Free Gig for exposure and small rant.

Dave44 · #1 02-22-2011, 08:54 AM

Has anyone else had to do this in order to get a foot in the door. It just seems like every time a bar owner or manager has promised they'd show up at a jam to give us a listen they never show up. Or give them a CD to listen to which in our case was about 1 minute snips of 4-5 of our toons. And then they claim they've not had the time to listen to it yet. Or we've given then numbers of well respected musicians and club owners in town to call for a reference and no calls are made. It's not like were newbies we've all been involved in bands for at least 30 years each for all of us. After the jams most of the folks are clamering to find out where our next gig is and comments of why the hell aren't you guys out gigging. As much as I hate to say it it feels the same as it did 30 years ago we're treated like shite even though we fill the joint with dancing people who drink a ton. And when it comes time to pay the piper the manager always says Cheeze I don't know if I can pay the full amount it was a slow weekend. I can only hope after this gig things will work out for us and we can join the circle of bands touring the various clubs in town. Sorry folks a small rant from a frustrated blues man.

somegeezer · #2 02-22-2011, 08:57 AM

I'd say it's most likely to do with your age and style. As silly as it is, middle aged guys, playing Blues is just not what people are looking for. They use every excuse to ignore you. It shouldn't be that way, but it is.

Downunderwonder · #3 02-22-2011, 09:45 AM

The "demo gig" is one of the older tricks in the book.

I don't know if I'd have the stones to do it myself but I read of guys in your situation saying "we'll come in and do a demo, if you like what we do you can pay us X00 dollars for the gig". Manager duly agrees.

Band sets up for show, plays a three or four song set and summon manger. "You like?" its a yes or a no at this point, either the cash is handed over or they will pack down and leave.

Obe · #4 02-22-2011, 10:35 AM

We're in the same boat Dave, we see that circle of bands playing out constantly and making good money, most of them are top-notch, but a few of them are lousy and somehow they still manage to get gigs. I think inertia takes over with the bar owners, it's easy to do nothing and let things go as they have been. Also, consistently bringing in a crowd trumps being good.

Geezer, yes, there is an overabundance of old dudes playing great blues and not drawing a crowd, so no gigs are to be had.

The only thing I can suggest is find a bar that is blues only. There is one local to me, pretty much any decent blues band can get a gig there, but again...the long process of a few low or non-paying weeknights, and maybe eventually a low paying opening slot on the weekend, and rarely a decent paying whole night. It gets sped up if you consistently bring a crowd who spends money.

Steve · #5 02-22-2011, 11:13 AM

It's been my experience, and I'm 51 and have pretty much done it every way it can be done,:

The bands I've been in that worked the most and got treated the best where the bands that wouldn't work for free or eat bar owner garbage.

You absolutely could not get me to do a freebie these days unless there was a sick child or maybe a registered non profit that was handing out tax vouchers for charitable contributions.

It was always a problem but it seems these days the open mics / audition nights / whatever are just over running the system and all that talent buyers are looking for is the next free thing not the next big thing unless, it's free.

Additionally, and this is maybe the hardest truth I've ever had to come to terms with in the industry. As far as when where and how you work goes:

The ability to play means absolutely nothing compared to the ability to sell.

If there isn't someone in the band that is a selling fool, you better be in it for fun because all you'll get are "blind squirrel" gigs regardless of the type of music.

JimmyM · #6 02-22-2011, 11:32 AM

welcome to the music business. everything people are saying in this thread is absolutely true. having talent is only a small part of why bands get work.

Dave44 · #7 02-22-2011, 11:51 AM

Been there and I know what your sayin Steve. And thankfully yes, I'm still doin' all of this for the love of playin' the blues. Nothing on this little blue planet is better than playin' live on a stage. Things will get better they always do.

BritPicker · #8 02-22-2011, 01:47 PM

Agree with everyone here.

I see bad bands - sloppy playing, boring songs and so on, getting lots of gigs. We play and those that are there say the same - why aren't you on more? etc etc

Basically bookers are interested in one thing only - beer sales. They pay lip-service to the music.

I'm in my 40's so I don't BS these people. I won't lie about how many people we can get through the door - most of the bands pals are more likely to have to stay home and look after their young kids than come out drinking for the evening. I say to them, "listen to the music" and "give us a shot, isn't it about the music?" to which they reply "yes, but can you bring 100 people?"

When they have dozens of high-school kids with bands clamoring to play for NOTHING and bring all their cashed up friends along for some unrestrained teenage drinking one can see why they get the gigs and you don't.

Anyway, you just have to use your experience to avoid being ripped off. If you DO refuse a gig that is offered you because it's a bad deal, be upfront and tell the booker WHY you are refusing it (remaining very very polite of course) - 50% of the time I've found the booker actually can do a better deal and in any case at least they know its not acceptable. Keep at it. Work on being entertaining and professional! good luck.

bassbrad · #9 02-22-2011, 01:50 PM

Yep it's tough these days, my rock band is getting gigs because the leader is also a refrigeration tech and a master electrician making contacts doing repair work and he's not just pushing the rock band but our other projects as well.
2011 is looking up, 2010 absolutely sucked for gigs.
People just don't go out like they used to it takes a special occasion or some event to get them out, shux I am the same way it's been like forever since i just went out for a drink or to hear other bands. Open mics and cluster f#$% multiband gigs are a new ploy for club owners to get customers (ie musicians) in the house and they are never there.

spaz21387 · #10 02-22-2011, 01:53 PM

Im 24 and it seems like the same thing when you try and get a show at a venue you havent played at before they always want you to play for free... which kinda sucks but at the same time your doing what you love and thats all that matters. Ill play for free since most club owners like us and seem to book us again and for pay next time. And if we are playing a free show we better atleast get a few free drinks.

BritPicker · #11 02-23-2011, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spaz21387

Im 24 and it seems like the same thing when you try and get a show at a venue you havent played at before they always want you to play for free... which kinda sucks but at the same time your doing what you love and thats all that matters. Ill play for free since most club owners like us and seem to book us again and for pay next time. And if we are playing a free show we better atleast get a few free drinks.

No no no!! You may love it, but it's not right for someone else to profit from your hard work and it makes it harder for anyone to make any money. You play for free? No wonder club owners like you. Why should someone else make money when you are not?

Downunderwonder · #12 02-23-2011, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave44

we fill the joint with dancing people who drink a ton.

Get some vid to aid your negotiation. If you're really playing a packed joint with clamouring to get served at bar that's easy to capture on vid. No more "demo" gigs.

SteveC · #13 02-23-2011, 07:47 AM

Try being a jazz quartet in a culturally vacant community. Very discouraging...almost to the point where I am ready to hang it up. We have 2 venues we can play, once a month at each. Last time, we were told we were too loud - by the staff. Yet customers seemed to be enjoying us. The rest of the guys want to rehearse a lot, get really tight, etc., thinking it will make people like jazz more. I don't think it will. I think we are good enough for what people want - background music.

Music can be a tough gig.

rtslinger · #14 02-23-2011, 08:14 AM

Yeah to get gigs you need to first find out what everyone else who is getting the gigs in you area are playing. Go to their shows and listen to what people want to hear and do what needs to be done to get established in the local clubs. After that if you want to test the waters with another style of music. Give it a shot at one of your shows if it doesn't get the response you had hoped for go back to what works. Sorry to say the music business isn't about you or how good or bad your band is it is about being a live juke box and playing what the people want to hear.That is what will pack the place make money for the owner and you will get more and more work. I will go out on a limb and say that if Jimi Hendrix was playing in the club scene and he did not have a big following he would not be getting gigs either! Talent means nothing to them $ is all they know period!

prd004 · #15 02-23-2011, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BritPicker

No no no!! You may love it, but it's not right for someone else to profit from your hard work and it makes it harder for anyone to make any money. You play for free? No wonder club owners like you. Why should someone else make money when you are not?

Not everyone considers this work, you can't impose your beliefs on everyone else.

Let me start by saying I play in two bands, one- All original with guys who love to write/record/play. The other- a working tribute band. My original will play just about anywhere we can. Money isn't hardly a consideration, if at all. First off, nobody pays original bands unless they have a name and a real reputation and if they do it's peanuts, we play because we love it and we want people to hear us. The tribute band on the other hand, will ONLY play for money, and will only play for a set minimum or more. But honestly, I do this for fun too! In the end the money still ain't great. We've all heard the rants: Load your gear, drive to the venue, set up, sound check, play for three to four hours, tear down-load up, drive home, unpack. Not to mention rehearsal, and home practice time. It's a lot of effort and quite honestly the pay is RARELY equal to the challenge. So even in my working band, I don't do it soley for the money.

There are two kinds of musicians, broke and broker! There are a hundred things I could do for money, that pay far far better than playing music for money, I do it for love. But I'm not trying to force my views down other peoples throats.

superbassman2000 · #16 02-23-2011, 08:29 AM

so far the only thing I can tell you if you want to be a paid band is that contracts are your best friends.

If the booking agent signs it, you get the money (or can sue for breach of contract) and if the booking agent refuses to sign it, then they were going to try to screw you anyways. I have a day job and playing a gig for 10 dollars per band member is the same as playing a free gig. And try not to get a percentage of beer sales--they don't show you the numbers, so you can pack the house and they can say "well, we made 100 dollars, so here's 20 bucks" but how do you know how much they made? Ultimately if the guy won't agree beforehand what to pay you, then you know he's going to screw you.

either get it in writing, or consider being a charity band and there is no shame in that.

SteveC · #17 02-23-2011, 08:51 AM

I never play for free. I will do a "reduced rate" gig for a first gig at a venue, but that's it. We fight that here all the time. Bands - young and old - playing for almost nothing makes it very hard for bands (that are often better) to ask a reasonable rate.

However, after doing my taxes, am seriously debating playing for free or just doing fill in gigs so I don't hit the IRS's magic number of $600. I don't make enough to really make a difference after taxes. For the $1,000 or so I kept this year, I'm not sure it was worth it.

AfroCubanFunkMa · #18 02-23-2011, 09:29 AM

RE: free gig for "Exposure"

"don't you know, people die from exposure?"

bassphreak · #19 02-23-2011, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfroCubanFunkMa

RE: free gig for "Exposure"

"don't you know, people die from exposure?"

Ha....I almost got arrested for 'exposure'

I'm in a band that's just starting out in my area. I'm in my 30s and got into this late in life. I'm a professional and businessman first but have a love and passion for music. Many of the local bars and clubs here now require you to 'audition' before they put you on the rotation. No money but they are on off nights where the bar/club is not likely pulling much in. I see this from both sides. I can completely understand the owners view from a business standpoint. I've seen a number of the bands out here and many are good, but some are not and some have tired material.

The music business is just business of music. Business is business. Everyone in the equation will take care of their own and do what's best. I know we will have to play for free. We are hitting some non-profit events, going to fill during breaks for another local band that has a draw, hit the audition, then hit the rotation (hopefully). We will be marketing and selling the whole time. That's the plan. I think it makes sense and is pretty solid.

jaywa · #20 02-23-2011, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bassbrad

2011 is looking up, 2010 absolutely sucked for gigs.

Exact opposite for me. I had played 7 paying weekends by Mid-March last year... year-to-date so far I have played ONE.

$4 a gallon gas (if not higher) is on its way back (it's $3.25 here already), and that promises to not only keep people home more but will make it even harder to turn a profit on road gigs.

Around here at least it's a good time to be in an established band that has a loyal following and a lot of 2011 dates already booked... but a terrible time to be in a band that doesn't have an aggressive "seller" or is just starting out.