What some people think Bass players should be...

[DaveCustomMade]

I was on another forum and the topic was one of those "what kind of music do you like" threads. I mentioned that I like jazz, the likes of the Flecktones, Chick Corea, Spyro Gyra, Jaco Pastorius, etc. and this was the response from one of the posters:

Must admit that Pastorius is beyond speed, but that's surely not the point of a bass guitarist in the rhythm section. Much the same applies to Rich , Krupa, and our own Phil Seamon, I've met a few, but the one that impressed the most was, all of them, No, Joe Morello playing a piece on his own in 9/16 or was it 16/9 at a drum clinic in Manchester, England. I knew Phil Seamon when he played for Alexis Korner. The best bass players in Jazz used double basses, and along with the Piano made the foundations for the musicians to extemporise on the variable melody lines. Pastorius is a cacophony of selfish sound, and anything with the attachment of fusion is nothing but a collection of them pissing into the wind as far far as they can.

I especially like the part, ".....made the foundations for the MUSICIANS to extemporise...."

I guess bass players aren't musicians? Or am I reading too much into his words? At any rate, this is what I think of his statement,

[I-Love-Ratm]

*Cough*guitarist*cough*

[Sundogue]

Personally I think a bass players role is being a part of the rhythm section, locking in with the drummer and laying down a solid foundation for the rest of the band.

Having said that, I see no reason why a bass player can't also tool around on his bass and play some wickedly cool stuff...as long as that foundation isn't lost in the process.

Now if the rest of the band is doing something supportive so that a bass player can do whatever he feels like within the context of the music, without losing the rhythm, that's cool too.

However, I'm old school, and to say a bass player doesn't have a somewhat defined role to play within the band, then why not let the drummer do as he wishes too, as there is clearly no need for anyone to keep time or lay down a good beat to play off of either.

Some bass players can really pull off some pretty cool stuff and still keep it driving. Others are just wankers who would be better served by having a bass player backing them up while they play "lead bass" (I'm not talking about the truly great bass players...just the lead-guitarists-turned-bass-player types).

[Joe P]

Originally Posted by DaveCustomMade

I was on another forum and the topic was one of those "what kind of music do you like" threads. I mentioned that I like jazz, the likes of the Flecktones, Chick Corea, Spyro Gyra, Jaco Pastorius, etc. and this was the response from one of the posters...

Man... That's just dandy. Was this indirect response to your post?

Y'know: you compare this kind of talk with TB posts, and gotta think 'we've got a pretty decent community here'.

I suppose it also can remind us that it only takes one post like this here to be reposted somewhere else to leave'em thinking that WE're a bunch of dinks. I mean generalized derrogatory statements about 'guitarist: they're all alike!' or whatever is different, but what this guy wrote is definately on a different level of rudeness on a few counts.

One thing I'd like to know is - what were the responses to this this dink? Did his community stand up a little and admonish him?

Joe

[DaveCustomMade]

Yes, Joe. Totally in response.

[Joe P]

Originally Posted by DaveCustomMade

Yes, Joe. Totally in response.

Lovely. I guess that 'puts you in good company', as they say, since Dinkus proclaims that both yours and Jaco's taste in music similarly stinks.

Joe

[MacheteJames]

Whoever made that statement is obviously a narrow minded dunce. I always laugh at people who make statements about music as though there were any kind of concrete, unshakeable truth when it comes to an art form. I find the term "bass guitarist" amusing as well... how british. Certainly no self respecting bassist would use such a term to describe themselves.

[Vox Populi]

I like to think of music as having no boundaries. I wouldn't want to pigeonhole any musician into any defined role that they would have to conform to.

[Against Will]

People who restrict instruments to a 'role' in a band, doom themselves to a lifetime of creating mediocre music. Some of the most incredible music ever created was done so by breaking the perceived 'rules' of music at the time. Sudden the walls were broken down and, hey, there's this who new green pasture that we can play around in!

[Floating teetH]

It's just some guy explaining why he doesn't like fusion. Most people are better at keeping there negative crapola to themselves, but that kind of sillyness should be expected.

Did you destroy him w/ w0rd power?

[BluesBrian]

Originally Posted by I-Love-Ratm

*Cough*guitarist*cough*

I was showing Victor Wooten video from the bass day dvd to some friends .. and the "cough-cough" just couldn't understand why Victor was playing like a "guitarist" .. it was one of the funniest "does not compute" that I've ever seen. darned funny!

[Eldermike]

In my humble opinion. Music is metered tones and intervals. This is not a restrictive rule, there is no end to the possibilities but it can be defined. The tones we play, the intervals we create. On the other hand, noise is unmetered tones without metered intervals. So bad timing or missing intervals is actually noise. When an orchestra begins to warm up they make a collective noise that's the sum of all of them making individual tones and intervals. When the conductor taps the stand the noise stops and then begins the music.
Music has no restrictions on creativity, but it will always have disciplines that sum the tones and guides the intervals. It's the basis of the 100 percent rule.
Where a musician fits within this total is not completely restricted by a choice of instrument. It's restricted by the composition of the music and a musicians ability to play it correctly.

My 2 cents: I don't care what others think of my choice of instruments.

[Adam Barkley]

Kind of a mean way to say you don't like fusion, I guess.

Granted some of that (fusion/wankish in general, not just your examples) stuff is pure musical masturbation. I can stand extreme bass solos up to the point when the music suffers. I enjoy selected examples of most those groups/artists but most of time they go a little to far over the top for me.

Style, tone, and taste are the things that draw me to an artist/bassist. Chops are the last thing I worry about. I dislike both Wooten's and Jaco's respective tones and playing styles. I guess chops just don't rev my engine.

Different Strokes,
Adam Barkley

[swampash]

everyone knows opinions are like (_*_)'s and everyone’s got one, so here’s mine.
This guy should spend less time emphasizing what/who he is (an obvious a-holio), and more time giving an objective opinion about the subject. He's clearly hung up on insecurities beyond anyone’s help, to not acknowledge something for what it is. I don't like fusion or have i made any attempt and trying to own a Jaco album, but that doesn't mean i don't appreciate the music or his contributions to music as a whole

[Not Mark Westlake]

Originally Posted by MacheteJames

Whoever made that statement is obviously a narrow minded dunce. I always laugh at people who make statements about music as though there were any kind of concrete, unshakeable truth when it comes to an art form. I find the term "bass guitarist" amusing as well... how british. Certainly no self respecting bassist would use such a term to describe themselves.

So using your "amazing" theory, do alto saxophonists call themselves "Altists"? The bass is a guitar. It's a "bass guitar". People can choose to call themselves whatever they wish. Bassist or "bass guitarist" is acceptable. So yeah, feel free to chalk me up in your crappy category of "a non-self respecting bassist" at times...

Personally, I can't really stand Jaco's music at all. However, I can appreciate that it's a good show of mastery over a certain instrument, and seeing as musical awareness is based on appreciativeness I guess it still counts for me as "good".

Mark.

[Woodchuck]

This is why tambourine players shouldn't use the computer!

[Not Mark Westlake]

Although you have to admire the way tambourine...er...ists(?) manage to get royalties on records for purely going "chssh chssh" on a song once in a while. Certainly got the system wired in their favour

[MacheteJames]

Originally Posted by Not Mark Westlake

So using your "amazing" theory, do alto saxophonists call themselves "Altists"? The bass is a guitar. It's a "bass guitar". People can choose to call themselves whatever they wish. Bassist or "bass guitarist" is acceptable. So yeah, feel free to chalk me up in your crappy category of "a non-self respecting bassist" at times...

Personally, I can't really stand Jaco's music at all. However, I can appreciate that it's a good show of mastery over a certain instrument, and seeing as musical awareness is based on appreciativeness I guess it still counts for me as "good".

Mark.

Get a grip. It's just not a term that is in general use around here. I don't own or play 6 string electric "little" guitar, and I would not want to give anyone the impression that I did. Like many bass players, I've been in situations (say at a party or gathering of people) where there's been an acoustic guitar present, and someone inevitably chimes in "so james, how about you serenade us, you play guitar right?'

[Floating teetH]

Originally Posted by abark000

Granted some of that (fusion/wankish in general, not just your examples) stuff is pure musical masturbation.

Only of it sucks. Or only the player hears it.

Also, most other musicians could as easily be accused of lyrical masterbation (in the "self worshiping" sense).

edit: replace musicians w/ songwriters.

[page]

Originally Posted by Not Mark Westlake

Although you have to admire the way tambourine...er...ists(?) manage to get royalties on records for purely going "chssh chssh" on a song once in a while. Certainly got the system wired in their favour

Ha, bull, Triangle players rule the music industry. Why, I guarantee Ahmet Ertgrun(sp?) was a triangle virtuoso!