Pay to Play scammer gets called out on facebook

[baalroo]

alright, this is a link to a local facebook event that is CLEARLY the usual run of the mill pay-to-play operation. Problem is, this dude is doing it right here in my backyard...

"Project Independent" (there's definitely NSFW language here)

except, on this occasion, he's run headlong into a very tightknit music community who is not happy with what he's selling. I figured you guys might find this amusing/interesting/sad/frustrating/insane whatever. ENJOY

obviously, if you're not on FB you might have trouble seeing the event.

[Stinsok]

Awesome.

[spaz21387]

We got involved with one of those pay to play scammers. Ever heard of the indie rebel tour? They did the exact same thing. they asked us for 120$ for all the tickets we were soposed to sell when plan b (the venue) doesnt do that. The band leader was like well you owe us 80$ for all the flyers we made so lets call it even. The guy got offended we played our fans left and we didnt pay. He never said anything about paying to play till after we had played... what is up with that?

[StyleOverShow]

If there is any biz more crooked than the movie biz, it is the music industry.

Can't let the 'artists' handle the business and the mgmt is shady.

Thanks for shining a light on some pretty shady characters.

[baalroo]

and it looks like we ran him out of town, AND he gave those kids their money back and is letting them play a show in a neighboring city at no charge. I don't know how things work in your city, but this makes me pretty proud to be a part of the Wichita music scene. We take care of each other here.

[VTheHTyphoon]

In RI there are a couple pay-to-play companies. A few venues like as220 and Firehouse13 will let them put up shows there every now and then but those places mainly run their own door and give bands a fair cut. The problem comes with those to places not really being metal venues and the real metal venues around RI being controlled by pay-to-play companies. We used to deal with them at a smaller venue where we had to sell tix at $8 a pop, but in order to play Club Hell, you will end up preselling $200 worth of tix, and one company actually had the audacity to ask us to play a rather big venue in RI but sell $750 worth of tix to play it. I am glad that some places have driven these kind of companies out. I wish we could, but it seems like most of them are people who grew up in the local music community and decided to start the whole pay-to-play business rather than some shady jerk passing through. These people are friends with alot of the bands but only do advertising as far as making a flyer and a facebook page. They expect bands to print flyers and put them up and advertise in papers and whatnot.

tl;dr: RI is plagued by that problem and I wish we could change it soon.

EDIT: Not to say that one venue makes a scene, but we used to have an amazing venue called The Living Room. When it closed our scene became what it is now.

[matt descending]

I left the "pay to play" rant from another thread in the comments. I have it bookmarked and post it all the time.

[baalroo]

this "promoter" went back and deleted about 50 comments he made on that event page where he used all sorts of homophobic slurs, threatened to physically injure many different people, called our local scene all sorts of terrible names, and basically just said some of the most ridiculous and unprofessional things I've ever seen come out of the mouth of a show promoter. This guy is CLEARLY a bit unhinged and it really honestly bothers me that kids in other towns all over the country are still gonna get taken by him.

Thanks for the comment there though matt, hopefully some more kids stumble across it and avoid this guy.

[TolerancEJ]

This is the reason Facebook needs to add an "Unlike" button.

[mboogiemanusa]

Before the "pay to play" scammers existed......back in the day when bands ruled the planet, there used to be the same 3rd string promoters running "battle of the bands" scams. These guys would basically get a bunch of bands to play for free by touting thousands of dollars in prizes. Of course the winners never would receive their prizes for various reasons but the venues and promoters always seemed to make money.

[chuck norriss]

wow funny + ugly
hooray for diy kids! run that homophobe mcgee out of town

[bassic.science]

Jesus, pay to play is still around? Info about that scam has been circulating for many years, I figured all musicians would know about it by now. Guess that means we gotta keep banging the drum.

[baalroo]

Originally Posted by bassic.science

Jesus, pay to play is still around? Info about that scam has been circulating for many years, I figured all musicians would know about it by now. Guess that means we gotta keep banging the drum.

There's always fresh bands of 15 year old kids to exploit!

[VTheHTyphoon]

Originally Posted by baalroo

There's always fresh bands of 15 year old kids to exploit!

Come to RI and be surprised how few of the people are 15 doing it. Alot of the bands I've played with on those shows are in their 20s or 30s.

When we had the Living Room it was different because no matter what some production company was pushing you could get a show there without paying. When they closed, companies swooped in and dug their heels into some of the best spots to play. So they make it that you need to go through them to play there.

[pie_man_25]

My town has a guy like this... he's called the only "promoter" in town, and is the only guy that organizes shows in the biggest bar/stage in my town. Management wonders why the business is always bad.

[nobodysfool]

I have a standard for myself: I do not walk out my door with bass and gear unless I am being paid a minimum of a C note. I simply will not waste the time and effort if I am not paid that amount, or more. After playing for 40+ years, I do not have to take low-paying crap gigs. My last gig (as a sub), I played 3 shows over a weekend, and pocketed in excess of 5 times my minimum. With my regular band, I make well more than my minimum every time we play.

We book our own shows, promote ourselves, and have a following. We play on average once a month, because we all have day jobs, and the drummer and I both travel for work. He travels all over our state, I travel all over the nation. Another one of us owns and runs a Funeral home, and the last one works for the local school system. The band has been together for about 33 years in various forms with the same name. 2 of the 4 of us have been in the band since the beginning, I'm the "new guy", but I've been with them for 7 years now.

We have never, and will never do P2P. EVER.

www.backonearthband.com

[steveksux]

Will there be food?

there will be food, but you have to pay $200 for it and then sell plates to your friends for $20 a pop.

Awesomeness the likes of which I have never seen with my own eyes... lol

Randy

[Bo_H]

Originally Posted by bassic.science

Jesus, pay to play is still around? Info about that scam has been circulating for many years, I figured all musicians would know about it by now. Guess that means we gotta keep banging the drum.

It will be around as long as people like my ex-bandmate/band leader keeps giving them money and justifying his actions in the name of "exposure".

Sorry, I'd rather play for free.

[Bo_H]

Originally Posted by baalroo

There's always fresh bands of 15 year old kids to exploit!

It's not just 15 year olds. I mentioned in my last post that my ex-bandmate is falling for it and he's 40 years old!! I even informed him of how these things work. Thanks Talkbass for helping me make a valid point he totally ignored. No wonder I quit that band.

[LiquidMidnight]

That sucks the original page is gone. I really would have enjoyed reading that.

Down with PTP!!!!