How have clubs tried to screw you?

Nate74 · #1 07-23-2008, 05:44 PM

I realize that because of the over-population of original music in the LA scene, clubs have long since been able to completely screw over original bands, but today I read the "booking policy" of a club I was thinking about booking at and even I, the most cynical of cynical, was surprised.

Here are some excerpts:

A minimum draw of 25 people per act is expected. If you feel you cannot draw an audience of this size you may consider building your following before booking a show.

Keep in mind, this room maybe holds 50 people, has poor sound, no backline and horrible parking/load-in. In my mind, this is the kind of club where you would start building a following in the first place...

We pay 4/7 of your generated draw on a $7 ticket. A total of 25.00 comes off the total of any monies paid to the artist to cover club expenses. If for some reason your acts brings in fewer than 20 people we reserve the right to forfeit payment. The club's retains it's original percentage of the ticket price if tickets are discounted.

You bring 25 people who all pay $7 = $175. They keep $25, leaving 4/7 * $150 = about $85. You bring 19, all bets are off.

We can record a live cd off the board of your show. The cost is $50 payable in cash only. We provide the CD.

Awesome! I'd still be left with $35 for my whole band! Plus I'm sure we can sell CD's and will get free drinks...

Our seating is limited so do not take any room up in the showroom for your CD or swag.

Oh, well at least we'll get free drinks...

Musicians performing can receive one voucher for a half off beverage from the door person valid on the night of their show only.

I wonder how much parking will cost...

Makes me happy I also play in a cover/bar band that plays in dives but usually makes $200+/night and most importantly, much less BS.

Anybody else seeing stuff like this where you live? Or is this just one more thing that makes LA "special?"

Ric5 · #2 07-23-2008, 05:45 PM

How have clubs tried to screw you?

Any way they think they can!

StyleOverShow · #3 07-23-2008, 05:53 PM

It is a bitter truth that club management do not always respect the 'entertainment'. Be professional and don't presume that the next club guy is an a..hole.

Nate74 · #4 07-23-2008, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StyleOverShow

It is a bitter truth that club management do not always respect the 'entertainment'. Be professional and don't presume that the next club guy is an a..hole.

Good advice, but certainly easier said than done. Even the owners/bookers I've gotten along with reasonably well, I wouldn't trust alone with my sister or my wallet!

Smallmouth_Bass · #5 07-23-2008, 06:29 PM

And they still get bands?

canshaker · #6 07-23-2008, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smallmouth_Bass

And they still get bands?

HA! Welcome to LA!

KsToaDangr · #7 07-23-2008, 07:31 PM

Yet another reason I'm glad I live here. There's 4 clubs within a 10 minute drive from my house that book original bands. The lowest I've ever been paid for a show was $40 for the band, and that night we weren't even on the bill. All four members of the band were going to the show, and I was friends with the lead singer of the headlining band. The opening band didn't show up, so we got asked if we could play a 30 minute set on borrowed equipment in their place. At the after party that night, the guy who let me borrow his bass amp was walking around introducing me to everyone as "one of the best bassists you'll ever meet". I thought he was joking about it, but he swears up and down that he was being serious.

theinnkeeper · #8 07-23-2008, 07:40 PM

Here in miami, you dont have to pay, but at the same time you dont get paid....
The promoters who book the shows keep everything as "operating expenses".
Free Drinks!! Wow really?? people get those?
but then again this is a dance club town, its hard to get people to go to live shows, yet at the same time the promoters usually charge 7-12 bucks at the door..

rakirksey · #9 07-23-2008, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate74

A minimum draw of 25 people per act is expected. If you feel you cannot draw an audience of this size you may consider building your following before booking a show.

Funny ... I just played at Genghis Cohen. Not to reveal the secrets, but I recalled the booking policy.

After reading it my band was like ... hell no there is no point in this. Then the booking agent gave us a call back and was like ... come come come. Interestingly enough, it turns out we were half of the two band night. So they were pretty much done at 10:00 pm since we started at 9:00 pm.

It's no wonder that they don't have many people playing there. Supposedly they can fit 60 people, but realistically 60 people would be a tight squeeze into the pews.

ric1312 · #10 07-23-2008, 07:45 PM

Around here it's common practice for the club managers or whoever is supposed to pay you to skip out before the band is done so they don't get paid. Multiple times I've had club owners give me the run around and not come back with money for an hour or more hoping I will leave.

Contract gigs help, but you can get screwed on them too.

An Iron Maiden tribute act I am friends with and another tribute act booked a gig at a club here on contract. They were told they would get a flat $450 and half the door.

The manager left and then phoned in and told the door guy to split the door between both bands, which was substantially less.

keaau bass · #11 07-23-2008, 08:04 PM

I played a four hour gig at a new club once. After bout an hour we took a fifeteen minute break. The owner asked why we were not playing. We told him were on a short break. He said not while I'm paying you. I said " do want me to wash the dishes". Thats when the whole band got thrown out !! Good thing the musicians union came thru on our side, the guy had to pay us.

lexxmexx · #12 07-23-2008, 09:37 PM

Sheryl Crow was right....

This ain't no disco
It ain't no country club either
This is LA!

6jase5 · #13 07-23-2008, 10:53 PM

I do have to say that the nice part about LA is that there are enough places to play that you can avoid the pay for play bs. San Diego has some decent places and decent club management. We got over $400 the other week playing a place that holds only 80 people at most....all originals. It just goes into the recording budget, so I'm happy.

I have heard of the whiskey wanting 1K in presale tickets which just blows my mind considering 10 years ago I played there once a month with no bs.

Nate74 · #14 07-24-2008, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rakirksey

Funny ... I just played at Genghis Cohen....

It's no wonder that they don't have many people playing there. Supposedly they can fit 60 people, but realistically 60 people would be a tight squeeze into the pews.

Interesting... in a scary way that makes me even less excited about the evening...

mrokern · #15 07-24-2008, 01:01 PM

Mmmmm, makes me warm and fuzzy that I have a lawyer (and a vicious one, at that) for a lead singer. Haven't been screwed yet.

-Mark

Nate74 · #16 07-24-2008, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrokern

Mmmmm, makes me warm and fuzzy that I have a lawyer (and a vicious one, at that) for a lead singer. Haven't been screwed yet.

-Mark

Does he do sub work?

IanStephenson · #17 07-25-2008, 02:06 AM

It's not great, but I've seen much worse:
A minimum draw of 25 people per act is expected..

If you think you'll be playing to less than 25 people, then they're not exactly going to make money are they. Seems a pretty reasonable request. They are a business, and if less than 25 people come in all night, that's pretty bad. Even a new band should be able to round up 25 friends and family.

We pay 4/7 of your generated draw on a $7 ticket....If for some reason your acts brings in fewer than 20 people we reserve the right to forfeit payment.

They PAY you. Some places would make you buy the first 25 tickets up front. You have to hand over $100 for 25 tickets when you confirm the booking, and sell them yourself. Worst case here you get no cash, and you'll probably see something. Best case 50x$4-25-$175: I wouldn't do it, but for an original band it's not a disaster.

We can record a live cd off the board of your show. The cost is $50 payable in cash only. We provide the CD.
they CAN... Don't have to. Your call.

Our seating is limited so do not take any room up in the showroom for your CD or swag.
You said yourself it was tight for space.

Musicians performing can receive one voucher for a half off beverage from the door person valid on the night of their show only.
They don't have to give you anything like this. Why are you complaining cause they give you a drinks discount.

Worst deal I heard, a local band had to buy/resell 25 tickets at $10. They were told NOT to discount under any circumstances. The venue had posters up round town advertising the gig at $8 direct from venue, $6 consessions, and put on a promo so loads of people could get in free!

Shiveringbass · #18 07-25-2008, 03:30 AM

I think itis not just LA.

I'm in France and France is not exactly LA...

I think my original band has been paid 3 times in five years and on those 3, two were notanticipated.

Usualy, club will just give 2 free drinks per band members, period.

You realy must love playing your music to arrive at 7PM, unpack your things including PA, play, then leave at 1AM for two beers.

Jonyak · #19 07-25-2008, 08:08 AM

I played at the mod club in toronto the other night. It was the best gig of my life. they treated us liek rock stars.

We show up, they give us a room above the stage, filled with free heinekins. Plus they paid us for the gig. We had a party in the greenroom with a bunch of friends. it was tons of fun.

mind you in montreal you have to pay to play almost everywhere. and they generaly treat you like crap.

Relic · #20 07-25-2008, 09:19 AM

Well, we had a very interesting situation pop up recently. I'm not sure how to explain this in 1000 words or less but here goes.
We recently had a gig lined up for a Saturday night at a typical dive bar. The pay was set at a previously agreed-to set amount and we had played there before with good results.
Anyway, the Wednesday before the gig, the owner emails us and asks if we can accept 20% of the door charge rather than the set amount.
We talked it over and replied that we'd rather not as we have a lesser draw in the Summer, but would be happy to just reschedule a gig with him for the Fall (much better crowds that time of year here) This way we could advertise and bring in a good crowd.
The guy replies that he's in a bind now because the band that was scheduled for the Friday before us cancelled, so if we could play on Friday, he'll pay us the set amount mentioned earlier.
We agreed. why not right?
We get there, set up and get 3 songs into teh very first set when the guy runs up to the stage and starts screaming at us:
"where are the people, where are the people, don't you have any god-d*amned friends?!? "f-ing rock stars.."etc etc
It got so bad the band, this bar owner, a few patrons are all screaming back and forth: "f-you", "no, f-you!!" blah blah blah.
We packed up and left.
The guy just completely lost it. In my 15+ years of playing I've never seen that before.
I almost think the whole "come and play on Friday" was a set up.