Any tips before learning to play?

[James Banner]

Hi,

First of all I'd like to introduce myself to the Double Bass section of TB. I've been an active member of the Electric Bass (am I allowed to say that here, or is it as bas as saying g**t*r? ) forums for a while and you can hear my music at: www.myspace.com/jamesbannerbass

My question is this: I will soon be getting free double bass lessons at high school (they are free because the DB is seen as an "endangered" instrument). Is there anything that I can do to prepare myself for learning to play the DB? I was thinking along the lines of hand exercises, intonation or other things I could practice on my fretted and fretless EB's to ready myself (as of yet I don't have a DB but the company will provide me with one). Please note that I am a complete DB newbie and I know nothing about the DB, but I am around grade 8 on EB, so I know theory well; don't dumb it down on my behalf!

Thank you for your help in advance and I look forward to meeting you here soon.

James

[Jason Sypher]

Your theory will serve you well on the new instrument, everything else will be back to almost square one. I think the first thing you need to do is prepare yourself for that bitter pill. I played electric first and was considered a bit of a hot shot and then I met the upright bass. Humility and an openness to re-approach bass playing and music in general will get you in the right head space. Will you be getting private instruction at school by a classically trained teacher of just thrown into the orchestra?
Private instruction is a must so if you don't get it free at school you need to find a teacher on the outside as well to get you on the right track. So much of the doublebass is physical and it takes a lot of training to make your body do what needs to be done to play the instrument well without hurting yourself. It is imperative that the instrument you will be playing is set up properly and solid. School basses are notorious for being horrible to play. You also might try to see someone play the bass up close. That will help quite a bit. Anyway, welcome to the darkside as they say and good luck on your new journey?

[James Banner]

Originally Posted by Jason Sypher

Your theory will serve you well on the new instrument, everything else will be back to almost square one. I think the first thing you need to do is prepare yourself for that bitter pill. I played electric first and was considered a bit of a hot shot and then I met the upright bass. Humility and an openness to re-approach bass playing and music in general will get you in the right head space. Will you be getting private instruction at school by a classically trained teacher of just thrown into the orchestra?
Private instruction is a must so if you don't get it free at school you need to find a teacher on the outside as well to get you on the right track. So much of the doublebass is physical and it takes a lot of training to make your body do what needs to be done to play the instrument well without hurting yourself. It is imperative that the instrument you will be playing is set up properly and solid. School basses are notorious for being horrible to play. You also might try to see someone play the bass up close. That will help quite a bit. Anyway, welcome to the darkside as they say and good luck on your new journey?

I'll be getting private instruction from a teacher I haven't met, but as far as I know, he teaches classical and jazz styles with a bow and without; I assume he has a music degree of some sort.

I haven't got a clue how bad the performing arts basses are. I may have played some of them before and I wouldn't know what contributes a good setup on a double bass, but the action was pretty high I won't be able to set up the bass as it's not going to be mine; I'll just be "renting" it for free so to speak.

Thank you for the advice.

James

[DrChill]

Hey Welcome Bro,

Dig, I'm no grand bass master, but I'll happily chime in...

One thing that tripped me up when first going to DB from playing the bass guitar for many years is the strain on your left hand. Especially since I'd never really played fretless before either. On a big fretless instrument you need to apply enough pressure to get the string flat on the fingerboard, and then some (or maybe even then a lot).

After a few months of playing in this new style of really getting after the strings I would get numbness and shooting tingles up my left arm from my pinky and ring finger up to the back of my elbow. It got so persistent that I had to quit playing for several weeks and get treatment. What finally did the trick for me was acupuncture (to repair the damage to my nerves and tendons) and lots of stretching before, during, and after playing(to keep me from getting injured again). Hopefully you won't need any remedial treatment if you can avoid injury in the first place. Here's the stretch that I use to keep from jacking up my left arm:

Stand in front of a table about thigh height.
Put your fingers on the edge of the table, palm out, thumb pointing left.
Slowly lower your arm, keeping the elbow mostly straight, pointing your fingers back towards you as your palm goes down to the surface. Don't be afraid to lean over the table during all this.

Do this carefully and build flexibility slowly. Stop lowering your hand when it becomes uncomfortable or you'll just hurt yourself. After doing this a couple times a day in about a week or so I noticed that it was much easier to get my palm flat on the surface. Another version of this stretch is to do the same thing but rotate your hand 270' clockwise so that your thumb is back towards you and your fingers point to the right. The cool thing about these stretches is that you can use the upper bout of the bass as a surface to keep things loose between songs during a show. But you have to be discreet about this, generally people don't like to watch freaky looking stretches going down on stage.

Good Luck

[Jason Sypher]

Nobody is going to be upset with a professional set up. If your teacher says it's necessary, then take steps to get it set up. I listened to your clips and you sound good. You will get a lot out of learning the double bass, in fact, it will change your life...

[James Banner]

Originally Posted by Jason Sypher

Nobody is going to be upset with a professional set up. If your teacher says it's necessary, then take steps to get it set up. I listened to your clips and you sound good. You will get a lot out of learning the double bass, in fact, it will change your life...

How much does a setup on a double bass cost? I can set up my own electric easy, but I know it's way different on a double bass.

James

[Andrew McGregor]

Setting up a bass costs a fair bit; it takes three hours or so of someone's time, and they may have to (worst case) replace the bridge and soundpost. So, a few hundred dollars. Reason is, the parts have to be cut to precisely the right shape, and if the ones you have have gone too far there's no adding material back in.

A lot of what an EB player should know has already been covered (I play both myself, but I started on DB). I'd just add, learn the bow, and learn to read if you don't already. They're not optional, either one. As to which bow, just go with whichever is more comfortable to you; they're a wash as to what you can do with them, and a bow you can't use without hurting yourself is useless.

[mcnaire2004]

My only advice is to do everything you learn in this lesson as much as possible, and very slowly to ensure proper growth and that you don't get bad habbits.

[James Banner]

Originally Posted by Andrew McGregor

Setting up a bass costs a fair bit; it takes three hours or so of someone's time, and they may have to (worst case) replace the bridge and soundpost. So, a few hundred dollars. Reason is, the parts have to be cut to precisely the right shape, and if the ones you have have gone too far there's no adding material back in.

A lot of what an EB player should know has already been covered (I play both myself, but I started on DB). I'd just add, learn the bow, and learn to read if you don't already. They're not optional, either one. As to which bow, just go with whichever is more comfortable to you; they're a wash as to what you can do with them, and a bow you can't use without hurting yourself is useless.

I'm sure that I need to improve my notation reading skills; I'm pretty useless at big band practice when the band leader just says something like, "go from bar 17", and I've only just been given the music 30 seconds before. Hopefully, learning the DB will improve my reading.

As I know nothing, which bow (I'm only aware of French and German I think?) is the most common to use?

James

[Andrew McGregor]

French and German are the two. Which is more common depends on where you are, and changes with fashion. Probably French is more common. You can play anything on either, different aspects are difficult with each, so it comes down to comfort for the shape of your hand and arm. I play German myself, because the French grip gives me a lot of pain in my thumb.

[James Banner]

So I had my first lesson today; my teacher just showed me the basics such as which fingers to use for playing the major scale from an open string i.e. D major. and how he hold the French bow. I'm finding it really hard to hold the bow in the way he showed me without tensing up my fingers, though I guess this is normal for someone who has never played before.

Speaking of bowing, I find it really difficult to bow the G string without getting a bad curve in my wrist. The only way I can bow the G string and keep my forearm and wrist in a natural position means twisting the hairs on the bow (it's kind of hard to explain). Maybe I could prevent this by supporting the bass at less of a steep angle. I am using a "quarter size" French bow by the way.

I was also getting pain in my forearm from bowing so I stopped for a while and shook out.

Wow, is the action high compared to what I'm used to!!!

James

[txstatebass]

You've taken your first steps into a larger universe. If I may chime in with my $.02, The weight may be bigger, but see if you can get a 3/4 or full size frenchie. It will help you reach that g a lot better. Also, in regards to the left hand, one thing I tell my students is to not clamp down the string with your hand. Try pulling the string into you so your power is being drawn from the back and arms (which have bigger muscles anyway) and not from the hand. Make sure your fingers are hitting the string right on the tips. Hold a glass with just your fingertips, that's the kind of hand shape you want to try for in the lower positions. Enjoy!