Yer Sound...

[jeffb]

...is in yer hands and nowhere else. If you think pickups, strings, amps or any other material stuff is gonna fundamentally change yer sound then you don't HAVE a sound.

I'll save myself the hassle of replying to anyone inclined to argue this by saying in advance that you're gear weenie morons without any real clue as to what this gear is really all about which is to make music not to "get sounds". Instead of replying to this why don't all y'all spend the time trying to pull yer heads outta yer wanker butts instead?

You're welcome.

jeffb

[BurningSkies]

Corny.

[HeavyDuty]

Please don't feed the troll...

[Mike Money]

Originally Posted by jeffb

...is in yer hands and nowhere else. If you think pickups, strings, amps or any other material stuff is gonna fundamentally change yer sound then you don't HAVE a sound.

I'll save myself the hassle of replying to anyone inclined to argue this by saying in advance that you're gear weenie morons without any real clue as to what this gear is really all about which is to make music not to "get sounds". Instead of replying to this why don't all y'all spend the time trying to pull yer heads outta yer wanker butts instead?

You're welcome.

jeffb

So really, I should sound the same with a warwick and an ampeg as I would with a fender and an SWR?

[BeyondFiredUp]

Yes, I must almost entirely agree with jeffb, fundamentally. Even though certain equipment helps and some hinders I believe and have experienced that it's the WAY YOU ATTACK the bass will make very much the difference in "yer sound". That's whether you play with fingers OR a pick too. You can even attack differently with a pick than the next guy can; the way you hold it, the angle, how hard, etc. And of course then for finger playing it's the finger attack, or thumb, where your fingers are on the bass while attacking, plucking or banging, or just barely fingering the notes. Then there is the issue of the fretting hand and how you hammer the frets or not and how you stacatto or lagatto, and "how" if that makes sense. I hope this makes sense to someone, it's just not stuff I read in a textbook but it's how it works for me, and how you get "yer sound".

[TheNerdBass]

Then what is the point of different pickups... and the tone knob. I think that has something to do with it. Effects also create my sound too. I can't get a wah by doing something different with my hand. Unless of course... I say "wah" while playing... lol, the poor man's wah pedal.

[Knavery]

Originally Posted by TheNerdBass

Then what is the point of different pickups... and the tone knob. I think that has something to do with it. Effects also create my sound too. I can't get a wah by doing something different with my hand. Unless of course... I say "wah" while playing... lol, the poor man's wah pedal.

I agree. I played guitar for years before playing bass, and pick-up configurations make a HUGE difference in what a player gets out of his/her instrument. It's more noticeable on a guitar due to the higher frequencies.

I agree that you have to have technique and style in your playing, but to completely dismiss gear as a factor is ridiculous. To me, it's a non-argument.

[tplyons]

I'll take a dozen Fenders, hand them all to one "really good player" and I'll bet anyone with ears can tell the difference.

[Matt Till]

Bull****. No offense, but Bull****... actually if you want, you can take offense to that. The "tone is in your hands" speech is cute, I've heard it a million times and it's a nice thought and has certain truths to it, but no. If you were to give someone like Les Claypool (not a question of his talents, but of someone with a distinctive sound), took away his gear, and put him in front of some crappy PA system not made for bass at all that pumps at about 20 Watts and handed him a Rouge bass... he would sound like a Les Claypool wannabe. Because his phrasing and feel would still be there, but that would even be affected due to having to change to deal with bad action on a bass or whatever.

I'm glad I started out on cheap gear, it made me appreciate nice gear. I do think I sound like me when I pick up some random bass, but gear matters a whole lot.

[MAJOR METAL]

I like Sadowsky.

[Monkey]

I agree with "don't feed the troll", but I can't help but throw a peanut to the squirrel...

My sound is mainly in my fingers and my head. But that being said, you have to be willing to invest in your craft. I play a custom-built (by me!) semi-hollow five-string fretless with flatwounds, and my choice of cabs and amp. I sat in the other day with a band and used the bass player's Jazz bass (that really needed a good set-up) with roundwounds and a small Behringer amp. I sounded fine, and sounded like "me", but nowhere near as good as I do with my bass and amp setup.

I play about 75-100 paying gigs a year, and if I showed up with a POS bass and a 15-watt practice amp, I would lose my jobs, because I wouldn't be able to hold down the bottom end.

Jeffb sounds like someone who plays bass in their bedroom a lot.... Fortunately, I get PAID to play bass in different bands, which means I am expected to be professional in my gear, my attitude, and my sound.

[BeyondFiredUp]

The point started I believe has been misinterpreted. If I understood his post correctly, the point was made that the FUNDAMENTAL SOUND you get is how you play, and i put in my 2cents that I believe it is how you attack the bass gives you a personal sound that is "yer sound" FUNDAMENTALLY. I thought the intention of the post was that and if that was the intention then I stand by my reply to his post FUNDAMENTALLY.
GOOD GEAR ADDS AND ENHANCES, EFFECTS DO WHAT THEY DO, BUT YOU do the playin' to get "yer sound". Grace and peace to all.

[spc]

Troll, thanks for posting your thoughts, troll, must be so busy with gigs that you forgot to fill out your profile, troll.

[Munjibunga]

What a wonderful place is the TalkBass. We welcome and encourage even the mentally retarded to post.

[Mike Miles]

Why is everyone attacking Jeffb when he's pretty much right? I quite often have to use borrowed gear, and quite frankly, I think I sound almost exactly the same in just about every piece of different gear I've ever plugged into. Or at least I can find the sound I like in every piece of gear I've used no matter what it is. Sure, we all have preferences, but when it comes right down to it, tone is in your hands.

Or not...maybe some of you don't really have a tone. So don't blame Jeffb for that. Besides, many of you ARE gear weenies, but you don't want to hear that. You want to hear how equipment is going to make you play better. You want to hear how spending $3000 on a bass or $300 on new pickups is going to make you be able to slap better. You want to hear how the new amp you paid way too much money for is going to make you the be-all and end-all in your town. Sorry, but it's true.

I saw a guy get his head handed to him on here because he told some other guy who was wanting to replace pickups to get a better slap sound to practice more and don't worry about the pickups. Well sorry, but the guy SHOULD practice more and worry about the equipment less.

So don't go blaming Jeffb for being a troll. He's right. It's just that a lot of you don't want to own up to it.

And BTW, Munji, that was a pretty crappy thing to say. Maybe if you listened more and criticized less, you might learn something...or do you already know everything?

Also, if you gave Les Claypool a cheap bass through a cheap PA, there's not a doubt in my mind he'd still kick major ass. Les is a professional, not a gear weenie.

[ADbassman]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

What a wonderful place is the TalkBass. We welcome and encourage even the mentally retarded to post.

TalkBass is an equal opportunity message board.

[jeffb]

Originally Posted by BeyondFiredUp

The point started I believe has been misinterpreted. If I understood his post correctly, the point was made that the FUNDAMENTAL SOUND you get is how you play, and i put in my 2cents that I believe it is how you attack the bass gives you a personal sound that is "yer sound" FUNDAMENTALLY. I thought the intention of the post was that and if that was the intention then I stand by my reply to his post FUNDAMENTALLY.
GOOD GEAR ADDS AND ENHANCES, EFFECTS DO WHAT THEY DO, BUT YOU do the playin' to get "yer sound". Grace and peace to all.

You completely got it where nobody else did even slightly.
Thank you.

And yeah it was a full on troll just to see if the same old jerks were saying the same old shyte.
You are.
All y'all think I'm saying a Rick and a Jazz and an SVT and an Eden sound the same don't ya? Morons.

[MJ5150]

Originally Posted by HeavyDuty

Please don't feed the troll...

-Mike

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by Mike Miles

Why is everyone attacking Jeffb when he's pretty much right? I quite often have to use borrowed gear, and quite frankly, I think I sound almost exactly the same in just about every piece of different gear I've ever plugged into. Or at least I can find the sound I like in every piece of gear I've used no matter what it is. Sure, we all have preferences, but when it comes right down to it, tone is in your hands.

Or not...maybe some of you don't really have a tone. So don't blame Jeffb for that. Besides, many of you ARE gear weenies, but you don't want to hear that. You want to hear how equipment is going to make you play better. You want to hear how spending $3000 on a bass or $300 on new pickups is going to make you be able to slap better. You want to hear how the new amp you paid way too much money for is going to make you the be-all and end-all in your town. Sorry, but it's true.

I saw a guy get his head handed to him on here because he told some other guy who was wanting to replace pickups to get a better slap sound to practice more and don't worry about the pickups. Well sorry, but the guy SHOULD practice more and worry about the equipment less.

So don't go blaming Jeffb for being a troll. He's right. It's just that a lot of you don't want to own up to it.

And BTW, Munji, that was a pretty crappy thing to say. Maybe if you listened more and criticized less, you might learn something...or do you already know everything?

Also, if you gave Les Claypool a cheap bass through a cheap PA, there's not a doubt in my mind he'd still kick major ass. Les is a professional, not a gear weenie.

Two trolls in one thread. It's not a record, but it's a start. FWIW, I own eleven basses and four amps, a confessed "gear weenie". You are going to have a very hard time convincing me that you can get the same sound out of my Zon through a WT-800 and 410XLT as you get from my Sadowsky through an Aguilar DB 750 with a 210XLT and 115XL. Yes, how and where one attacks the strings can provide significant variation in the sound of the bass. However, the statement, "...is in yer hands and nowhere else. If you think pickups, strings, amps or any other material stuff is gonna fundamentally change yer sound then you don't HAVE a sound" is one of a very young, inexperienced, and/or mentally deficient individual. If said individual had the means to acquire the best equipment, my bet is that his view would change dramatically.

He's using a Tannoy "cab"?

Further, while I'm not ordinarily big on post counts, comparing your 10 posts to my 9,000+ posts might give you an indication of how much opportunity I've had to learn things here. The "it's all in the hands" thing has been discussed at great length here, and the intellectually honest are curious as to why most pros use high-quality gear.

Trust me, after five years on the board, I know a troll when I see one and I, among others, am not usually cordial to them, because we don't want them to feel welcome, unless they want to learn something or make a real contribution.

[Mike Miles]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

Two trolls in one thread. It's not a record, but it's a start. FWIW, I own eleven basses and four amps, a confessed "gear weenie". You are going to have a very hard time convincing me that you can get the same sound out of my Zon through a WT-800 and 410XLT as you get from my Sadowsky through an Aguilar DB 750 with a 210XLT and 115XL. Yes, how and where one attacks the strings can provide significant variation in the sound of the bass. However, the statement, "...is in yer hands and nowhere else. If you think pickups, strings, amps or any other material stuff is gonna fundamentally change yer sound then you don't HAVE a sound" is one of a very young, inexperienced, and/or mentally deficient individual. If said individual had the means to acquire the best equipment, my bet is that his view would change dramatically.

Well, aren't you Mama's special little rich angel boy? I happen to know Jeffb from other places on the net, and not only does he have the money to buy whatever he wants, he is a hell of a good bassist. I think he made it totally clear that different gear does sound different. He's just sick of gear weenies like you talking about gear like it makes a lick of difference whether you're any good or not.

I have never heard you play, but regarding your gear list, I couldn't really give a crap. It's possible to suck just as much using state of the art gear as it is with the cheap stuff. James Jamerson and Jaco never needed anything more than an average Fender and a solid, working amp. Hmmm...would I rather listen to them or you? I am no more impressed by your gear list than I am by the newbie who owns a Rondo and a Crate amp. You want to impress me, dude, buy me dinner at Ruth's Chris Steakhouse.