What's your opinion on "selling out"?

[Vic Winters]

I never understood the idea behind hating a band for "selling out". I can completely understand the desire to sign to a major label, not only to help get your music out there, but to make a decent living at playing music. Personally I think if you're a fan, you should support the band big or small, as long as you like the music. Or when a band changes their musical style, "fans" get antsy. Why can't they understand that bands can evolve and still make great music? I mean just look at the Beatles. No one wants to listen to the same album over and over again.

The only people I believe the title "sellout" applies to are people like Avril Lavigne and Ashley Simpson. People who come on so strong about being "non-conformist" and the anti-Britney or the anti-Jessica Simpson. All the while, getting plastic surgery and dying their hair blonde and writing songs that are twice as poppy.

[skaliwag66]

When Money> Music

[santucci218]

Originally Posted by Vic Winters

I never understood the idea behind hating a band for "selling out". I can completely understand the desire to sign to a major label, not only to help get your music out there, but to make a decent living at playing music. Personally I think if you're a fan, you should support the band big or small, as long as you like the music. Or when a band changes their musical style, "fans" get antsy. Why can't they understand that bands can evolve and still make great music? I mean just look at the Beatles. No one wants to listen to the same album over and over again.

The only people I believe the title "sellout" are people like Avril Lavigne and Ashley Simpson. People who come on so strong about being "non-conformist" and the anti-Britney or the anti-Jessica Simpson. All the while, getting plastic surgery and dying their hair blonde and writing songs that are twice as poppy.

Dude, Seriously, dont make fun of my Avril.

[Jezz8me]

there is one band that will never sell out, radiohead. they wil always be about the music not the money and they make a differnet record each time.

Many great bands evolve and people still love them. The strokes change from album to album, blur, arctic monkeys (I am purposely using modern examples of pretty popular bands as opposed to the classics btw)

It is when a band changes to be liked by the majority in a changing their style in (a getting rid of originality way as opposed to using what people like about music and working on it) for money. Many bands do it powderfinger, silverchair i am sure there is better examples but i can't think.

And Avril, Ashlea and all the other pop stars, with the exception of those who earn it with talent, are all children of the record label who got their star eyed dreams played upon to make money for the label. They do not think of it as selling out but how the music business works most probably.

my 2 cents on the subject :P

[kaputsport]

I think selling out is when a band, writes music, and gets a deal... but when they meet the producer, they change drastically.

I am fortunate enough to have Label interest in my band. I will not bat an eyelash if they want us to sign. Honestly, that is the goal. I want to make a living playing bass. Period.

I have my pride, and I have ownership of the music. I will not change much at the expense of the all mighty dolla...

Think of me as a sell out??? Fine... It really doesn't bother me. I would much rather sell out "Madison Square Garden" than your local pub...

Cheers...

[Spector_Ray]

I like using Metallica as an analogy. When they were struggling, they heard people were bootlegging their tapes, but they encouraged it. Get out music out to as many people as possible. They did this out of necessity because radio stations and MTV wouldn't give them the time of day. Their music was what people wanted in that genre. It was fast, furious, powerful and full of piss and vinegar.
Fast forward 15-18 years later and Napster. When people were trading their files online, all of a sudden Metallica looked at it as stealing. Why the change of heart by the band? They finally made it to MTV and a bigger audience so they changed their style of music to fit into what was happening at the time. Fans felt betrayed because Metallica bucked the system back in the early days and became the biggest metal band of the 80's with only the help of the fans. They took it personally and when they turned their backs on their fans musicwise, it was deemed a sellout by the band. Most hardcore Metallica fans then turned their backs on them.

My question is if the band is making music for themselves or their fans? Whichever is the case, as long as you stick to what you started with, you're not selling out. Stay true to your roots.

[Philbiker]

"selling out" is a meaningless term used by people who don't know better.

[Phalex]

Originally Posted by Philbiker

"selling out" is a meaningless term used by people who don't know better.

Exactly! My current drummer was in a band in the 90's that got signed to Pioneer music group. I guess they took a lot of crap for "selling out". Before they left for the Horde tour they had a big party and they all wore shirts emblazoned with the word "sellout" in letters 5 inches tall. He still wear it from time to time.

There are starving artists, and there are sellouts. Sellouts still starve to a certain degree, but at least they're riding around the country in a tour bus!

[mjolnir]

Originally Posted by skaliwag66

When Money> Music

That about sums it up right there.

[Bob Clayton]

Originally Posted by skaliwag66

When Money> Music

</end of thread>

[The Golden Boy]

When I was a kid, the concept of "selling out" was one I could liberally throw at any band that I felt I was somehow ethically above.

I spent 20 years writing and playing music- and lost tons of money in the process. Then I got involved with cover bands. I got paid. It's much easier, especially being all old family guy now, to learn a song rather than to write and create parts and find the time to rehearse it.

Is that really "selling out?"

Music still isn't about money to me- however it's nice getting paid at the end of the night. I know people that won't play without money in hand. I hope I never turn into that.

Music is about playing.

[superbassman2000]

I attribute accusations of selling out to jealousy.

[Mr. Black]

"selling out" is a meaningless term used by people who don't know better.

I can agree with this.....

I really get tired of hearing the term... It applies sometimes but not all the time. I know of people that completely snub some music just because it is released by a major label. Regardless of the quality of the music.

I have heard this term slapped onto bands for YEARS that really don't deserve it. Tool, Rage Against The Machine & AudioSlave, Green Day, Pearl Jam, Nirvana, Metallica & Megadeth, etc, etc, etc......

These are bands that deserve what they got, IMHO. When you hear them on the radio, you know who they are. They have created a sound and many were easily recognizalbe when they were/are releasing new material. That says alot.

Musical tastes sometimes change in people after playing for years & years & years...... This is not "selling out"..... as some people might think, It's just the way it is. I grew up on hardcore, metal, & grind..... Doesn't mean that I still want to play it. It got boring. I still listen to it at times. Some people think it to be pretty lame of me.... Oh, well....

I think selling out is when a band, writes music, and gets a deal... but when they meet the producer, they change drastically.

+1....

Me & my current band had a discussion about who has "Sold Out" & who hasn't..... It went on for about two hours & didn't get any where.......

It's like arguing about politics. You're basically chasing you're tail.

This is however, just my $.02.

[StanFan]

Originally Posted by Spector_Ray

I like using Metallica as an analogy. When they were struggling, they heard people were bootlegging their tapes, but they encouraged it. Get out music out to as many people as possible. They did this out of necessity because radio stations and MTV wouldn't give them the time of day. Their music was what people wanted in that genre. It was fast, furious, powerful and full of piss and vinegar.
Fast forward 15-18 years later and Napster. When people were trading their files online, all of a sudden Metallica looked at it as stealing. Why the change of heart by the band? They finally made it to MTV and a bigger audience so they changed their style of music to fit into what was happening at the time. Fans felt betrayed because Metallica bucked the system back in the early days and became the biggest metal band of the 80's with only the help of the fans. They took it personally and when they turned their backs on their fans musicwise, it was deemed a sellout by the band. Most hardcore Metallica fans then turned their backs on them.

My question is if the band is making music for themselves or their fans? Whichever is the case, as long as you stick to what you started with, you're not selling out. Stay true to your roots.

IMO, when you can go to just about any music store and find most of Metallica's albums at reasonable prices, there is no need to trade such a readily available product for free.

[Yngwie 4String]

when you generate a fanbase playing awesome epic music like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEL6_SuQCu8

to playing crappy stupid crap like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zbuk96kW9LM

And sueing the fans that made you popular in the first place.

"my lifestyle determines my death style" wtg Dr. Seuss

[SoComSurfing]

"Sell Out"

[verse]
well, I know you can't work in fast food all your life
but don't sign that paper tonight, she said,
but it's too late.

And I don't remember what I read,
don't remember what they said,
I guess it doesn't matter,
I guess it doesn't matter anymore.

[chorus]
you're gonna go to the record store
you're gonna give 'em all your money
radio plays what they want you to hear
they tell me it's cool but I just don't believe it...

sell out, with me oh yea, sell out, with me tonight
record company's gonna give me lots of money
and everything's gonna be (all right).

[verse]
no more flippin' burgers puttin' on my silly hat
you know I don't want that no more,
And I didn't ask when we'd get paid, I quit my day job anyway,
I guess it doesn't matter, I guess it doesn't matter anymore

[chorus]
You're gonna go to the record store,
you're gonna give 'em all your money,
radio plays what they want you to hear,
they tell me it's cool, I just don't believe it

sell out, with me oh yea, sell out
with me tonight, the records company's only give me
lots of money and everything's gonna be.

[bridge]
I don't think it'll be so bad
I know it won't be so bad
cause the man said "that's the way it is"
and the man said "it don't get better than this" no no no noo

[chorus]
so I signed on to the record company,
they say they're gonna give me lot's of money,
if I play what they want you to hear
they tell me it's cool, and I sure believe it...

sell out, with me oh yea, sell out, with me tonight
the record companies gonna give me lots of money and
everything's gonna be (all right).

[rfclef]

I hope that one day I am good enough to be accused of selling out...

(on an unrelated note... did I mention I am getting a Birdsong?)

[skaliwag66]

Originally Posted by Jezz8me

there is one band that will never sell out, radiohead. they wil always be about the music not the money and they make a differnet record each time.

I'm sorry but I laughed throughout this whole post.

[Joey3313]

Selling out is the changing of musical and visual style to something more radio friendly in hopes of gaining more album sales.

Avril and the like did not sell out for the simple fact that they were manufactured garbage from the start. To "sell out" something must change, and since nothing was established for them, nothing CAN change. That stuff deserves less respect that "sell outs". I read a quote from Avril once where she claimed to be "like, the next Sid Vicious." I'm waiting for her to wind up in a gutter strung out on heroin. I may be waiting a while. Poser.

Selling out is not to be confused with evolution, as every band must grow. That happens over time and is gradual. Selling out is an over night thing. "BAM! We're pop now".

Signing to a major label does not always constitute selling out. If you play the same music and resist label intervention in the writing process, you haven't sold out. If you sign and start to sound like Creed, you sold out.

I suppose the musical scene you are involved with determines your beliefs on the matter. Most people in the radio rock genre would love to be signed to Warner, while the bands playing in Gilman would rather die. To each his own I suppose.

[Jeff Martinez]

Originally Posted by santucci218

Dude, Seriously, dont make fun of my Avril.

+1

Originally Posted by Spector_Ray

I like using Metallica as an analogy. When they were struggling, they heard people were bootlegging their tapes, but they encouraged it. Get out music out to as many people as possible. They did this out of necessity because radio stations and MTV wouldn't give them the time of day. Their music was what people wanted in that genre. It was fast, furious, powerful and full of piss and vinegar.
Fast forward 15-18 years later and Napster. When people were trading their files online, all of a sudden Metallica looked at it as stealing. Why the change of heart by the band? They finally made it to MTV and a bigger audience so they changed their style of music to fit into what was happening at the time. Fans felt betrayed because Metallica bucked the system back in the early days and became the biggest metal band of the 80's with only the help of the fans. They took it personally and when they turned their backs on their fans musicwise, it was deemed a sellout by the band. Most hardcore Metallica fans then turned their backs on them.

Great analogy. Although, one of my favorite quotes is from "A Year and a Half in the Life of Metallica". Jason Newsted says, "...a lot of people are saying that we've sold out. I say "yep"... every seat in every venue, every night".