Is this shady ethics?

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by hrodbert696

If I may be allowed the digression, I'm reminded of a story about St. Gerald of Aurillac, the first knight to get made a saint. Supposedly he bought some cloth on a trip to Italy and then returned to France. When he got there a merchant complimented him on the good deal he had gotten because the cloth would have cost twice as much in France. Stricken in his conscience, the saintly knight sent a messenger back to Italy with enough money to make up the difference in price...

What a doof.

[fdeck]

I have a contemporary story along the same lines. We went camping in Nova Scotia, close to a small fishing village, about 30 years ago. We showed up on the first day of crab season. The guy at the wharf didn't know what to charge us for crabs, because the fishery hadn't set the price yet, so he gave us the previous season's price. It was basically wholesale price for glorious fresh seafood, which we then cooked over the camp stove. He seemed to have little concept of tourism or capitalism.

Next day we went back for more. The guy was apologetic because the fishery had set a lower price, so he had overcharged us. He insisted that we take some money back.

Don't forget that in Medieval times, the concept of making a profit was considered to be immoral.

[Ewo]

Originally Posted by awilkie84

I understand the business mechanics behind it, but at what point does it become market controlling?

If I'm understanding your question, you're essentially asking about the potential for this store to monopolize the used gear market.

I figure it's not possible, really--no matter how much capital they want to tie up in inventory. (And in a stagnant, depressed economy it ain't a smart move, in general.) The used market is very dynamic, and very competitive. Check the classifieds here on TB, to see how competitive!

Uh, anybody want a nice MIM J deluxe at a nice price? Click the link in my sig...

[lowfreqgeek]

Originally Posted by fdeck

Don't forget that in Medieval times, the concept of making a profit was considered to be immoral.

We're headed back to Medieval times, I think...

[Catanova]

Originally Posted by lowfreqgeek

We're headed back to Medieval times, I think...

+1

Its obvious that the values of Capitalism and the Free Market are increasingly overshadowed by the perception that "Fairness" is morally superior. Simply turning a profit on music gear (or other merchandise) is not unethical, it is part of a functional marketplace Those profits don't just disappear into the Ether...

If a willing exchange occurs between consenting people and doesn't involve illegal gear, then that ought to be a fair deal

[f64]

Independent businesses will never control the used instrument market as their capitol is best used elsewhere. Buying any used gear you need to determine the market price. This is what businesses do. If something is undervalued they will buy it if and only if they think it will sell.
The best one I ran into lately was a piece of gear listed on fleeBay as
"FENDER PRECISION SPECIAL WALNUT, Only 200 made in 1981-82" for $3600. Seller is in NY. I do a nationwide CL search and the same bass comes up in MI for $1000. It has an aftermarket thumbrest so I know it's the same one. I call the seller in MI and he says its already gone. I offer the seller on eBay $1200 as that's what it's worth to me. He comes back with a $2600 counteroffer so I decline. The auction expires and he realists it for $2400. Is he wrong in what he's doing -no. Am I wrong in what I'm doing - no. It's called business.

[AltGrendel]

Welcome to capitalism.

[Joe Nerve]

Originally Posted by fdeck

I have a contemporary story along the same lines. We went camping in Nova Scotia, close to a small fishing village, about 30 years ago. We showed up on the first day of crab season. The guy at the wharf didn't know what to charge us for crabs, because the fishery hadn't set the price yet, so he gave us the previous season's price. It was basically wholesale price for glorious fresh seafood, which we then cooked over the camp stove. He seemed to have little concept of tourism or capitalism.

That story deserves a thread of it's own. Who's more wrong? Him for wanting to give you the money back, or you for taking it? Was the the kind and ethical thing for him to do, or the stupid thing for him to do? If you hand a storeowned a $10, and he gives you change for a $20, do you keep the difference or give it back? What's the difference between this story, and that? Etc, etc, and 6 pages later the thread gets closed.

[MarkMgibson]

If it's a matter of a music shop buying the stuff and then selling it at a profit, no problem. Call me cynical, but I'm guessing the music shop listed the stuff in the first place under a private name - the good old "bait and switch" - and it was never available at the original price. I could be wrong, but it's common practise with used cars, so why not used guitars?

[KsPiNeSh]

A buyer is only going to pay what they think something is worth, and if a music store takes a bath on some used items that they thought they could flip they won't be doing it for long. I see no issues.

[hrodbert696]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

What a doof.

Originally Posted by fdeck

I have a contemporary story along the same lines. We went camping in Nova Scotia, close to a small fishing village, about 30 years ago. We showed up on the first day of crab season. The guy at the wharf didn't know what to charge us for crabs, because the fishery hadn't set the price yet, so he gave us the previous season's price. It was basically wholesale price for glorious fresh seafood, which we then cooked over the camp stove. He seemed to have little concept of tourism or capitalism.

Next day we went back for more. The guy was apologetic because the fishery had set a lower price, so he had overcharged us. He insisted that we take some money back.

Don't forget that in Medieval times, the concept of making a profit was considered to be immoral.

Well, exactly (I'm surprised that some people seem to think I want us all to behave like good Sir Gerald). The market is the market, and value is what people are willing to pay. Hopefully most of us in the 21st century would get that.

I had a slight "flip" once (most of the time I take a minor loss, like $25 or something, when I turn around and sell gear). Picked up an MIM P-bass and an MXR M-80 pedal from a guy for $250. He was going into the military and had to sell fast. The bass was a little beaten up but played well. I cleaned it up and put new strings on it, played it for a few weeks, then turned around and sold the bass to another guy for $250 - basically meaning that I walked away with the pedal for free (or for the cost of a set of strings, I guess).

[Stewie26]

Originally Posted by DougD

Why is it that musicians have a hang up about making money?
It is not unethical to make money.
Profit is not a bad word.
Business is not a evil enterprise.

This...and the system works well.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by Joe Nerve

That story deserves a thread of it's own. Who's more wrong? Him for wanting to give you the money back, or you for taking it? Was the the kind and ethical thing for him to do, or the stupid thing for him to do? If you hand a storeowned a $10, and he gives you change for a $20, do you keep the difference or give it back? What's the difference between this story, and that? Etc, etc, and 6 pages later the thread gets closed.

What you described is completely different. There were no mistakes made in the transaction. A price was agreed upon, and the correct amount of money was transferred. As the poster said, he paid last year's wholesale price for the food, so he probably still got it below retail anyway. A deal's a deal. BTW, every time I receive excess change in a transaction, I give it back.