Do Not Want To Be In His You Tube Video

jgbass · #1 11-30-2008, 05:56 PM

Can someone explain it there are any ethics when it comes to people posting you on you tube? Maybe 'ethics' is the wrong word, but I cannot think of a better word.

This was an educational gig sponsored by a school, and someone decided to to use a camcorder to record the set for you tube. Nothing was mentioned to the band members, no one was asked that I know of if they wanted to be recorded, my solos and others' solos were generally cut out to feature the vocalisit. The vocalist took it upon himself to bill himself as the 'feature.' That's not what this gig was about.

No mention was made on the you tube site as to who the musicians were who were accompanyinjg the vocalist either. Free publicity for him. I do not do gigs with this vocalist or the other musicians, it was just a gig for educational purposes. I do not even like my playing on it and would have done things differently if I had known there are going to be a recording.

What's with this? Or am I living on another planet and this kind of thing happens all the time?

txstatebass · #2 11-30-2008, 06:49 PM

Send him/her a registered letter explaining that you signed no waiver of likeness rights, and would like to have the performance removed from display. Simultaneously, advise you-tube of the same. Nobody likes a law suit (except maybe lawyers).

Marcus Johnson · #3 11-30-2008, 06:56 PM

Personal ethics only, I guess. The internet is a cross section of the good and bad. On YouTube, we've seen the bass smasher and the "expert village" guy that spews tons of info that is questionable at the very least. Here on TBDB, we regularly have a newbie post an honest question about double basses, and often there is a barrage of "info" from slightly more experienced noobs (weeks, in some cases)... and that info is just flat out wrong. I've kind of just gotten to the point where I just shake my head and wish the OP the best. Thank god for DRURB... he still seems to have the patience to play traffic cop here for people who are just starting out.

Whoops, rant....

I don't know what your recourse is. Maybe Sam could pitch in....

Jake deVilliers · #4 11-30-2008, 08:19 PM

Hey Janet, just 'Flag' it with YouTube and let them block it.

jgbass · #5 11-30-2008, 10:24 PM

I did contact the leader of the group, being that this is associated with a school. And, yes, if I do not get a response within a few days, I am going to pursue this with you tube. After flagging, you need to file a complaint. Good idea!

Janette

Phil Smith · #6 12-01-2008, 12:12 PM

I do believe that the person or persons that recorded the video have the copyright to that video and can post it on youtube or any place they want since they are the copyright holder. Now if there was a sign and rules specifically forbidding recording audio and or video that's a different matter but if there was a rule in effect and it wasn't enforced i.e. the recording was made in plain sight and no one complained...

If this was a public event I don't think you have any redress especially if this video isn't being sold.

bpclark · #7 12-01-2008, 02:50 PM

It would have been polite to let you and the other bandmembers know that the video was going to be used on YouTube, but other than that, I don't see a problem with this. Other than the assault on your personal sense of fair play, what harm has actually been done? OTOH, what good will come from attempting to right the wrong? I would suspect the answer to both questions is none.

Kam · #8 12-01-2008, 03:30 PM

It may be worth looking into Right of Publicity...especially if it seem that he is using the video to promote himself commercially. It probably wouldn't hold up in court but you could at least make your letter scary..

jgbass · #9 12-02-2008, 09:10 AM

These responses have been interesting and helpful.

The person who arranged this educational event has asked the person to take this video down. He thinks it is ridiculous that it was put up in the first place. I was not even considering anything near a lawsuit, since, in reality, this would not be viewed much at all because it is not that great anyway. The material is not original material, so technically the video itself is a copyright violation anyway.

Also, You Tube does give individuals the option to file a complaint under the issue of invastion of privacy, and other reasons and request stuff be taken down.

Its too bad that at least one response here thinks it is OK to video anyone anytime and broadcast it on You Tube. But, again, I guess that many others would agree with this. I will certainly take notice, in the future, anytime anyone is pointing a camcorder at me or my band at any gig.

For a musician, if you really did not like how the band sounded, and/or your playing, how the video turned out, the person doing the video recording is really doing a disservice to the musician if they insist on posting it, not to mention that the person doing the shoot does not give a crap whether the musciains want to be recorded in the first place.. Yes, this stuff happens, but, now, I will be aware of this stuff.

bpclark · #10 12-02-2008, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Its too bad that at least one response here thinks it is OK to video anyone anytime and broadcast it on You Tube.

If you are referring my response, then you have taken it out of context. I don't believe that it's "OK to video anyone anytime and broadcast it on You Tube." That is a ridiculous a leap in logic.

I just think that the injustice in this case is so slight that it's not worth worrying about and correcting it as you have tried may cause you more harm than not doing anything at all. The vocalist now knows that someone got their shorts in a bunch over this. Anything positive he may have had to say to anyone about you (or anyone else associated with this, assuming he doesn't know you were the instigator) is out the window. Is your sense of what is right worth the risk of possible harm to your(or others) reputation or future opportunities caused by a disgruntled vocalist?

Some battles are worth fighting, I just don't think this is one of them.

Ed Fuqua · #11 12-02-2008, 11:00 AM

She ain't talking to you, she's talking about

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freedom loving people's of the Republic of Brooklyn

I do believe that the person or persons that recorded the video have the copyright to that video and can post it on youtube or any place they want since they are the copyright holder. Now if there was a sign and rules specifically forbidding recording audio and or video that's a different matter but if there was a rule in effect and it wasn't enforced i.e. the recording was made in plain sight and no one complained...

If this was a public event I don't think you have any redress especially if this video isn't being sold.

You may want to take your sartorial suggestions to heart.

Ed Fuqua · #12 12-02-2008, 11:04 AM

And by the way, Phil, are you sure about that. I mean, public gathering sure, but if the intent of the videographer was NOT capturing the event but the specific performance, then they do need have at least tacit permission (by purchasing this ticket you agree that the Great Beast may use your image etc etc etc) to present that. As someone else said, they then also become liable for performance royalties.

We do events at the museum here all the time, in order for the photos to be used they have to have the waiver as part of the general contract for the use of the space....

bpclark · #13 12-02-2008, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Fuqua

She ain't talking to you, she's talking about

You may want to take your sartorial suggestions to heart.

Ed
She didn't say who she was talking about, which is why my comment started with "If."

JG
If you weren't referring to my comments then I apologize for thinking they were.

Ed Again

BTW, I looked up sartorial (since I wasn't sure what it meant). Which of these definitions were you referring to?

(from dictionary.com)
1. of or pertaining to tailors or their trade: sartorial workmanship.
2. of or pertaining to clothing or style or manner of dress: sartorial splendor.
3. Anatomy. pertaining to the sartorius.

damonsmith · #14 12-02-2008, 11:29 AM

The digital age has a lot of problems like this. That favor you did for a bad-player-but-nice-guy where you went ahead and played on his limited to a 100 cdr is now unlimited and internationally available on itunes and emusic!
Personally, it has made me even more hyper-aware of what I will and won't do. I am pretty much an art for art sake musician and try not to do gigs I wouldn't be proud of, even still I end up doing the odd gig I wouldn't want others to know about.
If you are a working musician in this age you may need to make peace with the fact that everything has the potential to get to wider audience that you might prefer.

I would say a real nasty email to the singer is in order if you already haven't done so. While posting your gigs on youtube might be the unfortunate order of the day, not crediting the musicians is never going to be good manners!

awakefie · #15 12-02-2008, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgbass

Can someone explain it there are any ethics when it comes to people posting you on you tube? Maybe 'ethics' is the wrong word, but I cannot think of a better word.

I think ethics is a fine word for how you've described the way you feel. Ethical? No, not in my book. It might be in someone elses. It would be an interesting discussion in a college ethics class.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgbass

What's with this?

You have someone trying to use anything they can to advance themselves (from what you've described). Again, I wouldn't do it, but they have.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgbass

Or am I living on another planet and this kind of thing happens all the time?

I'm pretty sure it happens all the time. Do a search on "mosh girl" on TB. I'm pretty sure she never intended that one picture to be used (and abused) by TBers when she was dancing in public that night.

<stupid opinion>
I would look at the damage done or potential damage.

For example, I'm a semi-lousy bass player that gets gigs where I can in Podunk USA, I doubt much could damage my ability to beg for gigs and anyone that hires me has to be pretty desparate, so I doubt I'd do anything about it.

If you think it will damage your reputation or ability to get future gigs, it might be worth a cheesy 'scare' letter and pursuing it with YouTube. After all, your rep is on the line every time a future employer views it.
</stupid opinion>

BTW, if you live on another planet you must have really good interenet connections to reach the TB servers.

Ed Fuqua · #16 12-02-2008, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bpclark

BTW, I looked up sartorial (since I wasn't sure what it meant). Which of these definitions were you referring to?

(from dictionary.com)
1. of or pertaining to tailors or their trade: sartorial workmanship.
2. of or pertaining to clothing or style or manner of dress: sartorial splendor.
3. Anatomy. pertaining to the sartorius.

Number 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by bpclarkwell

The vocalist now knows that someone got their shorts in a bunch over this.