UPS splinters headstock and ruins hardcase - need help with claim

Mr. Pickles · #1 09-09-2010, 07:44 PM

What Brown can do for me is ruin a perfectly good bass...

UPS delivered a Fender 2004 Jazz Bass Deluxe 5 string to me today. Unfortunately, one of the handlers used it as a javelin.
The tip of the headstock is splintered and the bass apparently punched through the case's plush lining and the foam. The case is pretty warped now and all of the seals are bent. The force of impact was great enough to shift the neck and loosen the 5 neck plate bolts.

However, the headstock damage is purely cosmetic as far as I can tell.

My big concern is that the truss may be damaged as it was VERY difficult to tighten during setup. My secondary concern is that the instrument's value will be lessened should I decide to trade or sell it.

It was insured for $1000. How much of this do you all think I should ask for? The person who shipped me the bass bears no responsibilty and will be filing the claim.

I plan on sending the bass to my tech for stringing and further inspection. I had planned on this bass being my main player, so cosmetics are second to sound and playability.

fleabee · #2 09-09-2010, 07:47 PM

The full $1000 no question..who knows who f'd up it will be in the long run.

Templar · #3 09-09-2010, 09:13 PM

After taking a shot like that, your neck could very well be ruined. Fedex did this to me...the neck was totally screwed, rod jammed, and hairline cracks around the nut area. They reimbursed the entire $450 that it was insured for.

UPS, on the other hand, cracked the headstock on a custom L-2000 of mine....refused to pay or even acknowledge that any damage had occurred.

G&L wanted $600 to recreate and install the custom neck, not to mention the two-way shipping costs. After 5 months of me haranging them, they wore me out.

If I were you, if at all possible, I'd try to get a refund from the seller and let him deal with the insurance weasels.

Heh, this was a nice bass 'til UPS got 'hold of it.

darkstorm · #4 09-09-2010, 09:17 PM

The entire $1,000 of course.

eyeballkid · #5 09-09-2010, 09:23 PM

if you ask for the entire $1000 you will HAVE to surrender the bass to them for the insurance claim.. If you can come up with a justifiable REPAIR figure that is less than the total value, they will pay that and you keep the bass..

i would ask for the price of a new STOCK neck for it and the price of the case. You will need to give them a few real world examples for them to price match to approve the amount.

zacpack · #6 09-09-2010, 09:25 PM

Oh no, you guys are scaring me. I have a bass arriving tomorrow from UPS, I'm really hoping I get a nice guy on my route...

grisezd · #7 09-09-2010, 09:28 PM

My recent experience with UPS on a drum-related claim is that if the driver wasn't shown the damage on delivery, or you don't have the box it came in, or if the packing wasn't what they'd consider adequate (you'd be amazed) you're in for a very long fight. I wouldn't wait for the setup to be complete before I called them if I were in your position. Good luck!

C.Linton · #8 09-09-2010, 09:34 PM

Good luck OP.
I myself have been lucky. I've had about four different instruments shipped to me over the past year and a half via UPS, not a single scratch on any of them. I guess I'm one of those lucky few, I've never had a problem with UPS in the last ten years I've been dealing with them on a regular monthly basis. (I get a LOT of stuff online).

**Staccato** · #9 09-09-2010, 09:38 PM

I wish some sellers would leave all the packing to others.

The two axes I've bought recently with (UPS & Fedex) home delivery were not sufficiently protected with bubble wrap, or other anti-rattle materials inside the case.
And, the alto sax from an ebay seller, that's a whole 'nother story...no bubble or protection for that horn! It rattled and jumped all the way to Indiana.

Templar · #10 09-09-2010, 09:39 PM

Important: Save all the packing crap, box, etc. The insurance inspector will want to see it to determine if they are liable or not.

How well things go for you depends entirely on the inspector's detemination. If his inspection report denies responsibility, you will have a helluva time trying to turn things in your favor.

First thing he/she will look at is the shipping box itself. If it is not damaged, they may claim no responsibility for the damage, and maybe even blame you or the seller. If he, in any way deems the item was improperly packed, guess what...

OTOH, maybe you'll get a sweetheart for an inspector.

Good luck.

Templar · #11 09-09-2010, 09:57 PM

It's not funny when your stuff gets mangled during shipping, but sometimes a little levity helps ease the pain...

Mike19 · #12 09-09-2010, 10:15 PM

You may need to consult a lawyer on this, but I believe that under UCC (Uniform Commercial Code) regs, the seller is responsible for delivering the item in the advertised condition. I'm not sure if the UCC applies to a private non-commercial seller.

Under the UCC, if the item is damaged during shipping, the buyer should return the item to seller (at buyer's cost) ASAP and the seller is then obligated to return the purchase price to the buyer immediately upon recipt of the returned item. Their is a time limit on doing this.

If the seller purchased insurance with the shipper, then only the seller can file a claim with the shipper.

OmnitzGarima · #13 09-09-2010, 10:26 PM

I had a guitar arrive yesterday with a crack in it, and other damage as well. It was advertised as "pristine". The box was beat up, I took pictures of everything as I opened it. I told the seller that I wasn't accepting it. They filed a claim with UPS, but they're waiting for UPS' decision before they issue a refund. UPS picked the guitar up this morning, I should hear tomorrow. In my view I should get a full refund, no questions asked, and I opened a case with eBay and said as much. I don't care who is responsible for the damage, it wasn't me, and I shouldn't be out $2K because the guitar I paid for isn't the guitar I got.

I'll keep you posted.

Mike19 · #14 09-09-2010, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmnitzGarima

I had a guitar arrive yesterday with a crack in it, and other damage as well. It was advertised as "pristine". The box was beat up, I took pictures of everything as I opened it. I told the seller that I wasn't accepting it. They filed a claim with UPS, but they're waiting for UPS' decision before they issue a refund. UPS picked the guitar up this morning, I should hear tomorrow. In my view I should get a full refund, no questions asked, and I opened a case with eBay and said as much. I don't care who is responsible for the damage, it wasn't me, and I shouldn't be out $2K because the guitar I paid for isn't the guitar I got.

I'll keep you posted.

See my post above. Risk of damage during shipping is on seller, not buyer. If the buyer returns the damaged goods then the seller must refund the full purchase price immediately. What happens with the shipper is then the seller's problem. In your case, the seller has no right to delay the refund while it dances around with UPS.

C.Linton · #15 09-09-2010, 11:05 PM

I guess the problem lies in determining if the damage was due to UPS' mishandling, or if the seller packed the item inadequately. Of course , having the UPS investigator determine that could be problematic, A "fox guarding the henhouse" kinda situation. Is there any kind of independent body that looks into these things?

Mikio · #16 09-09-2010, 11:07 PM

UPS just went "oops".

It really sucks man, and if I were you I'd sue them or something.

Jeff K · #17 09-10-2010, 08:13 AM

I sent one of my son's acoustic guitars to him via UPS. It was packed very well in a real nice Guild hard-shell case. Got there cracked in several places. They just flat-out denied my claim, saying "improperly packed". I appealed the decision, and they eventually compromised and gave me the cost of the repairs (rather than replacement cost). I did have to get a couple repair estimates.

So my advice is not to just accept their initial decision. Appeal it, and argue your case to whomever it is assigned to.

grisezd · #18 09-10-2010, 08:43 AM

I should have mentioned that earlier. I've learned that it pays to keep after UPS, specifically the inspector. In the drums case I mentioned, one drum of a rare-ish set was damaged. I could have returned the whole kit for a refund but my wife/drummer really wanted the damn thing. When the seller told us to put the broken drum back in the box to be picked up my wife stuck the drum in the box, minus much of the packing, and handed it over. The inspector refused the seller's claim based on inadequate packing and they appealed to their local UPS sales rep. The rep stepped in, got the inspector to accept our description of the original packing, and eventually the seller got his check, purchased another drum and shipped it to us. Took about 45 days soup to nuts.

Be persistent and patient.

**iriegnome** · #19 09-10-2010, 08:48 AM

You really do not have a choice. Claim the whole $1000 and you will have to provide evidence to prove that price. They usually will pick up the bass and send you the check. Claims with UPS, as long as you keep all your paperwork, are pretty straight forward and easy. YOU HAVE TO DO ALL THE WORK AND FOLLOW THROUGH!!! Do not let time go by without checking on the claim or follow up. Get E-mails from everyone and KEEP EVERYTHING until after you get your money!!!

LeonD · #20 09-10-2010, 08:52 AM

As a side note, when I ship with UPS, I always pay the extra $30 and have UPS do the packing.

This way, if something is damaged, they can't use the stock line that it was improperly packed.