*The Official TB History Geek Thread* History addicts, step inside..

[Relic]

This thread is for the sole purpose of talking history in the broadest sense of the word. Me personally, I love history, it's a total passion. Ancient history, recent, military, cultural, myths/legends it's all cool in my book. I know that there are others here who are as rabidly into it as I am, and who I have talked to via PM and in unrelated threads. Here's a chance for all of us to get together and talk freely. Imagine, sitting in a lounge somewhere with some beers or beverage of your choice and doing nothing but BSing about your particular historical interests.. this is the virtual version of that.

Rules (yes rules, I don't want the thread closed because someone just so happens to do something stupid..):
- no flaming or nastiness. This is a discussion, not an argument to the death. It you take a tone with someone and get nasty because you disagree, you're the bigger douche.
- no politics. It's hard to avoid when talking history but rules is rules, yo. TB says no.
- history is based on perception in so many cases. We know that. We also know that bias of many sorts may affect views. Yeppers. Let's leave that for another thread at another time ok? "Human psychology and how it influences our views of history" would make a killer thread, so if you feel utterly compelled to focus on that, please start your own thread on it and I'm sure it will be cool.
-Let's avoid recent history if we can - it's too emotionally and politically charged right now. Let's keep this pre WW1 maybe?
-a request, not a rule: Members of non-European ancestry - please join in and throw some non-Eurocentric facts, figures, legends and such into this thread. I'd like to keep it very broad and interesting.
- cite sources if you want, but it's not mandatory. Personally I've been reading and researching random and various stuff for over 30 years. If I had to locate a single source for something, I'd be lost.

Remember - this can be about ANY aspect of history so long as it falls within the rules and good taste. I'm envisioning a thread that changes, takes twists and turns but always remains interesting.
So let's have at it. I'll post first.

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by Relic

- no politics. It's hard to avoid when talking history but rules is rules, yo. TB says no.

Let's see how many can follow that. IMO, history and politics are inextricably (and inevitably) linked.

Anyways, ummm... what do I talk about? Random history stuff? Say I want to talk about ancient Scandinavian history, maybe others don't. Where do we go from there?

[BobWestbrook]

"Joshua fought the battle of Jericho, and the walls came tumbling down".



Hey, it's a song.

Just thought I'd get it started in the right direction of religion and politics.

J/K - please ignore this post.

[BobWestbrook]

I watched an interesting program on PBS last night, about Stalin, and his interactions with the Americans and British during 1941-1942 after Hitler invaded USSR.

[Relic]

So...
In a recent unrelated thread I mentioned Sarmatian civilization. I'll restart that topic here.
The Sarmatians were a Central Asian type people who lived a nomadic type existence on the steppes of Central Asia all the way into Eastern Europe. They were a known civilization from a few hundred years BC to a few hundred AD.
We know that they fought wars with the Roman Empire as well as many of the Germanic and Slavic tribes in what's now Eastern Europe.
The eerie thing is that although they were a large civilization, documented in many Roman and Greek texts, they have pretty much altogether vanished as a culture and a people. Legend has it (or maybe some weak historical clues have it) that they had settled in the areas of what is now Poland and Serbia and were integrated into the Slavic tribes there and henceforth vanished. However some recent studies have found that the Ossetians (South Ossetia is located in the area of Georgia) may actually be their descendants based on far too many linguistic clues to ignore...

OK, yeah yeah yeah this is boring isn't it??? Here's where it gets good.
Ever heard of them? Well although they have vanished into near oblivion, their influence has not - their women also tended to fight as warriors and may have been equal in status to the men. Because of this many scholars believe that THEY were the template for the Amazons of Greek legend.
Not only that - there is also controversial evidence that the Sarmatians were in Britain during the Roman era. (there was a corny King Arthur movie about this a few years back but it was loosely based on this theory)
In Sarmatian culture and lore, several things pop up repeatedly - the dragon motif for one, and their use a a sword thrust into the ground during ceremonies. (this has appeared in many carvings and burial art) as cooky as it sounds, because of these things, and because of the Romans tendency to "reuse" peoples they conquered in other territories, there are some who believe that the whole semi-mythological King Arthur and his knights may have been inspired by Sarmatian horsemen (they almost always fought on horseback) imported into the British isles.
Personally, I think it's silly but still, there are some odd similarities so who knows.
Anyone else ever hear such a thing?

[Relic]

Originally Posted by champbassist

Let's see how many can follow that. IMO, history and politics are inextricably (and inevitably) linked.

Anyways, ummm... what do I talk about? Random history stuff? Say I want to talk about ancient Scandinavian history, maybe others don't. Where do we go from there?

Talk about whatever you want! If it's something of interest then others will follow, if not, then the thread will go elsewhere (that's my hope at least...)

[Tommygunn]

Here. I'm a Napoleonic wars buff.

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by Tommygunn

Here. I'm a Napoleonic wars buff.

I'm betting your little girlfriend isn't

[EdHunter]

I'm all around on History, and on Wednesday I'm starting my IB Higher Level course...

But my main area of expertise is military history, in particular the pair of World Wars and the Cold War.
Tudor England, The British Empire and Ancient Rome (Republic and Empire) are also strong areas.

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by EdHunter

Ancient Rome (Republic and Empire) are also strong areas.

Do you know who were the people who lived beyond Hadrian's Wall on the Scottish side?

Just a question that's been bugging me for a while

[EBodious]

Originally Posted by Relic

So...
In a recent unrelated thread I mentioned Sarmatian civilization. I'll restart that topic here.
The Sarmatians were a Central Asian type people who lived a nomadic type existence on the steppes of Central Asia all the way into Eastern Europe. They were a known civilization from a few hundred years BC to a few hundred AD.
We know that they fought wars with the Roman Empire as well as many of the Germanic and Slavic tribes in what's now Eastern Europe.
The eerie thing is that although they were a large civilization, documented in many Roman and Greek texts, they have pretty much altogether vanished as a culture and a people. Legend has it (or maybe some weak historical clues have it) that they had settled in the areas of what is now Poland and Serbia and were integrated into the Slavic tribes there and henceforth vanished. However some recent studies have found that the Ossetians (South Ossetia is located in the area of Georgia) may actually be their descendants based on far too many linguistic clues to ignore...

OK, yeah yeah yeah this is boring isn't it??? Here's where it gets good.
Ever heard of them? Well although they have vanished into near oblivion, their influence has not - their women also tended to fight as warriors and may have been equal in status to the men. Because of this many scholars believe that THEY were the template for the Amazons of Greek legend.
Not only that - there is also controversial evidence that the Sarmatians were in Britain during the Roman era. (there was a corny King Arthur movie about this a few years back but it was loosely based on this theory)
In Sarmatian culture and lore, several things pop up repeatedly - the dragon motif for one, and their use a a sword thrust into the ground during ceremonies. (this has appeared in many carvings and burial art) as cooky as it sounds, because of these things, and because of the Romans tendency to "reuse" peoples they conquered in other territories, there are some who believe that the whole semi-mythological King Arthur and his knights may have been inspired by Sarmatian horsemen (they almost always fought on horseback) imported into the British isles.
Personally, I think it's silly but still, there are some odd similarities so who knows.
Anyone else ever hear such a thing?

i heard they were, "good."

[Relic]

Originally Posted by champbassist

Do you know who were the people who lived beyond Hadrian's Wall on the Scottish side?

Just a question that's been bugging me for a while

The Picts?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picts

[EdHunter]

Originally Posted by champbassist

Do you know who were the people who lived beyond Hadrian's Wall on the Scottish side?

Just a question that's been bugging me for a while

Now then, the use of a smiley face suggests this could be a QI style trap, and when I say "celts and picts" a screen bearing that legend will flahs ebhind me and I'll lose 10 points.

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by Relic

The Picts?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picts

That seems accurate!

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Tommygunn

Here. I'm a Napoleonic wars buff.

Alright so I'll use this to try to illustrate my goal with this thread.

So you like the history of the Napoleonic Wars - what are your thoughts as to the War of 1812 being a direct extension of the Napoleonic Wars vs the War of 1812 being something only very slightly related or even totally unrelated at best?

[jp58]

Originally Posted by Relic

- cite sources if you want, but it's not mandatory. Personally I've been reading and researching random and various stuff for over 30 years. If I had to locate a single source for something, I'd be lost.

I've had somewhere in the neighborhood of 11 history classes since I've been in college... I probably can't find any of my sources either.

And Pre-WWI? Aww... I wanted to argue about Desert Storm, or Somalia, or maybe Korea...


So I saw an interesting button the other day. It was for Taft when he was getting elected President. Went something along the lines of:

T-ake
A-dvice
F-rom
T-eddy

Also I am soon to go see the oldest member of our family. He's been keeping the history and the like since he got back from WWII and I was chosen as his defacto replacement to keep our family records. He's got some as old as the 1840's and those cited sources from 1782. Did I mention how big of an honor that's going to be?

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by EdHunter

Now then, the use of a smiley face suggests this could be a QI style trap, and when I say "celts and picts" a screen bearing that legend will flahs ebhind me and I'll lose 10 points.

But what's the answer?

[EdHunter]

Originally Posted by champbassist

But what's the answer?

Right, I'll stick my neck out with The Picts :/

But as I said, my main area of expertise is '39-45

[EBodious]

Originally Posted by jp58

Also I am soon to go see the oldest member of our family. He's been keeping the history and the like since he got back from WWII and I was chosen as his defacto replacement to keep our family records. He's got some as old as the 1840's and those cited sources from 1782. Did I mention how big of an honor that's going to be?

that is way cool. and quite a responsibility. i heard a bunch of stories growing up, but none of us made an organized effort to keep track formally.

all of my grandparents and their siblings are gone, as is my dad. i am aware that a lot of knowledge went with them all.

[jp58]

Originally Posted by EBodious

that is way cool. and quite a responsibility. i heard a bunch of stories growing up, but none of us made an organized effort to keep track formally.

all of my grandparents and their siblings are gone, as is my dad. i am aware that a lot of knowledge went with them all.

Our history has been very important to some members of our family, and it has been kept track of pretty well.

My great-great uncle picking me to take his place is quite the honor, because as it goes, I am to be the head of our family until it is my time to get a replacement.

Not to mention I get to keep all the old leather bound books and stuff.