Aebersold Play Alongs ??

[ejuzek]

Any recommendation on Play Alongs (with CD included) ?
Volume 7 Miles Davis ? Sonny Rollins ? Is there any other Play Alongs good enough for Bass ?

ciao,

e.c.

[Sam Sherry]

The wonder of being a jazz bassist is that you can play along with THE REAL STUFF just by turning down the bass on your stereo. Aebersold is, no doubt, a great aid for horn-players etc. But I'd much rather get my ass electronically kicked by Louis Hayes and Dexter Gordon than slug along with solo-less discs.

[olivier]

Completamente de acuerdo con Sam.

and, again, let me chime in for Transcribe! a great program that enables one to slow down or change the pitch of a tune from a CD. Try it.

Tengo que confesar that I have & use the "Blues in all keys" volume.

[Bruce Lindfield]

I like the volumes of music by Freddie Hubbard,Horace Silver and John Coltrane - 60,18 and 27 - which has Ron Carter on bass!!

I also use Vol 21 - "Getting it Together" for practicing as well as Vol 24 "Major and Minor" to make sure I'm covering all keys!!

But I think my favorite at the moment is not an Aebersold, but the Mingus "More than Playalong" - which has some great music and a great band made up of members of the Mingus big band - 2 CDs - one with solos on, one without, for you to solo over. It also has transcriptions of Mingus's bass parts and solos!!

[scott reed]

Sam, Aebersold is a great aid for horn players -
not just for practice but for performance. I
know of a trumpet player and a guitarist here in
Memphis who have used them on gigs - indoors and
outside with the help of a PA. One Beale St wag
even had cardboard cutouts of the rhythm section
behind him for more realism.
Years ago I heard a trumpet playing colleague tell
an audience of students that, "The idea of an
interactive rhythm section is highly overrated."
I wonder how much of an influence these playalongs
have had on jazz performance; I mean, does a
soloist come to expect this kind of accompaniment
or are they "thrown off their game" because a
live rhythm section maybe "better" or "worse" than
the player has become accustomed to?
On the other hand, where can you find a band that
will play Giant Steps in all 12 keys for two
hours while you get it together? The exercise
volumes are useful but I'm with you - put on a
cd/record/tape and play with the masters!

[Sam Sherry]

Originally posted by scott reed
I know of a trumpet player and a guitarist here in Memphis who have used them on gigs - indoors and outside with the help of a PA. One Beale St wag even had cardboard cutouts of the rhythm section behind him for more realism.

Years ago I heard a trumpet playing colleague tell an audience of students that, "The idea of an interactive rhythm section is highly overrated."

Man, that's so sad.

I wonder how much of an influence these playalongs have had on jazz performance; I mean, does a soloist come to expect this kind of accompaniment or are they "thrown off their game" because a live rhythm section maybe "better" or "worse" than the player has become accustomed to?

“Risk is what moves all of us forward. If you’re playing in your comfort zone, that ain’t jazz.” -- Herbie Hancock

[BassGuyNL]

If you are, like me, still in the proces of learning how to build good walking lines, the Aebersold series is great. Like someone said above, these guys just keep on playing with unbelievable patience, while you get it together.
Also, after you have been practicing lines on your own without realizing that you hesitate more than you think, playing with the Aebersold tunes give you this "real world" sense that the train of the rhythm section has to keep moving along. It may be a wake-up call that you are not as ready to play in a live situation than you thought you would be.
Last, they are a great source for copying good lines. I especially like Steve Gilmore's, but Ron Carter's and John Goldsby's are also great. Some volumes have accopmpanying transcriptions of the bass lines!

[Samie]

Originally posted by Sam Sherry
The wonder of being a jazz bassist is that you can play along with THE REAL STUFF just by turning down the bass on your stereo. Aebersold is, no doubt, a great aid for horn-players etc. But I'd much rather get my ass electronically kicked by Louis Hayes and Dexter Gordon than slug along with solo-less discs.

No way!! i cannot agree lol

Have u ever tried playing on an electric those aebersole walking basses? great stuff to study and transcribe!! Nothing to do with those lame walking bass instructional books/CD/DVD/VHS.

Some of the best DB player are featured on those records. They absolutely brake all "rules" they dont limit their playing to root/5th etc. There are all kids of subs and alternative chording! Lots to be learned.

If you want to learn to walk, aebersole is the way. It aint that easy to walk da bass.

BEsides!! Electric basses should learn melodies and solo as well so its not limited to horn players!!!

from samie to sam lol

aebersole great
band in a box useful

[T-Bal]

What the h*** was THAT?

[Touch]

My favorites are the "Nothing but the Blues" and the II-V-l.

I like Jamey's CDs, but what I really love for practicing is the computer program called BAND-IN-A-BOX (BIAB), by PG Music.

All of the tunes in the Real Book are available in BIAB format for free on Yahoo.

It is a great way to work through "Them Changes".

Touch

[Mike Crumpton]

I like Jamey's CDs, but what I really love for practicing is the computer program called BAND-IN-A-BOX (BIAB), by PG Music.

says touch.

So does a piano player I regularly play with who has subjected us to these (coz he can come up with parts in concert, Eb and Bb). I think he's copied his comping style form BIAB too.

OK so Abersold isn't all rubbish but this, BIAB and others I think get used too much by horn sections at least. I blame them for horns and others not listening - they know exactly what's coming from the cd or whatever - and they get easily thrown and tetchy if you do something different. No wonder so many amatuer bands sound so cheesy, use unimaginative changes and medium tempo for everything. Its all about learning to respond appropriately in the band environment. If you want playalong practise, Sam's spot on for me.

It was probably on this site where I read that you should try to put yourself in as many (playing) situations as possible where you have to make musical decisions. Play alongs aren't it. OK so you can learn to play over (or under?) the sounds of certain chords with them but I'm still not convinced it's an effective use of my practise time.

Rant over!

[Touch]

You practice your way and I'll practice my way.

Sheeesh!

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally posted by Mike Crumpton
says touch.

So does a piano player I regularly play with who has subjected us to these (coz he can come up with parts in concert, Eb and Bb). I think he's copied his comping style form BIAB too.

OK so Abersold isn't all rubbish but this, BIAB and others I think get used too much by horn sections at least. I blame them for horns and others not listening - they know exactly what's coming from the cd or whatever - and they get easily thrown and tetchy if you do something different. No wonder so many amatuer bands sound so cheesy, use unimaginative changes and medium tempo for everything. Its all about learning to respond appropriately in the band environment. If you want playalong practise, Sam's spot on for me.

It was probably on this site where I read that you should try to put yourself in as many (playing) situations as possible where you have to make musical decisions. Play alongs aren't it. OK so you can learn to play over (or under?) the sounds of certain chords with them but I'm still not convinced it's an effective use of my practise time.

I've never used Band in a Box, but I do use a microcomposer and programme changes in, to practice over.

I do like the Aebersold sets - they are a fun way to practice and I don't see any differnce between them and what Sam says - apart from the fact they make it easier fo you!

So - the Aebersold sets have great players - the same people I listen to on CDs anyway!! The difference is they are making these recordings with this in mind - i.e. that people will be using them for practice.

Also - a lot of the sets are specifically aimed at helping you practice. So I could play along with my favourite tunes on classic CDs but find I have been playing in one or two keys all the time!
Whereas there are Aebersold sets that make sure you are practicing all keys and different time/ feels etc.

Of course you have to play with other people as well - but I think you have to do this kind of practice, if you are going to develop.

So - I go to jams every week - but I'm not going to try diffferent scales on solos, there!! I'm not going to make a fool of myself by trying out something new, that I have never practiced on my own!

The Aebersold playalongs give you this chance - i.e to try to construct meaningful solos in real time, without the disincentive of people looking at you and wondering what the heck you are doing!!

[olivier]

Certainly the art of comping must be practiced in combos, since the playalongs and other devices are completely unreactive to what you're doing...

This said, they are great practicing aids, and are becoming indispensable in the toolkit of the aspiring jazz musician. They help you getting your s*** together so that the other cats in your combo don't become too abruptly overreactive to your comping !

[Mike Crumpton]

As it happens I do own a few playalongs but they don't get used much. Fortunately for me none of you are in a position to judge from my playing whether I'm neglecting something or not!!!

Bruce said:

So - I go to jams every week - but I'm not going to try diffferent scales on solos, there!! I'm not going to make a fool of myself by trying out something new, that I have never practiced on my own!

... and it tells a tale or two, mainly that we have different attitudes. Trying something new on the fly is all part of the fun, creativity and sense of acheivement. If it doesn't quite work - so what - I ain't bothered and I'm still as good as when I strolled in and I'm going to leave knowing something new. No-one should be dissed for adventure. My overall ability (or lack of it)will still shine through a dodgy bar or two. Can you rescue the situation - essential bandstand practise - can you play the odd spontaneous creation from no-where - wow what a high. I would say go for it (but its a camenbert stinker of a radio kids program) so a donf as they say in Brittany.

[olivier]

Originally posted by Mike Crumpton
Trying something new on the fly is all part of the fun, creativity and sense of acheivement. If it doesn't quite work - so what - I ain't bothered and I'm still as good as when I strolled in and I'm going to leave knowing something new. No-one should be dissed for adventure. My overall ability (or lack of it)will still shine through a dodgy bar or two. Can you rescue the situation - essential bandstand practise - can you play the odd spontaneous creation from no-where - wow what a high. I would say go for it (but its a camenbert stinker of a radio kids program) so a donf as they say in Brittany.

The thing is, especially when you're still green, you're not too apt at brushing away the rebuffs with panache - being weak on all points makes you prone to make lots of mistakes - so practicing with an ever understanding robot is safer. And what do you do when you still haven't find poeple to play with ?

Things get better with experience. Be nice to your bandmates, don't be too negative about they practice routines. They'll get into comping if you shift the attention to collective production of music instead of whatever individual practice.

Alone Together is a great song name !

[Samie]

Besides, most classic jazz recording the DB is almost imposible to hear clearly. Really left out in the backround somewere.

Love those nasal-over-compress DB walking lines from aebersole, u show ron carter!!

[Sam Sherry]

Originally posted by Bruce Lindfield
I go to jams every week - but I'm not going to try diffferent scales on solos, there!! I'm not going to make a fool of myself by trying out something new, that I have never practiced on my own!

"Risk is what moves all of us forward. If you're playing in your comfort zone, that ain't jazz." -- Herbie Hancock

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally posted by Mike Crumpton

... and it tells a tale or two, mainly that we have different attitudes. Trying something new on the fly is all part of the fun, creativity and sense of acheivement.


Well I think it is a very different situation, playing with other people - and I think you have to be considerate to them. So it may be great fun for you to try new stuff that doesn't come off and makes the whole thing break down - but how do those other people feel about it...

Do you really know that they're not irritated as hell? But of course they wouldn't say anything because they are middle-class and British and therefore awfully nice in public places!!


If it doesn't quite work - so what - I ain't bothered and I'm still as good as when I strolled in and I'm going to leave knowing something new.


Those people might think you're a bit of a timewaster, an egotist - they might not ask you to play a gig they have at the weekend with them....etc etc?


No-one should be dissed for adventure.


No - but how about being dissed for lack of preparation and wasting everybody else's time?


My overall ability (or lack of it)will still shine through a dodgy bar or two. Can you rescue the situation - essential bandstand practise - can you play the odd spontaneous creation from no-where -

Well - your "natural ability" is no good to me - I can't rely on that to get me further, or progress my understanding of the music - I 'd much rather feel I was prepared for anything and that I had practiced as much as I needed to - that I could be relied on to provide a solid beat and a decent solo when asked...

It may just magically come to some people....but I doubt it very much!!

[Mike Crumpton]

Ooooooooouch Bruce!

I said playing a few dodgy bars won't matter much in the scheme of things and you seem to imply I'm an inconsiderate egoist who brings the whole thing crashing down.

As for the comment on a middle class british jam session - I can see I got your goat. I didn't mean to be insulting but I could have chosen my words better - apologies.

I aim whilst playing to adapt to my surroundings, to be able to play off them and with them when they do the unexpected. In my experience I have got better at this by going for it. The fear factor is gone and I know I can pull out of it back into something reliable that will bring the band back together. Often I get this experience from others going a bit OTT. It is this experience that IMO you can't get from a playalong or that a playalong prepares you for. But if you don't go with the moment occassionally the chance for that something special may not come back so I'll give it a go.

I also trust my good taste not to over-cook it. To be able to do this I practice as much as I can resonably do. I trust myself to be considerate to others. I can't personally afford to worry too much about looking daft occassionally as I personally would just get tight and stressed out. I'm a bit of a fan of 'The Inner Game of Music' by Galway and Green, a bass player for that.

I've tried being at the front, but bass playing is the role for me. No-one can do it if they don't support others. I just take it as read everyone does.

Your pride and dedication to your task shines through all your posts Bruce. Nice of you to refer to my natural ability but I can assure you I got none whatsoever - I gotta work at it. I doubt we think that much differently.

And if at the end of it all no-one wants me for the gig at the weekend then I'm probably not ready for it.

Playalongs are a useful tool to help me get there but IMHO they can be overated and lead to horns at least to expect that a band will play in a manner that will always allow them to reproduce their practise with the playalong.

BTW IMO free playing really opens up your hearing and reactions and you can only do that with others. It doesn't have to be crash bang wallop squeak either (honest). A little free passage on a gig can really liven things up. A lot of free can ... ummmm!