"My buddy's a pro bass player..."

[bassbully]

Kids Just tell him No and you might check him out sometime if you are not out gigging.

[HolmeBass]

Originally Posted by bassmatt4792

The guy says "hey man, my buddy's a pro bass player; can he sit in with you guys? He knows all the songs better than you."

That is an amazingly d!ckish thing to say. At that point I would have said, "Since he's such a pro, I'm sure he has plenty of his own gigs. Let him take the night off."

And that's the truth right there- if the guy was a real pro, there's no way he would approach the stage and ask to play in the middle of a set, and no way he'd "bass vulture" you, standing there 2 feet away staring at you while you play. If he was a real pro he'd enjoy his night off, and might come up and say hello at the end of the set. They were both full of it.

[AMp'D.2play]

Originally Posted by bearhart74

2. No (with no explanation)

This.

[Groovy_Gravy]

Originally Posted by puddin tame

If he is really a pro he is well past the point of hawk eyeing the fingers of the dude in the bar playing green day.

That is something beginner players do out of curiosity and desire to learn, and mediocre insecure players do to try and find reasons to pump their ego up

Hey cmon man! I hawkeye the fingers of the local players when i go out to see them. I gig also but watching others is a good way to pick up on things. we're all friends here in the local music scene though so no one cares. Im the newest to the scene and they all complement me on my playing. On of the guys i sort of look up to (hes a great bassist) even told me that i have better rhythm than him and im a great pocket player.

[bassmatt4792]

Originally Posted by mouthmw

So what did you say to him man? You gotta finish the story.

Oops, I forgot haha. After the guy asked me that, I just said the first thing that came to mind. I leaned back and pointed at the singer/BL and said "it's up to him" but since we had already started playing I doubt they heard me. They stuck around for another song and when I still showed no signs of anything they walked away, leaving the entire bar.

[HolmeBass]

Groovy, it's ok to check out other players, but not from 3 feet away. Sit at a table and do it somewhat nonchalantly. You can learn everything you need to from 25 feet away, and it is mostly about the sound, right?

[Groovy_Gravy]

Originally Posted by HolmeBass

Groovy, it's ok to check out other players, but not from 3 feet away. Sit at a table and do it somewhat nonchalantly. You can learn everything you need to from 25 feet away, and it is mostly about the sound, right?

haha well im not standing on top of the band, but i am watching the fingers

[RustyAxe]

A truly professional musician wouldn't ask such a thing ... if he's a pro he gets all the stage time he wants/needs. He may have even been embarrassed by his friends boldness (I would have been!). No need to be insulting, though, there are "nicer" ways to handle it. Simply say something like, "We don't allow sit-ins at a gig because we've arranged the songs our way, but I'm very happy to meet another bass player, and hope I can catch your band somewhere". Then maybe a short chat about gear, venues, whatever.

Civility and respect go a long way ... even if it's feigned ...

[JohnMCA72]

2 possibilities, if you allow somebody to sub for a regular player:

1. The sub won't be as good as the regular, and the show will suck while he's in there.
2. The sub will be better than the regular, and the show will suck when the regular comes back.

Either case, the show will suck. That doesn't even count the "down time" while the swap is done, introductions made, figure out what to play next, etc. that blows any continuity or momentum you've created.

A substitution (where a "guest" replaces a regular player) is completely different from a sit-in (where the guest is added to the band, using his own gear or a spare instrument that's owned by the band) are 2 completely different animals. I might consider a sit-in, but never, ever a substitution. Even a sit-in requires that the band has at least a good idea who the sitter-in is, what they can do, & it's a decent fit. Still, it has to be a net positive experience for everybody, to be worth the messing around to get everybody ready & on the same page.

[plankspanker13]

I'd probably answer the original request with a question of my own (where's his gig, tonight, then?), followed by stating the "no unrehearsed guests" policy of the band (whether you have one, or not). I'd still try to chat the guy up, during breaks, or tear-down, just to come across better, since you don't know what badmouthing power the guy might be able to exercise, out there in the ether. If he thinks that I am a nice guy, then the "no" has less impact.

People have called me a pro bassist, but, when I have a night off, I am rarely checking out another gig, because I want time away from the environment. If I am on a date, and we happen to go where there is live music, or an artist I particularly like is in town, then these would be the exceptions. I'm not dating, all that much, and there's only a small number of touring acts that I would go out of my way to catch.

[scottfeldstein]

Originally Posted by BassChuck

He's better than me?... and yet... I'm on stage with my bass and he's in the crowd with a beer

This. The ultimate snub in situations like that is to say "oh, where's he playing tonight?" The trick is to sound completely sincere and enthusiastic in your inquiry. Zing.

[bkbirge]

Even Jaco got b'slapped for trying to invite himself to sit in. The last one was fatal. There's a lesson there for your rude bar patrons.

[paganjack]

Well if that ever happened to me I would probably just laugh at them. What a d bag!

I can relate to the urge to want to play when seeing someone's else play but that guy was just being a jerk. "Pro bass player" in this case just means a really insecure crappy player with no gig, probably because he's a douche!

[Russell L]

Once the words "better than you" came out, well, I'd just shake my head and never look back.

[EDIT: I NEVER, EVER ask to sit in anywhere I go.]

[bolophonic]

I would have given him one good wank-off gesture and left it at that.

[droskobass]

Honestly no one appreciates it when people "sit in" especially on Bass. If he's your friend and you need to take a break and you ask him to sit in that's another story. But the privilege of sitting in is something that comes from the people onstage not the other way 'round. Stage rushing is the most uncool amateur thing you could ever do as a pro.

I have had some great singers come and sit in for a song or two, but it's always been the bandleaders call and usually they are people that we've known for a long time and their participation will just ad to the show.

On the other hand, my Uncle is an old time Chicago blues style bass player who used to gig and tour with Big Momma Thornton. One night she was playing in town and next door at a larger venue a young Texas blues guitarist had just finished his show and stopped in to see Big Mamma's set. On the bands insistence the guitarist sat in, played very tastefully and the audience and the band were super stoked. Big Mamma couldn't wait for him to get off stage, she liked the dynamic with her regular guy and didn't appreciate the distraction...

The guitarist sitting in was Stevie Ray Vaughn... so it doesn't matter how "pro" anyone is, sitting in without an invitation from the band leader usually doesn't go over well.

[hennessybass]

Letting anyone that you don't know up on the stage with your band screams amateur, and never turns out well.

My exception would be the big tip! We had a guy at a private party who wanted to play a Johnny Cash song with the band at the end of the night. We did it, and it was HORIBLE. We knew it would be, but the party was over anyway, and we got a $100 tip for letting some dude make a fool of himself for 3 minuets.

[JumboJack]

Originally Posted by Clef_de_fa

For me a pro is just someone who work and treat music as a job and he is as good as the bass star not really someone who play in a cover band even if you make money and treat it as a job ... I mean you won't see Roy Vogt play in a cover band in a bar, it won't happen.

So a pro is someone who will play for a star, be it only in the studio or they are called for a tour with an artist. So they participate in creating or make new music happen live. They aren't in a band.

A cover band will only play in bar or small venue and do music heard a million times, they aren't participating in new music.

[Muttleybass]

I usually just say "Sorry, dude. No sit ins. It's bad for the show and never bodes well. Management doesn't like it, and if we upset them, we might not get booked back."

I've never had my playing insulted, but in your case I might have added, rather snarkily...

"...and you might not want to insult my playing when you ask." Then walk away.

I have NEVER asked, but will play if I'm invited. I've been invited up to play many times by bands I don't know (although, they seem to know me... I've been in some pretty well known bands, I guess). IMO, they've (we've?) worked hard on our show, worked hard to get gigs, worked hard for the reputation... for me, or other people to try to take advantage of our time on stage is just wrong. Go get your own band, do up a promo, go talk to Floyd behind the bar, and get your own darn gig.

[Audiophage]

Unless it was pre-arranged with rehearsals or an open jam type situation I would have to say no.