Confederate Flag over amps. Please no racism!

powellmacaque · #1 05-08-2010, 11:05 PM

Hey guys. Before I start a huge flame fest, please note that I am not racist whatsoever. I also understand the negative connotations associated with this flag, but stick with me.

I may be joining a southern punk rock band, and as many of you know the confederate flag is a very big symbol in a lot of southern groups. I know the other guys have suggested me hanging a confederate flag from my amp, and to be honest, I wouldn't have a problem with it because I see it as a southern symbol. The other guys in the band wear the stuff, and they're not racist either (if they were, I'd be out in an instant). Since this band is punk-related, they use it more as a sign of rebellion (kind of how the Sex Pistols used the Union Jack and the Anarchy symbol... these guys actually superimpose the Anarchy A into the Confederate flag).

Here's my deal: I'm not really southern (I was born and raised in NY) and I don't want to really ruin my chances of getting gigs from people who might be offended by this flag (I play more than just southern rock and have done hip-hop, gospel, latin, and motown-style gigs before). I was thinking of instead, draping the Bonnie Blue (flag of West Florida) or the Florida Flag on my amp instead. Is this a better alternative? I mean, if the band keeps the Confederate motif, I personally won't be too much against the flag to include it on my stuff, but like I said, I don't want to offend future employers.

Any suggestions? PLEASE don't turn this political/racial/social. I don't care what your views are, and I'm sorry if this is a touchy subject to some, but I just wanna know what I could do to avoid being seen as a bigot by others.

Edit: mods, if this gets out of hand at all, let me know. I really am not trying to start anything immature with this.

BassScum · #2 05-08-2010, 11:22 PM

Are they demanding/requiring you to hang it on your amp? If not and you are uncomfortable with it in anyway, then simply decline.

fourstringburn · #3 05-08-2010, 11:23 PM

Hang the American flag. If the people you play with see that as offensive (which unfortunately some people in our country do) than why would you want to play with them.

Always be honest with yourself and try not to conform to what others do or think you should do.

MEKer · #4 05-08-2010, 11:30 PM

Don't be so apologetic/paranoid with the subject. No need to be. Read some history.

Past that, if you are in the band and they use the ol' Bars and Stars-whether YOU have one on your gear or not is meaningless---the band does and you are part of the band.

And past that---make up your own mind. No one here is in your shoes, that band or your circumstances.

heytrid · #5 05-08-2010, 11:31 PM

its been done, over and over and over southern punk band or not, if they are not a well known southern punk rock band then that would be my cue that they just want to look the part so they are accepted.

powellmacaque · #6 05-08-2010, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fourstringburn

Hang the American flag. If the people you play with see that as offensive (which unfortunately some people in our country do) than why would you want to play with them.

Always be honest with yourself and try not to conform to what others do or think you should do.

Never really thought of the American Flag, but I don't know how comfortable I'd be draping that over my amp with people spitting and throwing beer around and possibly ruining the flag (it is punk rock).

I think this would be a good alternative:

as most people in the south know it's a southern flag, and most in the north don't know what it is.

The whole concept of the band is kind of the civil war and revolutionary war sense of rebellion against tyranny (once again, don't want this thread to turn sour, so I'll keep it at that). So I do respect the motif we have going. I like being abrasive and pushing the limits (being a punk) but I do not, however, want to be seen as offensive, intolerant, or ignorant.

billoetjen · #7 05-08-2010, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powellmacaque

Any suggestions? PLEASE don't turn this political/racial/social.

That's a laugh. OP starts the most political/racial thread on TB and asks folks to keep it neutral.
No excuse for displaying one of the most blatant racist symbols from this country's history, UNLESS you ARE racist.

powellmacaque · #8 05-08-2010, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billoetjen

That's a laugh. OP starts the most political/racial thread on TB and asks folks to keep it neutral.
No excuse for displaying one of the most blatant racist symbols from this country's history, UNLESS you ARE racist.

^This isn't a neutral statement. Look, I'm not racist. The other folks gave neutral statements and advice. And like other folks said, read some history before making that statement.

billoetjen · #9 05-08-2010, 11:53 PM

I teach history, as well as breath it, live it and critically think about it. I read history every night. Obviously, I'm wasting my time with you.

powellmacaque · #10 05-08-2010, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billoetjen

I teach history, as well as breath it, live it and critically think about it. I read history every night. Obviously, I'm wasting my time with you.

Hey man, I'd like to honestly and maturely discuss this topic with you if you'd like. Send me a PM. Being a northern transplant into the south, I think you'd find the anthropology a bit interesting and a bit less black and white than how they teach it up north.

Edit: I see your profile says you have a dislike for Republicans. Consider that I'm not a Republican and I think you'd understand my point of view a bit more.

bassteban · #11 05-09-2010, 12:10 AM

I'm from the north- if Northern California qualifies as *North*

and I'd like to know what the big star flag is.

Edit: Just the name of the flag would work- I'm fluent in Wiki/google

Waterpilot · #12 05-09-2010, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billoetjen

I teach history

And this is in your profile?

Other Hobbies & Interests:
Pissing on/off republicans

At least you won't be teaching anything with a bias...

On topic, do you think you will be viewed any differently when your entire band uses it anyway?

Roadrunr · #13 05-09-2010, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billoetjen

I teach history, as well as breath it, live it and critically think about it. I read history every night. Obviously, I'm wasting my time with you.

hey good lib responce.I bet you teach the new liberal history slant(my way or no way).

bassteban · #14 05-09-2010, 12:14 AM

ON topic- personally, I'd avoid it, but being far from the region where these things mean so much, I'm pretty ignorant. I guess you not having one wouldn't make a huge diff if everyone sle in the band had one. Dunno...

powellmacaque · #15 05-09-2010, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bassteban

I'm from the north- if Northern California qualifies as *North*

and I'd like to know what the big star flag is.

Edit: Just the name of the flag would work- I'm fluent in Wiki/google

wiki Bonnie Blue Flag, Republic of West Florida.

powellmacaque · #16 05-09-2010, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waterpilot

On topic, do you think you will be viewed any differently when your entire band uses it anyway?

Yea, I guess I never really thought of it that way.

I'm trying to think of ways to convey the "we're from the south and we're rebellious'" vibe without conveying the "we're from the south and we're intolerant'" vibe.

Dr. Cheese · #17 05-09-2010, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powellmacaque

Hey guys. Before I start a huge flame fest, please note that I am not racist whatsoever. I also understand the negative connotations associated with this flag, but stick with me.

I may be joining a southern punk rock band, and as many of you know the confederate flag is a very big symbol in a lot of southern groups. I know the other guys have suggested me hanging a confederate flag from my amp, and to be honest, I wouldn't have a problem with it because I see it as a southern symbol. The other guys in the band wear the stuff, and they're not racist either (if they were, I'd be out in an instant). Since this band is punk-related, they use it more as a sign of rebellion (kind of how the Sex Pistols used the Union Jack and the Anarchy symbol... these guys actually superimpose the Anarchy A into the Confederate flag).

Here's my deal: I'm not really southern (I was born and raised in NY) and I don't want to really ruin my chances of getting gigs from people who might be offended by this flag (I play more than just southern rock and have done hip-hop, gospel, latin, and motown-style gigs before). I was thinking of instead, draping the Bonnie Blue (flag of West Florida) or the Florida Flag on my amp instead. Is this a better alternative? I mean, if the band keeps the Confederate motif, I personally won't be too much against the flag to include it on my stuff, but like I said, I don't want to offend future employers.

Any suggestions? PLEASE don't turn this political/racial/social. I don't care what your views are, and I'm sorry if this is a touchy subject to some, but I just wanna know what I could do to avoid being seen as a bigot by others.

Edit: mods, if this gets out of hand at all, let me know. I really am not trying to start anything immature with this.

There is probably nothing more meaningless than to say you are not a racist. Your personal attitude will mean nothing to people who don't know you and see nothing but a symbol that frankly does have a strong appeal to racists. I know many swear by the "heritage, not hate" argument, but there is no denying all of the Klan/Skinhead/Nazi types who love the Confederate Battle Flag.

If you are comfortable sporting a symbol that will portray you a certain way, then do it and accept the possible fallout. If you do not want to be associated with the baggage that comes with the Confederate Flag, then don't use it.

It's a free country, and express yourself as you see fit. just don't try to have it both ways because with a symbol that loaded because you won't be able to pull it off.

Waterpilot · #18 05-09-2010, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powellmacaque

I'm trying to think of ways to convey the "we're from the south and we're rebellious'" vibe without conveying the "we're from the south and we're intolerant'" vibe.

There is just so much negativity associated with that flag... No matter what your intentions. I'd look for a different way so you don't get stereotyped in. What about inventing your own flag?

TIMD · #19 05-09-2010, 12:33 AM

I wouldn't play in a band with rebel flags and I was born in Louisiana and raised in Texas. I love the south and the music that comes from it (blues, rock, jazz, country, blue grass, r&b) but I don't care for what that flag represents.

powellmacaque · #20 05-09-2010, 12:34 AM

I'm really leaning towards just a Florida and maybe the Bonnie Blue flag. Much safer. I know the other guys in the band use this flag occasionally too.

I know the idea was tossed around of using different colors with the same motif (black instead of the red background, white instead of the blue bars, black stars). Would that be a bit of a different idea, or is it too close to the rebel flag?

It really is a shame that the flag has been used by hate groups. As dumb as this sounds, I really like the way it looks (I remember being a little kid and seeing the flag waving with the American flag on some guy's bumper and saying to my dad "what country is that dad? they've got a really cool flag").

I really do appreciate the majority of you who responded in a helpful tone.