210

www.jamescarr.net

Last edited by Jim Carr : 10-26-2010 at 09:54 AM. Reason: typo fix
  #7  
Old 10-26-2010, 09:58 AM
Tampabass's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tampa
Supporting Member
Before you make the leap, you ought to REALLY make sure that you have a burning desire to teach music in the public schools.

Are you ready to make as little as public school teachers make? If you become a high-school band director at a school where the program is very active, you'll be working lonngggg hours, including twice-a-week evening marching band rehearsals and every Friday night in the fall.

Then in the spring, you'll be spending lots of extra time dealing with band contests and concerts, and coordinating solo & ensemble contests and other events.

I strongly believe in making a good public education available to all, and I'm strongly supportive of districts hiring good teachers AND paying them more.

But the reality is that if you choose that path, and you later choose to get married and have kids (and mortgages and cars and all the rest $$$$$$$) ... you will struggle on a public school salary.

Seriously, if it's just about being involved in music, you could find another career path where your salary would be much higher and you'd have MORE time to play bass when you're not at your day job.
__________________
Florida Bassists Club #130
Fretless Club #604
My Facebook music page
Acme Jazz Garage on Facebook
Trio Vibe
ye olde Ghetto Love Sugar
  #8  
Old 10-26-2010, 11:07 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Send a message via AIM to BryanM
To address some questions that have been asked:

I do intend after I have the music degree to finish the remaining 30-40 credits and take the math praxis II for my math degree.

My instrument of choice would probably either be jazz guitar or double bass at either Slippery Rock University or Indiana University of PA.

I do know that I have a burning desire to teach, and can handle living on a public school salary. I grew up with my family's household income in the $30,000 range with two brothers so I know what it's like to scrape by.

I'm willing to work the long hours that come with teaching, I've been working jobs since I was 18 that require 50, 60 or 70 hours a week without the benefit of job satisfaction or higher pay.

I sing reasonably well, meaning I can match pitch and read lines off of a page, though my range is limited to about two octaves in the tenor/baritone range.

I sight read at speed on guitar and bass and with time on piano and double bass.

I play both guitar and piano, guitar as my original primary instrument and piano as an accompanist.

I also have past experience playing trumpet and saxophone, though I couldn't say if I'm very good at them anymore, being out of practice.

I'm hoping to teach middle school or elementary level music, but would be happy to teach high school as well.

As far as making money in the long run, I have experience and knowledge in computer programming and finance but find that in these fields I get burnt out relatively quickly.
__________________
Pittsburgh Club member #3; Carvin Club member #27;
SX Bass Club member in good standing
  #9  
Old 10-26-2010, 11:16 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Winder, GA
Do you like kids? 99% of the kids out there are fine but there's a small percentage that can ruin it for you if you let them. That and while the kids may be fine their parents can be nutty. Be ready for both.

I wish you the best of luck with it.
  #10  
Old 10-26-2010, 11:27 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Supporting Member
I'm 26 years old also. I got my music education degree two years ago, and I'm in my second year of being a high school band director. I can honestly say that I love doing what I'm doing. But I'm a huge band nerd, so I would have withdrawals if I weren't able to be heavily involved in marching band, concert band, jazz band, etc. I'm a bass player in a band as well, and we gig on the weekends. The Friday night football games do affect my gigging schedule, especially since my school's football team is ranked in the top 50 in the entire nation, meaning we have a long playoff season every year. The money isn't fantastic, but I'm single, no kids, no bad habbits or health issues, and the only debt I have is student loans. So I manage to make my salary work fine for now. But every teacher will tell you, you don't become a teacher for the money. You do it because it's what you're called to do, and because you want to impact the lives of kids. So I enjoy it. And having every summer and holday off is great too.
  #11  
Old 10-26-2010, 12:38 PM
Tampabass's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Tampa
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killens84 View Post
The money isn't fantastic, but I'm single, no kids, no bad habits or health issues, and the only debt I have is student loans. So I manage to make my salary work fine for now.
Key statement.
__________________
Florida Bassists Club #130
Fretless Club #604
My Facebook music page
Acme Jazz Garage on Facebook
Trio Vibe
ye olde Ghetto Love Sugar
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Follow TalkBass on Twitter   Visit TalkBass on Facebook  

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:08 PM.




Copyright 2011 Talk Music Group Inc. All rights reserved.
Play guitar? Visit our new sister site TalkGuitar.com [beta]
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.12
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.