St. Anger... Some Kind of Monster?

[bassplayer7768521]

To get this out of the way, I'm a huge Metallica fan. That being said, I used to think "St. Anger" was total garbage... until I watched the "Some Kind of Monster" documentary. After I watched it, I listened to the whole album again.

Sure, the album will never be Kill 'Em All, Ride the Lightning, or Master of Puppets, but it's a darn good album. It's a lot different than their other material, it really has a lot of unique sounds to be found if you give it a solid listen.

So the point of this thread is more of a "Hey, St. Anger isn't so bad, is it?" Post away?

[TrooperFarva]

Some Kind of Monster just demonstrated that Lars is an egomaniacal douche, Kirk is spineless, James is a sissy, and Newsted, as we all knew, is awesome.

And St. Anger is still terrible.

And as this is a forum, I'll post my opinion, even if you don't like it. Welcome to the internet.

[Selta]

Originally Posted by TrooperFarva

Some Kind of Monster just demonstrated that Lars is an egomaniacal douche, Kurt is spineless, James is a sissy, and Newsted, as we all knew, is awesome.

And St. Anger is still terrible.

And as this is a forum, I'll post my opinion, even if you don't like it. Welcome to the internet.

I have to agree... Some Kind of Monster didn't change the fact that it was a terrible album for me. And yes, I have given it a "solid listen". More than once. I just can't say it's "good", because, it's not. Especially when you take into account who it is that released it.

[SpamBot]

Originally Posted by TrooperFarva

Some Kind of Monster just demonstrated that Lars is an egomaniacal douche, Kurt is spineless, James is a sissy, and Newsted, as we all knew, is awesome.

And St. Anger is still terrible.

And as this is a forum, I'll post my opinion, even if you don't like it. Welcome to the internet.

+1 to every word of this.

[René_Julien]

Kurt?

[TrooperFarva]

Originally Posted by C'thulhu

Kurt?

Sorry, I got about 9 beers in at lunch. Fixed.

[bassplayer7768521]

Originally Posted by TrooperFarva

Some Kind of Monster just demonstrated that Lars is an egomaniacal douche, Kirk is spineless, James is a sissy, and Newsted, as we all knew, is awesome.

And St. Anger is still terrible.

And as this is a forum, I'll post my opinion, even if you don't like it. Welcome to the internet.

I'm not a big fan of Lars either, James went through rehab and did something great with his life. Kirk is just really passive. As far as Newsted goes... he's been there worst bassist to date. He leaves the greatest band of all time to work on his failure of a side project Echobrain? Yeah, real awesome. He's horrible.

And I'm glad you posted your opinion, I'm not offended or anything, I was just trying to see if anyone thought the same way I did.

[bassplayer7768521]

Originally Posted by Ray Salamon

I have to agree... Some Kind of Monster didn't change the fact that it was a terrible album for me. And yes, I have given it a "solid listen". More than once. I just can't say it's "good", because, it's not. Especially when you take into account who it is that released it.

Yeah, I mean, I think everyone was disappointed that Metallica actually released it, as opposed to another band. Do you think if another band had released it, it wouldn't be viewed as such a commercial failure?

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by MikeMasonRock

I'm not a big fan of Lars either, James went through rehab and did something great with his life. Kirk is just really passive. As far as Newsted goes... he's been there worst bassist to date. He leaves the greatest band of all time to work on his failure of a side project Echobrain? Yeah, real awesome. He's horrible.

And I'm glad you posted your opinion, I'm not offended or anything, I was just trying to see if anyone thought the same way I did.

Jason Newsted got mistreated by that band from day one. He went on to play with Ozzy Osbourne and Voivod, which are great bands (the latter put out a great album while Metallica put out the utter dung that is St. Anger).

He put up with their bullcrap for over a decade just out of love for the music. He doesn't have a family, music is all he does. Eventually he got fed up with all the crap and left so he could be more creative, it's not like they let him write much anyway. If a band mixed my bass tracks out of their album completely, I would walk, no matter who they were. If a band treated me the way they treated Newsted on tour, I would walk. If anyone in a band that I had joined as a full member tried to order me to play a certain thing, I would walk. If a band changed their entire sound and look just to be more marketable or fashionable, I would walk. If a band only let me write a couple songs over a ten year period, I would walk. If a band flat out said that I was prohibited from having musical side projects when the rest of the band was taking a break, I would walk. No matter what band it was. Jason demonstrated incredibly admirable patience in sticking with them for so long despite being so under-appreciated.

I saw Newsted live with Voivod. He's a much greater musician than you or I will ever be. He really gives his all for the music, and he's worthy of some respect. My second favorite Metallica bassist.

Perhaps St. Anger was an album that Metallica needed to make to figure out where they were or whatever. However, it's not an album I need to listen to again. Thankfully, their newest release is much better, it sounds like they're actually working on that record. For me, there is no excuse for musicians of their caliber (except maybe Lars) to release an album like St. Anger. You might say they were going for a minimalist approach, but it didn't work. It's embarrassing, as a fan of music in general. That said, they have redeemed themselves a bit in my eyes, though I wish the sound on the new album was a bit better and that Rob's bass was a bit louder. Oh well.

[bassplayer7768521]

Originally Posted by Sartori

Jason Newsted got mistreated by that band from day one. He went on to play with Ozzy Osbourne and Voivod, which are great bands (the latter put out a great album while Metallica put out the utter dung that is St. Anger).

He put up with their bullcrap for over a decade just out of love for the music. He doesn't have a family, music is all he does. Eventually he got fed up with all the crap and left so he could be more creative, it's not like they let him write much anyway. If a band mixed my bass tracks out of their album completely, I would walk, no matter who they were. If a band treated me the way they treated Newsted on tour, I would walk. If anyone in a band that I had joined as a full member tried to order me to play a certain thing, I would walk. If a band changed their entire sound and look just to be more marketable or fashionable, I would walk. If a band only let me write a couple songs over a ten year period, I would walk. If a band flat out said that I was prohibited from having musical side projects when the rest of the band was taking a break, I would walk. No matter what band it was. Jason demonstrated incredibly admirable patience in sticking with them for so long despite being so under-appreciated.

I saw Newsted live with Voivod. He's a much greater musician than you or I will ever be. He really gives his all for the music, and he's worthy of some respect. My second favorite Metallica bassist.

Perhaps St. Anger was an album that Metallica needed to make to figure out where they were or whatever. However, it's not an album I need to listen to again. Thankfully, their newest release is much better, it sounds like they're actually working on that record. For me, there is no excuse for musicians of their caliber (except maybe Lars) to release an album like St. Anger. You might say they were going for a minimalist approach, but it didn't work. It's embarrassing, as a fan of music in general. That said, they have redeemed themselves a bit in my eyes, though I wish the sound on the new album was a bit better and that Rob's bass was a bit louder. Oh well.

You know, you bring up some great points. It's not his fault for leaving. He was certainly mistreated and he deserved better. I know I demeaned him a bit, which wasn't right. I guess hid Echobrain project was really his thing, where he had a say for once. He did help Metallica make some great records, I guess I just let my idolizing of Cliff Burton get in the way of that at times xD

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by MikeMasonRock

You know, you bring up some great points. It's not his fault for leaving. He was certainly mistreated and he deserved better. I know I demeaned him a bit, which wasn't right. I guess hid Echobrain project was really his thing, where he had a say for once. He did help Metallica make some great records, I guess I just let my idolizing of Cliff Burton get in the way of that at times xD

I'm a huge fan of Cliff Burton, too. Big influence on me, even today, and of course, my favorite Metallica bassist. But do you think he would have let the other guys tell him that he couldn't play music with anyone else? Seems a bit unlikely. And just because I like his bass work best, doesn't mean I can't appreciate Newsted's or Trujillo's work as well.

It's important to remember that Jason Newsted didn't just do Echobrain after leaving Metallica, he played in Ozzy's touring band, has done the bass on three Voivod albums, and released two Papa Wheelie records.

[TrooperFarva]

Originally Posted by MikeMasonRock

I'm not a big fan of Lars either, James went through rehab and did something great with his life. Kirk is just really passive. As far as Newsted goes... he's been there worst bassist to date. He leaves the greatest band of all time to work on his failure of a side project Echobrain? Yeah, real awesome. He's horrible.

And I'm glad you posted your opinion, I'm not offended or anything, I was just trying to see if anyone thought the same way I did.

I don't have a problem with James going to rehab, but he never really stood up to Lars throughout the whole documentary, that was my problem. Just tell Lars to **** off until you get yourself together, it's not that hard.

When Lars decided that there would be no solos on the album, Kirk should have spoke up, but he didn't.

Jason is the only one of the group that actually had his **** together. The commercial success or failure of Echobrain doesn't decide it's value, Jason just wanted to make music, which is a lot more than what the rest of the band wanted.

As far as him being their worst bassist to date, so far there's only been 3, and Trujillo was only on the last album, and he was buried in the mix anyway.

[Depth_Charge]

Originally Posted by TrooperFarva

As far as him being their worst bassist to date, so far there's only been 3, and Trujillo was only on the last album, and he was buried in the mix anyway.

Hetfield played bass on Hit The Lights.
They dumped Ron McGonvey when they poached Cliff from Trauma. Cliff unfortunately died on tour in Sweden, R.I.P Cliff.
Then Jason joined.
Then Bob Rock played on St Anger.
And now Rob Trujillo is in the Metallica lineup.

I count 5. 6 at a stretch.

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by Depth_Charge

Hetfield played bass on Hit The Lights.
They dumped Ron McGonvey when they poached Cliff from Trauma. Cliff unfortunately died on tour in Sweden, R.I.P Cliff.
Then Jason joined.
Then Bob Rock played on St Anger.
And now Rob Trujillo is in the Metallica lineup.

I count 5. 6 at a stretch.

McGovney played on a live demo from 82. So yes, there are recordings of him. Nothing special. Burton, Newsted and Trujillo all are very good, which one you prefer is really just a matter of personal taste.