Venting

[damonsmith]

Originally Posted by fingers

I suppose in the ideal world this is true but I come across all kinds of situations where I need support. Sometimes a little amp help suffices. Sometimes I need even more. If there is a pa I'd rather run a mic through it then turn my amp up to cover the whole room.

Ed is right on... we play the acoustic bass not the amp.

Yes, they DO come up, but situations where we are hit with a soundman and PA when we DON'T need them come up just as often.
They often cut into the budget as well, so we end up paying them to make us sound like sh**!
Sometime it is beyond our control, sometimes it isn't, and sometimes we need them.
Things to keep in mind are:
Do we need them?
Can we not use them (meaning is it up to us, do we have a say)?
What are we willing to give them (mic on bass or more)?

If it is a club you know has one on hand and you know you don't need them, let the booker know beforehand so the sound person does not show up expecting to be paid.

[TroyK]

Originally Posted by mr.hughes

It's a tough one - we become slaves to too many masters on gigs like these. Sometimes the biggest master is ourselves...

This was actually the issue. I went on about the soundguy, because I was comfortable bashing him and didn't really want to bash the leader or other musicians. All of whom were cool, but had varying levels of experience.

I was getting asked to do a whole bunch of very specific things that were not "normal" for a jazz gig in my experience and it started effecting my attitude and ultimately started coming through in my playing in spots. In the end, I wondered if there were people there who thought "gee, that guy's supposed to be better than that. Why did he blow that simple intro? How come it took him 2 measure to synch up with the drummer on that tune?"

Maybe no one did, but I don't like playing below my standards and I was kind of mad at everyone for getting me off of my game and AT MYSELF for not taking control of the situation and politely and professionally getting the point across to the leader that he hired me to do my thing for him and to do my best job, I really needed to be left alone to do it. It's not classical music, don't direct me. We're not in the studio, get that guy away from my bass with that mic and tell him to stop talking about bleed.

On the other hand, it was probably just a jive ass gig that I shouldn't have taken.

One the other hand, I should probably have my head, reading and chops down to the point that none of those things can get me off my game.

All that.

In the mean time I think I'll a) Avoid those situations b) Be less west coasty with my needs when I feel like it's going to effect me. And c) carry some pestacide in one of those old school pump cans to chase those soundguys away with when I see them coming.

[mr.hughes]

Nah, don't avoid them - dive into them and figure out how to make it work, if for no other reason than it's bound to come up again at some point and your experience will help you deal with it better next time. (on a tangent: I'm doing this with my upright in a venue that is notorious for upright feedback. I could easily bring my Eminence and know it'll be fine, but then I won't have learned how to sort out a feedback problem that may occur in other venues with artists that insist on the real upright)

It's tough tho when you know you're entering into a potentially vicious circle that feeds on itself.

[TroyK]

I may not be doing a great job of explaining this.

I won't avoid gigs because there might be a soundguy. That would be stupid. If it's my band or my gig, I can handle the soundguy, although if he's a tool, they'll still bug me, I can hold my own. When I'm hired to play with someone in a semi formal setting who I don't normally play with who has posters plastered all over that say "An Evening with This Guy", then I try to do my job and not draw attention away from the guy who's paying me, as we all do. Which makes winning battles of wills with evil forces such as the one personified by the evil soundguy (as a literary device) more difficult.

The "on the other hand, I probably shouldn't take those gigs" (which I immediately contradicted in that same post by the way) was in reference to something else. I'm really not a great all around musician, as much as I'd like to be. I listen to different types of music and I occasionally play a rock gig or do something with a composer or a singer songwriter if I have good reason to or if I really like them, but I'm not one of those guys who you call for klezmer one night and country the next and "you'll tell me at the gig" the next and "we're going into the studio to record a jingle of some kind on Thursday". I don't play orchestra or big band (although I should and will at some point). I pretty much just play jazz. I play with a circle of say 50 people that expands and contracts like the universe every year and we generally (although we've never agreed to it or written it down) seem to have settled into a standard set of rules, behavior and vernacular. So, this Saturday, Adrain, who I haven't seen in over a year, needs me at Sabastians to play with someone who I'll meet when I get there. When I ask him if there was anything I needed to check out, he said "No. Standards and I'll have stand if end up reading anything you can look over my shoulder (he plays 'bone, which is politely in bass clef)"

So, 3 minute conversation, very little information appears to have changed hands. I'm going to play with a guy who I don't know and a guy who I haven't seen in a year and we have no plan that was articulated to me and I have no worries. I know how it's going to go and it will be fine. I'm looking forward to it.

It's tough for me to play with people who don't live in my little world and speak my little language. That might make me small. The fact that I took this other gig and that I take gigs like it now and again is a sign to myself that I don't want to be Provencial. I think there are two types of people who don't fit into my circle; those who have their own thing and those who just haven't figured it out yet. I like to welcome and help people in the later category, but I'm growing impatient with them. I'm willing to flex and grow with the former, but it's challenging for me, because it means that I need to have my game really together. Which of course I want.

Anyway, I'm going on and on at this point. Therapy in a box...laptop.

[Jason Hollar]

I agree with everything you just said.

It's so nice when it's just a standards gig and everybody knows the same tunes. And if not...it's easy to produce a real book and quickly be on the same page.

That's what I love about jazz -- you can take three or four guys that just met in the parking lot and sound like you've been playing together for years!

I've stopped taking those "One Big Night With This Guy" gigs because the preparation (and hassle) usually far outweighs the benefits.

Like you, I do have a few rock & blues projects that come up...but I'm so happy when I look at my date book and see one jazz casual after another!

[txstatebass]

Coda II---$900
AMT S25B--$650
Midas sound system---$50,000

The look on the sound guy's face when you show up with an upright.....
Priceless

Pretty much sums up my sh^#$y sound guy story from last week.