Working Out and the Bass Player's Hands

[wld3]

This may seem a bit odd but I recently read (I think in the 101 Tips book by Gary Willis) that you, as a bass player, have to be careful when working out in the gym. That is, he suggested using machines as opposed to free weights because the latter involves your grip much more and may affect your hands (fingers, I presume) in a negative way.

However, I also read an article by John Halstrom, who writes for Mel Bay, that squeezing a racquetball is "tremendous for hand and finger strength" and that bass players should keep a few around.

This would seem to be conflicting information as it pertains to exercise and grip.

I don't keep racquetballs around (though I'm not opposed to the idea if it is of any benefit) but I do work out at a gym. Is the cautionary advice I refer to above something I should be concerned about?

[bassteban]

Are you calling a racquetball a 'free weight'?

[jon118]

No, he would be using it as a finger exerciser. I've heard of people doing that with tennis balls, but I would think a racquetball would work pretty well in the same situation.

[wld3]

Originally Posted by bassteban

Are you calling a racquetball a 'free weight'?

Uh. No.

In the former advice, the use of free weights is discouraged because it involves the grip more so than weight machines, which are suggested as an alternative.

However, in the latter advice, the use of racquetball, squeezing one specifically for the purpose of exercising the grip, is advised.

I inquired about this since the latter concept of squeezing a ball for grip exercise seems to be conflicting with the idea of avoiding involving the grip in exercise, such as with the use of the free weights in the gym.

[Jazzdogg]

Perhaps it has to do with the kinds of muscles that are being developed, and whether they'll be a help or a hindrance for instrument(s) and kind of music you play. I strive to build endurance while balancing strength and flexibility. Each hand is used differently, and benefits from different exercises.

While stamina is vital for both hands, developing a vice-like left-hand grip is more helpful when playing DB, and developing fast-twitch muscles is more of a necessity for my right hand when playing electric.

When I spend a day handling lumber and using hand tools, I need to limber-up my right hand a lot more than my left hand before I play the bass. OTOH, when I'm spending more time at the computer than working with my hands, I seem to play better when I add strength-building exercises to my daily routine.

Before I could come up with exercises to help me as a bassist, I needed to acknowledge and accommodate some injuries that limit my playing abilities, and develop specific goals and exercises for each hand. Hope this helps.

[BullHorn]

You're worrying about things that you shouldn't.

[wld3]

Originally Posted by BullHorn

You're worrying about things that you shouldn't.

Asking is not worrying... just asking.

[bassteban]

Sorry- I was half-asleep, & it read to me as if you were concerned about the weight of a racquetball. Silly, yes- but I think we've all seen worse here.
On topic, I can't see a bit of improvement in grip strength hurting anything; all things in moderation, eh? BTW, I'm roughly 3/4 awake now, so be patient w/me.

[wld3]

I would have a bit of a dispute about the whole 'free weight vs. machine affecting your grip theory' anyway. On some machines your grip is definitely not as important (many pressing exercises), however, on others (rows, curls, etc.) your grip is very much engaged, as much as with free weights. The main difference between the two has always been the need to recruit other muscles to help with controlling free weights as opposed to machines, not really anything grip-related (with the possible exception of bent-over rows.)

Ultimately, I personally tend to think its a non-issue unless you start to experience some pain or problem with your grip/hands either in the gym or with your instrument. Of course, as the previous poster indicated, you could always overdo it in the gym if you were so inclined.

[OtterOnBass]

So the other day I decide to fill in the festering mudhole in my driveway - it stunk like something in there died. So I take a shovel around the house to find some excess dirt and see the lawn around the back stairs is higher than it should be. I start digging to bring the level down and carry the dirt to the mudhole in front. There's a brick patio for a landing at the bottom of the stairs and I'm digging around the edge of it. Then I think, yeah, I need to pull all these bricks out and re-level the landing at the bottom of the stairs, and I do. I've got them all out and find the reason they're uneven is these massive roots. So I start chopping away with the edge of the shovel. It's hard work, but I'm too far in to stop now. My forearms are killing me, my fingers can barely grip the shovel and my back is toast. Then I remembered that I'm going to play an outdoor gig tonight.

What was I thinking!?! I don't recommend using those weights prior to performances.

[Jazzdogg]

Originally Posted by OtterOnBass

So the other day I decide to fill in the festering mudhole in my driveway - it stunk like something in there died. So I take a shovel around the house to find some excess dirt and see the lawn around the back stairs is higher than it should be. I start digging to bring the level down and carry the dirt to the mudhole in front. There's a brick patio for a landing at the bottom of the stairs and I'm digging around the edge of it. Then I think, yeah, I need to pull all these bricks out and re-level the landing at the bottom of the stairs, and I do. I've got them all out and find the reason they're uneven is these massive roots. So I start chopping away with the edge of the shovel. It's hard work, but I'm too far in to stop now. My forearms are killing me, my fingers can barely grip the shovel and my back is toast. Then I remembered that I'm going to play an outdoor gig tonight.

What was I thinking!?! I don't recommend using those weights prior to performances.

+1 A friend (who is an extraordinary drummer) was told by his teacher to change his exercise routine, saying that he was becoming too "muscle bound," which was hampering his flexibility.

[wld3]

Originally Posted by Jazzdogg

+1 A friend (who is an extraordinary drummer) was told by his teacher to change his exercise routine, saying that he was becoming too "muscle bound," which was hampering his flexibility.

This is a bit of a common myth. While it is true in extreme cases of muscular development that ROM can be lessened, for most of us, proper strength training will increase, not decrease, flexibility.

Even so, his instructor may have noticed a problem that could have been the result of your friend using partial reps (which can result in developing a shortened ROM) in his lifting or perhaps that was simply due to repeated/ongoing muscle soreness/fatigue, which kept him from performing to his best. In either case, the guidance to 'change' his routine may have very well been solid even if the specifics of the comment were not.

[kesslari]

If I was in a postition where I was auditioning for Tribal Tech or Return to Forever, I might think about it.
As it is, grip strength is more useful in my life than not, and has not negatively impacted my bass playing.
Grip strength is one of the most real-world-useful aspects of strength. I will probably never have to push a heavy weight off my chest (bench press...) but often have to carry heavy objects (grip strength).

[Phil Smith]

Originally Posted by wld3

This may seem a bit odd but I recently read (I think in the 101 Tips book by Gary Willis) that you, as a bass player, have to be careful when working out in the gym. That is, he suggested using machines as opposed to free weights because the latter involves your grip much more and may affect your hands (fingers, I presume) in a negative way.

If Gary Willis has used a proper weight training program and it affected his playing in a negative way I would say consider his advice.

[Indiana Mike]

I have been lifting weights seriously for the last seven months. I have gained a lot of size and strength. I have lost over six inches off my waist but my body weight has stayed almost the same!

I do change up routines every two months or so just to fight boredom and the argued myth of the memory effect and the loss of ability to keep gaining strength.
Your body gets used to the same thing and stops responding to it. It just maintains.

I started on machines for two months and slowly introduced free weights and now thats about 90% off my workout.
I have also incorporated a wrist/forearm specific routine . I thought it would hurt ROM ETC... . The opposite has happened.


I have better range of motion and flexibility.
I have more stamina in all aspects of my life.
I have more strength and power .
I have a hell of a lot less stress to deal with.


I have found it has helped my playing a lot. True , I do not play out in a band ATM and may never , but I do play 10+ hours a week.


The biggest problem I have is the huge calluses I have to cut off my hands and file smooth weekly.

The problem I see at the gym ???
Someone new going at it to hard to fast and injuring muscles and or joints.

go hit the gym

[MaskedJackal]

Indiana Mike, well said, sir. I'm in almost the exact same situation. I think it's ALL about being careful when lift weights. Can't rush progress...just do what your body is comfortable with and work up steadily.

[Lesfunk]

Considering that Jeff Berlin is a boxer (which involves hitting things with your hands), I suspect most workouts are safe. Zawinul boxed too.

[BullHorn]

Originally Posted by OtterOnBass

So the other day I decide to fill in the festering mudhole in my driveway - it stunk like something in there died. So I take a shovel around the house to find some excess dirt and see the lawn around the back stairs is higher than it should be. I start digging to bring the level down and carry the dirt to the mudhole in front. There's a brick patio for a landing at the bottom of the stairs and I'm digging around the edge of it. Then I think, yeah, I need to pull all these bricks out and re-level the landing at the bottom of the stairs, and I do. I've got them all out and find the reason they're uneven is these massive roots. So I start chopping away with the edge of the shovel. It's hard work, but I'm too far in to stop now. My forearms are killing me, my fingers can barely grip the shovel and my back is toast. Then I remembered that I'm going to play an outdoor gig tonight.

What was I thinking!?! I don't recommend using those weights prior to performances.

Just because you're out of shape doesn't mean it's bad for you.

When i was enlisted, i was out of shape, but a few months proved to af enough to get anyone back in shape. All you need is a nasty sergeant yelling at you.

[SpaceYourBass]

I usually use free weights in the gym because I prefer them. As far as bass goes, working out helps my back more than my hands. No more back soreness unless I'm really trying to mess my back up. Machine weights are good...if you want to keep those hands nice and soft for your girlfriend's pretty face...aw how sweet . Just kiddin, to each his own.

I learned in biology, there are three types of muscle

Slow twitch, intermediate twitch, and fast twitch. Marathon runners have an abundance of slow twitch muscles (slow oxidative muscles) for a good steady pace as the miles go on. Sprinters have a lot of fast twitch (fast glycolytic) muscles for that huge burst of speed to get down the track in seconds. Both groups usually have less intermediate muscle (slow glycolytic) because it has been replaced with fast or slow twitch depending on their needs.

The average Joe, in average, somewhat healthy shape will have a balance of slow, fast, and intermediate twitch muscles. A person bed-ridden from a bad back injury has a comparative ton of intermediate twitch muscles. The fast and slow muscles have deteriorated with no use, but the body can build intermediate muscle rapidly. This doesn't have anything to do with bass but I thought it was interesting.

For our instrument, we technically need strong slow oxidative muscles in the back and legs for standing up with a heavy guitar. Running or most any cardio will achieve this. For the arms we probably need all three. The fingers need well defined fast twitch muscles for those short burts of funky goodness. Any wieght exercise that involves pulling the weight to me gives my fingers a good workout. Squats are a great exercise for the legs, back, chest/arm dexterity, and the grip, believe it or not. Squats are probably the greatest most bestest all around weight exercise ever.

So really just make sure you balance your workout. Playing is the best thing to do as long as it doesn't hurt. If you have a really long torso like me, go running (jogging to be exact) and do squats to strengthen your back and legs.

Oh and there's that little bar thing you can put under your strings, it makes them harder to play for practice.

[jollygiantchris]

Squats can be terrible for your shoulders and back if not done with perfect form keep that in mind. And most beginners have terrible form.