BASSMASTA R.I.P

[RAGEbassman]

Hey guys, do you know anything about why BASSMASTA shutdown!?

[JimB52]

Some pesky copyright thing. It's been down for a while, I think.

[GeneralElectric]

I was on it awhile ago.

[champbassist]

Supposedly it was because of action (or the threat of action) from the MPA. I think something similar happened a couple of times before as well and the site bounced back each time (or so I read in discussions in forums including TB). This time it's probably gone for good. I don't use tabs (just came to know about this matter due to this thread) so I can't say I feel a certain way about the site's closure, but the actions of the MPA (against bassmasta and a bunch of other sites) seem like another example of the blind ferocity with which authorities are 'protecting' their 'rights' without a semblance of common sense.

Here's an archived version of the site from Oct 2009, if that helps: BASS TABS — Learn to Play Bass @ BassMasta.net

You can do everything here except search, post comments and other interactive actions. You'll have to manually browse to any song you wish to get.

Also, apparently, the whole site was archived by someone just before it shut down and is up for download via TPB.

[Webtroll]

that's a lotta tab

[tastybasslines]

I don't see how there can be any copyright violation. The tabs are interpretations of the song structure, and cannot be taken as absolute truth. Next thing you know, the MPA is gonna show up at your gig and fine you for your inaccurate cover of Sweet Home Alabama.

[jmattbassplaya]

Originally Posted by tastybasslines

I don't see how there can be any copyright violation. The tabs are interpretations of the song structure, and cannot be taken as absolute truth. Next thing you know, the MPA is gonna show up at your gig and fine you for your inaccurate cover of Sweet Home Alabama.

That actually has happened. I recall one band either getting sued or having a lawsuit threatened against them because they played "Interstate Love Song" at a gig.

[steelhead2]

havent visted in awhile but if memory serves me correctly,the tabs are posted by contributors so they may or may not be accurate to the studio cuts

and in fact i recall various contributions to the same song(s),so,,let's see,,ah yes green grass and high tides/outlaws,must have been 5 versions posted.

myself i'm tired of all the BS concerning copyright,,,i'm all for the bands/writers that did the orig. releases getting paid,but don't you play it!,and don't YOU orig artists put in another bassman for Free Bird after Leon Wilkinson died,i'll sue YOU for adulterating the ORIG score,,get what i'm saying here?(if yer a Skynyrd fan you know what i'm talking about fo sho!)

it's fine to expect a hit to pay but go out on tour 35 years later=it aint the same,that's all their is to it so if my version is off key, off time,i'm filling in because we don't have 3 guitarists a keyboard player etc,what makes it the same?,the groove,,it's not like i(we) are attempting a total tight cover of the orig release so that you could not tell from the orig),,,ok i'll stop,peace ya'll,gotta hit monday morning with a vengence

[tastybasslines]

Originally Posted by jmattbassplaya

That actually has happened. I recall one band either getting sued or having a lawsuit threatened against them because they played "Interstate Love Song" at a gig.

That's disgraceful.

[tastybasslines]

Originally Posted by steelhead2

myself i'm tired of all the BS concerning copyright,,,i'm all for the bands/writers that did the orig. releases getting paid,but don't you play it!,and don't YOU orig artists put in another bassman for Free Bird after Leon Wilkinson died,i'll sue YOU for adulterating the ORIG score,,get what i'm saying here?(if yer a Skynyrd fan you know what i'm talking about fo sho!)

The artists' argument is based on Game Theory. You win I lose. You go 10 yards in a football game, I lose 10. You win 5 bucks, I lose 5 bucks...etc.

So they have this ingrained idea that if I play a song with my cover band, the people listening won't need or want to listen to that song. Make bass tabs of my song, and you are taking away the intellectual property of what I created. And so on.

In the mid 80's when VHS became prominent and Blockbuster started popping up all over, the movie industry coalition (or whatever their organization/union is called) sued Blockbuster, alleging that no one would ever come to the movies anymore since they can watch the same move at home for much less. (Zero Sum Game) As time progressed, they realized that each industry fed the other one. Win-win. Blockbuster created more interest for movies, and the theaters helped Blockbuster. In fact, the movie industry's business saw a statistical spike due to Blockbuster.

This is the case with music. I spread Free Bird or SHA by playing it and exposing it to people who have never heard it. Take it away and provide it from only one source, and your songs will never grow. To tell people they cannot play your song, or that helping other to learn it by posting inaccurate tabs (and almost all of them are) is insane.

[PerlNinja]

Bassmasta has been on a decline for a long time, since it's redirecting to Songsterr now, I'm thinking it had more to do with cashing in on some possible revenue off traffic coming through than it did with any MPA action. Outside of that, 911tabs is where it's at.

[champbassist]

Originally Posted by tastybasslines

This is the case with music. I spread Free Bird or SHA by playing it and exposing it to people who have never heard it. Take it away and provide it from only one source, and your songs will never grow. To tell people they cannot play your song, or that helping other to learn it by posting inaccurate tabs (and almost all of them are) is insane.

While the authorities' argument is obviously idiotic as you note, if I was on the MPA's side, I could argue that tabs are still a way to transmit music. By your argument (that tabs may be an inaccurate representation of music) I could put illegal songs up for download at low bit rates and say that they are inaccurate representations of the original recording because a lot of the recorded musical data has been eroded in conversion. Then again (arguing from our side), the recordings of music constitute music in the absolutely direct form, whereas tabs are obviously indirect.

The point, as I see it, is that any intent to transmit copyrighted music in any form is what they are against, not the final result of the transmission. I totally agree, though, that the MPA's stance is utterly disgusting.

[Happynoj]

I guess that their argument is that people posting tabs free on the Internet undercuts potential revenue streams for the copyright holders because if they release a book of Metallica tabs, who would buy it when they could get exactly the same thing free from the Internet?

However, in my experience, commercial and legal availability of transcriptions of popular music is massively lacking. If you want a transcription of Muse bass part, you might be able to find a book with a selection of 15 or 20 'best of' Muse songs, but afaik, they haven't released album specific bass transcription books with all the tracks in, let alone any B sides or covers.

This leaves you stuck. You don't have the ability to transcribe the parts yourself, and you can't legally obtain a transcription, because the copyright holders haven't provided any, and won't let anyone else provide you with one. What do you do?

[Simo98]

So petty.

[Happynoj]

I just had a shower and was thinking about this.

Apple could provide legal tabs through iTunes. They've already got contacts with the copyright owners (i.e. record companies) and a royalties system that pays the copyright owners when someone downloads their music. They could add a button next to songs in iTunes and in the iTunes store that said 'Buy Tab'. When you click on it, it would offer you a choice of bass, guitar, keys, drums, vocals, etc. and then for x amount of money, would allow you to download a pdf file that had a tab transcription and a proper notes transcription. iTunes would pay a proportion of the fee to the copyright holders in royalties, a proportion to the person who transcribed it, and keep a proportion themselves.

To ensure accuracy, all tabs would have to be checked before being added to the store, but I envisage a system where anyone can submit a transcription, and then as long as it was accurate they would earn a little bit of money every time someone payed to download it. This would mean that not just really popular songs would be transcribed. It would also encourage a community of regular transcribers who could gradually work their way through all of the songs ever written.

Does anyone here work for Apple and fancy getting my idea turned into reality? I've got dibs on all RATM and Muse tabs.

[Jhengsman]

Originally Posted by Happynoj

I just had a shower and was thinking about this.

Apple could provide legal tabs through iTunes. They've already got contacts with the copyright owners (i.e. record companies) and a royalties system that pays the copyright owners when someone downloads their music. They could add a button next to songs in iTunes and in the iTunes store that said 'Buy Tab'. When you click on it, it would offer you a choice of bass, guitar, keys, drums, vocals, etc. and then for x amount of money, would allow you to download a pdf file that had a tab transcription and a proper notes transcription. iTunes would pay a proportion of the fee to the copyright holders in royalties, a proportion to the person who transcribed it, and keep a proportion themselves.

To ensure accuracy, all tabs would have to be checked before being added to the store, but I envisage a system where anyone can submit a transcription, and then as long as it was accurate they would earn a little bit of money every time someone payed to download it. This would mean that not just really popular songs would be transcribed. It would also encourage a community of regular transcribers who could gradually work their way through all of the songs ever written.

Does anyone here work for Apple and fancy getting my idea turned into reality? I've got dibs on all RATM and Muse tabs.

There are already sheet music vendors. Seeing how the music industry won't let old TV shows to be released on DVD should a song play in the background for ten seconds I doubt if they can get the unit price down far enough to sell an authorized TAB which would immediately be copied and posted to all of the free chord and tab sites.

[hdracer]

Songsterr bought them out. Thats old news.

[Happynoj]

Originally Posted by Jhengsman

There are already sheet music vendors. Seeing how the music industry won't let old TV shows to be released on DVD should a song play in the background for ten seconds I doubt if they can get the unit price down far enough to sell an authorized TAB which would immediately be copied and posted to all of the free chord and tab sites.

Seeing as Apple are already selling the actual songs for cheap, I'm sure they could work out something similar with transcriptions. And as far as existing paid tab sites go, none of them have the power, reach, usability or interface that iTunes has. Every teenager in the US and Europe has iTunes on their computer.

[Bassamatic]

I cannot imagine that tabs are affected by copyrights. I remember some years ago that the companies providing elevator music sent out MIDI versions of the songs, and since they weren't transmitting the actual music didn't have to pay copyrights.

[kdiggity]

Originally Posted by hdracer

Songsterr bought them out. Thats old news.

Yep.

Directly from the site owner, Daniel, at the time:

"To the members of BassMasta and Guitarmasta.net:
Thereʼs no easy way to say this. After almost a decade of developing this amazing resource for musicians, I have decided that the time of the ‘Masta community has come to an end.
This wasnʼt an easy decision, and itʼs one that Iʼve arrived at after much discussion, meditation, and prayer. Itʼs become more apparent that as a one man shop, I donʼt have the resources or time to attain the proper licenses that would enable me to deliver the content you love. Fortunately, the good people at Songsterr have generously offered to take the domains off my hands. Iʼve accepted the offer, and now the future of online tabs and music education rests in their incredibly capable hands.
Iʼve dreamt of creating a community that was safe, educational, and inspiring to enable the next generation of musicians grow in maturity and skill with their instruments. I believe that the people at Songsterr have the talent, vision, and resources to bring that dream to fruition.
Soon, my urls will begin forwarding to theirs, and Bass/GuitarMasta will be no more. I hope the transition will be a smooth one for you. The important thing for you is to save any content here that youʼve contributed or that you rely on. Once the lights go out it will be irretrievable.
Iʼve learned so much running the sites, and Iʼve enjoyed my time here with you immensely. Iʼve grown as a musician and designer, and Iʼve learned much about what it takes to develop a good community. I hope that you have learned as much using the sites as I have from running it.
In once sense, itʼs sad for an amazing period in my life to come to an end. But itʼs with breathless anticipation that I wait to see what life has in store for me next. I wish you all the best of luck with your music and all your other pursuits. Hereʼs to the future!
Sincerely,
Daniel Christopher
The Bass Masta"

There are copies of the site available through your friendly torrent client.

-K