Anti Lock Brakes (an opinion)

MadMan118 · #1 07-03-2010, 03:24 PM

I hate them, they almost killed me. I was driving down three lane avenue today road was clear in front of and behind me. Driving my friends 2003 Toyota 4 Runner I approached a light, that was green and just past the light is a centre turn lane. The BMW in the lane decided to cut across my lane to get into a gas station. about 10 to 20 feet in front of me. I out the brakes down, hard. The truck made no effort to stop. Not even an itsy bit. I now had no other option but to make a wide sweep to either side of the BMW which had now stopped IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD, probably cause he thought HE was going to die too. Making a swerve to the right I crazed the passenger mirror on a telephone pole. after pulling to the side of the road and pulling the parking brake to get the truck to stop before it barrelled through another intersection. After checking that the other driver was okay and that nothing on his car was broken I woke my friend up and told him he could drive the next blocks home and I was taking the bus back home. And told him I would pay to replace the mirror.
Okay now I sure PLENTY of you are going to diagnose this as human error, and my driving skills. And while it is possible I made a mistake of lapse of judgement, the situation was not helped by the fact that this 4000lb vehicle would not stop, at all. Just saying I kinda like my cars to stop a little better then they go.

Mike N · #2 07-03-2010, 03:27 PM

I've disabled the anti-stop brakes on every ABS equipped vehicle I've ever owned.

Unrepresented · #3 07-03-2010, 03:39 PM

I dislike anti-lock brakes as much as I greatly appreciate them at other times.

There're definitely trade offs with them.

stratovani · #4 07-03-2010, 04:02 PM

When I learned to drive (in the early 70s) there was no such thing as anti-lock brakes. As a matter of fact there were still some cars on the road that had 4-wheel unpowered drum brakes - those were fun to stop! We had to learn to "feather" the brake pedal, which was a rapid stacatto application of brake pressure. We did just fine. I've never liked ABS brakes. I like to be in complete control of my car when I'm driving.

MadMan118 · #5 07-03-2010, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stratovani

When I learned to drive (in the early 70s) there was no such thing as anti-lock brakes. As a matter of fact there were still some cars on the road that had 4-wheel unpowered drum brakes - those were fun to stop! We had to learn to "feather" the brake pedal, which was a rapid stacatto application of brake pressure. We did just fine. I've never liked ABS brakes. I like to be in complete control of my car when I'm driving.

I grew up in northern rural Alaska, and that's how I learned to drive.No way in hell would I drive an ABS car up there in the winter.

malthumb · #6 07-03-2010, 04:23 PM

Madman118,

From what you've described, it sounds like you experienced a problem with bad brakes not a problem with the anti-lock system. If you stomped on the brakes and nothing happened, you either had worn pads or the booster wasn't delivering enough pressure to adequately apply the brakes. Those problems can exist in a brake system with or without ABS.

MadMan118 · #7 07-03-2010, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malthumb

Madman118,

From what you've described, it sounds like you experienced a problem with bad brakes not a problem with the anti-lock system. If you stomped on the brakes and nothing happened, you either had worn pads or the booster wasn't delivering enough pressure to adequately apply the brakes. Those problems can exist in a brake system with or without ABS.

Well the car was stopping fine earlier, under normal circumstances but the second I applied stress to the system it crapped out on me. I could feel that there was pressure in the line but the car slowed very slightly. It could be a failure of the brake system, but I've had this experience with ABS brakes before that and I'm probably biased against ABS and computer controlled things for that matter.

Unrepresented · #8 07-03-2010, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malthumb

Madman118,

From what you've described, it sounds like you experienced a problem with bad brakes not a problem with the anti-lock system. If you stomped on the brakes and nothing happened, you either had worn pads or the booster wasn't delivering enough pressure to adequately apply the brakes. Those problems can exist in a brake system with or without ABS.

Good point. Could've been the master cylinder failing.

Mike N · #9 07-03-2010, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stratovani

When I learned to drive (in the early 70s) there was no such thing as anti-lock brakes. As a matter of fact there were still some cars on the road that had 4-wheel unpowered drum brakes - those were fun to stop! We had to learn to "feather" the brake pedal, which was a rapid stacatto application of brake pressure. We did just fine. I've never liked ABS brakes. I like to be in complete control of my car when I'm driving.

My 68 SS396 ElCamino has four wheel manual drum brakes. Stops just fine. I was going to convert it to power front disc but at this point see no reason to do so.

L-A · #10 07-03-2010, 05:02 PM

It was probably a mechanical failure, amplified by the ABS. Otherwise, it means all wheels lost traction, which sounds unlikely.

MadMan118 · #11 07-03-2010, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-A

It was probably a mechanical failure, amplified by the ABS. Otherwise, it means all wheels lost traction, which sounds unlikely.

That seems likely,I had traction other wise the end of this situation would have been a lot worse.

mulchor · #12 07-03-2010, 05:31 PM

When they work, it's still a helpless feeling.

ehque · #13 07-03-2010, 06:23 PM

If you had traction the ABS probably was working fine - to my knowledge the only thing it prevents is wheel lock which leads to loss of traction, isn't it?

ABS saved me once. New driver, had to stop in a VERY short distance in the rain. Managed to do it without skidding off into the horizon.

Porkbun · #14 07-03-2010, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malthumb

Madman118,

From what you've described, it sounds like you experienced a problem with bad brakes

He was driving a toyota....

Let It Fall · #15 07-03-2010, 09:40 PM

If you didnt feel chatter in the brakes it wasnt abs. Tell your friend to check the brake system.

To disengauge ABS pull fuse, usually under the hood.

I sometimes wire up a switch to my abs so I can turn them on or off in the cab. ABS sucks offroad, I have driven in cars that their abs work GOOD. Other cars the 3rd gen 4runner for instance SUCKS.

elgecko · #16 07-03-2010, 09:43 PM

Sometimes, I want my brakes to lock. I've never owned a vehicle with ABS.

MadMan118 · #17 07-03-2010, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Let It Fall

If you didnt feel chatter in the brakes it wasnt abs. Tell your friend to check the brake system.

To disengauge ABS pull fuse, usually under the hood.

I sometimes wire up a switch to my abs so I can turn them on or off in the cab. ABS sucks offroad, I have driven in cars that their abs work GOOD. Other cars the 3rd gen 4runner for instance SUCKS.

Yeah I'll tell him to check his brakes. I used to have a 3rd gen 4Runner loved that car but the brake system was horrible.I really don't like the brake systems in most Toyotas. My dad has an 07 Yaris that takes an age to stop for such a light car.

Jay Ralston · #18 07-03-2010, 09:57 PM

Your issues sounds more like the master cylinder failed not the ABS. . The only thing the ABS does is prevent the wheels from locking up thus giving you better traction and shorter stopping distance which is a good thing but if the master cylinder fails, there is no or very little pressure applied to the brakes so the brakes either completely fail or work very little. Look at it like the brakes on a bicycle. If you apply those breaks, but they are out of adjustment and barely apply pressure to the rim of the tire, then the bike won't stop. With the hydraulics of a vehicles braking system, it is no different. They don't apply enough pressure to stop so thus the brakes fail.

3506string · #19 07-04-2010, 01:11 AM

I thank God everyday or ABS when ever I see see drivers (usually young female) accelerate up until 2 feet away from a stop sign and slam on the brakes as if the stop sign popped out of the ground to catch them off guard.

Stumbo · #20 07-04-2010, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MadMan118

After checking that the other driver was okay and that nothing on his car was broken I woke my friend up and told him he could drive the next blocks home and I was taking the bus back home.

This is what I find interesting about the whole deal. Must not have been too bad for him to sleep through the whole deal.

j/k.

Glad you're okay. +1 on getting the brakes checked out. Maybe the fluid was old, low hydraulic pressure or some other maintenance issue your "friend" hasn't attend to.

IME, when ABS works, it we'll save you. You can't "feather" the brakes as well as ABS. ABS "feathers" the brakes about 100 times a second. It's saved me a couple of times. ABS also allows you to control/steer the vehicle while you have full force applied to the brake pedal. Can't do better than that on the highway/street.