Note to jazz audiences

[azureblue]

Do not talk through the songs, nor try to talk louder than the music, especially when you are discussing something private. The music just might stop suddenly and leave you yelling your private business to everyone.

Why do people go to hear jazz and spend the evening yakking away, anyway?

[colcifer]

No idea. It bums me out.

[elgecko]

Some people to don't go to hear jazz to "hear jazz", some do it seem hip and cultured.

[waleross]

It also depends on the type of club or venue. A bar is a bar and the crowd didn't come there to see music . When I was first going to see live jazz part of the experience was learning how to listen. I went to some of the big clubs in NYC back when you only had to be 18 to drink ( I know the good ole days !) and it depended on who was playing and where you sat. Usually the bar was the place to talk and the tables was the place to listen ,watch and drink....I doubt if it has changed all that much ....

[Beginner Bass]

There is a difference between going to a sold-out Cannibal Copse show, and seeing a local jazz band. One of them is that etiquette dictates that when the band is playing, you SHUT UP AND LISTEN!

[One Drop]

I remember when these jazz Supper Clubs became all the rage in NYC in the '80s. After one or two horrible experiences trying to listen to the music over the clatter of cutlery and the braying of eating guests I vowed never to darken the doors of any of those establishments again.

Sometimes I feel like a whole generation has forgotten how to experience live music, though things have improved dramatically over the last few years with record companies being forced to earn their crust by putting their artists on the road.

When I set up a bar here with live music two nights a week, about ten years ago, most of the younger members of the audience were incredibly disrespectful to the bands, out of ignorance more than out of malice. Many didn't even know enough to applaud between songs...they assumed you treated a band like you would treat a DJ, I guess.

[projectMalamute]

If people are finding the conversation more compelling than your band maybe you should take a hard look at what you are doing up there.

You don't get reverence and respect just for showing up.

[arose11]

People go out to have a good time. Why should jazz be treated like chamber music all the time anyways?

And maybe if attention is the goal, one will have a better shot at it by actively engaging the audience with something interesting to say

[One Drop]

Originally Posted by arose11

People go out to have a good time. Why should jazz be treated like chamber music all the time anyways?

And maybe if attention is the goal, one will have a better shot at it by actively engaging the audience with something interesting to say

Should it be treated like background music instead?

I doubt saying a few interesting things would shut up the people who need to relate their life stories to each other, maybe they are just in the wrong place?

[eee]

I don't know about that....

If you go and listen to some of the really old jazz records, most of the audiences are fairly..."interactive". There's always noise and yelling over top of the music. Shouldn't jazz be fun too?

[Tampabass]

I go to a jazz concert to hear the jazz, not to hear some idiots yakking about what they did last night.
People who go to a show and yak ceaselessly throughout the entire show are disrespecting the musicians AND the audience members who paid good money to hear the music, not their blabbing.
Sadly, some folks are clueless when it comes to civility and respecting others.

[Deluge Of Sound]

Originally Posted by Beginner Bass

There is a difference between going to a sold-out Cannibal Copse show, and seeing a local jazz band. One of them is that etiquette dictates that when the band is playing, you SHUT UP AND LISTEN!

If I'm going to a show, I'm going to shut up and listen regardless of the genre. I wish more audiences did the same, actually.

[BillW87]

I think there should be a healthy balance. If I go out to hear some live jazz I'd rather go to the club where people are having fun and chatting a bit because that's why I'm going to a jazz club and not a more formal jazz production - to have a fun night out. However there should ALWAYS be a level of respect from the audience to the musicians in their volume of conversation when a performance is going on. Jazz musicians are not lounge pianists who are paid to provide atmosphere music to be talked over, they're putting on an actual performance. As a musician it pays not to take the background buzz personally, but as an audience member its also important to remember your performance etiquette.

[One Drop]

Absolutely, I'm not saying people worship the music silently, just pay a little attention.

For a long stretch of its life jazz was America's popular music, and was intended to make people dance. It was much later that it became music to listen to exclusively, and eventually many jazz musicians wanted to free themselves from the necessity of playing in bars, and wanted the music to be treated the same as chamber music, namely to be lkistened to attentively in rooms with good acoustics.

Of course, when we speak of jazz these days it could mean anything, really, and there are so many venues where various styles are played, but most jazz I know of demands a certain amount of attention to be appreciated.

[Tampabass]

at a concert .... a little bit of chatting between songs, or even a quiet or whispered comment here or two during a song, is fine, IMO.

What incenses me is the people who have running conversations during the entire show. THAT's incredibly rude and self-centered - it's as if they're telling everyone, "Hey, I'm the only one who's important here. Your needs and concerns don't matter a bit."

That's just unacceptable, clueless, arrogance.

I have the same issue with yakkers who insist on spoiling movies for everyone.

[DougD]

Um... It's Jazz, not rock,metal or dance music. You are not going to hold peoples attention unless there is something going on that is important enough for them to pay attention too. People are going to treat it as background music otherwise. You never know, your next big gig may come from people that are talking while you play. If talking bothers you, try ripping into a loud solo. That will shut em up :-)

[RBrownBass]

Originally Posted by Deluge Of Sound

If I'm going to a show, I'm going to shut up and listen regardless of the genre. I wish more audiences did the same, actually.

I agree. But there are opposing viewpoints. Get a load of this guy, for example (three page thread, he's the OP).

Truth told, I've gone to rock shows and sang with the crowd and all that, but I see no reason for people to be critical of listeners who... well, listen and form opinions about what they're hearing. They have the right to enjoy themselves any way they wish, and they certainly aren't bothering anyone.

Originally Posted by projectMalamute

If people are finding the conversation more compelling than your band maybe you should take a hard look at what you are doing up there.

You don't get reverence and respect just for showing up.

+1

Could be any combo of many factors related to the performance, from setlist arrangement (consistency: did you just finish two raucous danceable tunes and then go to something you want them to actually contemplate?) to past performances (what'd you play last time out, who was there and is now here, expecting to hear more of that than what you're doing now), competence (I don't like to introduce that into these threads, as I've rarely heard the player/s in question, but it's a factor) and a bunch more I can't think of.

Originally Posted by One Drop

For a long stretch of its life jazz was America's popular music, and was intended to make people dance. It was much later that it became music to listen to exclusively, and eventually many jazz musicians wanted to free themselves from the necessity of playing in bars, and wanted the music to be treated the same as chamber music, namely to be lkistened to attentively in rooms with good acoustics.

This is important.

Originally Posted by arose11

People go out to have a good time. Why should jazz be treated like chamber music all the time anyways?

People who go out to hear chamber music go out to have a good time. Certain forms of jazz absolutely should be treated like chamber music if the masses are buying into a hierarchy of genres and assigning listener behavior to those genres.

[Tampabass]

If I go to a jazz CONCERT -- not a noisy club -- I go to hear the music, not to hear yakking concertgoers. Whether the music being played is "compelling" doesn't matter a bit.

And how can you tell what's happening with the music anyway if some bozo behind you is treating the show as his or her personal cocktail hour and talking loudly and incessantly?

It's a matter of being civil and treating others -- the artists, the concertgoers -- with respect. Simple concept. Hard for some to grasp.

[bass4u]

Originally Posted by projectMalamute

If people are finding the conversation more compelling than your band maybe you should take a hard look at what you are doing up there.

Excellent point. It really depends on if the venue has a "club" or concert atmosphere.

[thudfromafar]

Originally Posted by BillW87

I think there should be a healthy balance. If I go out to hear some live jazz I'd rather go to the club where people are having fun and chatting a bit because that's why I'm going to a jazz club and not a more formal jazz production - to have a fun night out. However there should ALWAYS be a level of respect from the audience to the musicians in their volume of conversation when a performance is going on. Jazz musicians are not lounge pianists who are paid to provide atmosphere music to be talked over, they're putting on an actual performance. As a musician it pays not to take the background buzz personally, but as an audience member its also important to remember your performance etiquette.

Agreed about the healthy balance part. Talking is ok in some jazz atmospheres, as long as the audience has respect and still understands there are musicians playing. Best solution IMO

Originally Posted by projectMalamute

If people are finding the conversation more compelling than your band maybe you should take a hard look at what you are doing up there.

You don't get reverence and respect just for showing up.

I think this is a bad point honestly, and a horrible attitude. Performers should be aware of what they are doing, but still deserve respect as performers. Just because a lot of people consider jazz as "background music" or "elevator music" doesn't mean that jazz musicians deserve any less respect than a favored Pop Star. Some people just love themselves and are closed-minded and rude. Are you saying that is ok? Btw, does anyone remember about that world-class violinist who played in a NYC subway station, and nobody even stopped to watch and listen? I don't expect everyone to "get" jazz or even like it. But they are performing none the less, and shouldn't have to question their own performing rights just because some schmucks want to make their own small talk (really loudly).

----

Anyways a funny story now. My jazz group usually records with my zoom recorder and sets it right out front. Well I always listen thru the recordings after each gig and it's pretty funny the stuff I hear sometimes during (and between) each song. I have heard some pretty funny and grotesque "personal business" -- I especially remember one time near the end of a tune you could hear this guy talking about doing something... the tune ends and he's just hitting the climax of his story... It turns out I wanted to put that recording on our myspace or whatever cause it was a good one, but I basically had to fade out and cut the ending slightly short because this guy's personal business was about to be known by anyone who would listen to our recording (yes, like all 14 of them).