Copy Protection for TV Programs?

[burk48237]

I am not an illegal downloader. I have strong feelings about taking someone's music or any creative work (movies) I don't pay for. But last night I went to record a TV show episode on a non premium commercial station. My relatively new DVD-R would not record it. The screen flashed "copy protected". I did some research and found out that all of the new DVD-R's in the US are required to be sold with software that reads new copy protections from digital TV. Hence the rush to switch the whole country over to digital. And that many non premium channels and networks (Fox, FX, USA, even ESPN) are copy protecting their content, and more are planning to. They are even introducing protection for TIVO and DVR's which limits the amount of times and how long after a show was produced that you can watch the program. I understand premium channels like HBO and Showtime which run commercial free programs and first run movies protecting program. They operate on a much more limited revenue stream. I also would have no problem with copy protection that limited the number of copies. But this leaves me with a few questions:

1) What purpose does a DVD-R have if you can't copy any TV programs? Even some old VHS tapes have protection. They should be required to warn before you by that the new DVD-R you just bought that it is essentially worthless.

2) With ESPN copy protecting, how will you be able to relive old sports memories if they don't market the DVD's? A vast majority of sports events aren't available on DVD and yet ESPN plans to copy protect everything.

3) When the government mandated digital it mandated the purchase of DVD's of TV programs if you want to save certain episodes. Essentially what this means is the government gave the entertainment and additional revenue stream while requiring you to pay for watching the commercials that pay for their shows. Is that a great deal or what? Not only do I have to pay to watch commercials on cable to get digital signal, but I can't record it. I have to buy it, in some cases ridiculously priced boxed sets when I only want an episode or two. Such a great deal.

Mods, I hope this last one isn't considered political, I'm certainly not blaming any one party, politician, or group for it. And I don't want the discussion to go that way.

[newbold]

Just download the torrents and take back your silly TIVO.

Buy the DVDs if you like the shows when they come out.

Stream the games if available.

PVRs are no different than downloading CDs when it comes down to it. If you get somebody's 'creative work' and like it, buy a copy.

Take back your useless toy and buy useful things with your refund.

[TOOL460002]

Originally Posted by newbold

Just download the torrents and take back your silly TIVO.

isnt it legal to download a torrent of a show you are already paying for with cable? i might have that wrong, but i also feel like ive seen that disclaimer before. i could be wrong on this.

or... dedicate a cpu to skirt this issue. i have never gone this route, but i imagine its pretty darn easy to get around copyright stuff on a computer.

[i hate username]

Originally Posted by TOOL460002

isnt it legal to download a torrent of a show you are already paying for with cable? i might have that wrong, but i also feel like ive seen that disclaimer before. i could be wrong on this.

or... dedicate a cpu to skirt this issue. i have never gone this route, but i imagine its pretty darn easy to get around copyright stuff on a computer.

There are a lot of grey areas when it comes to downloads.From what i understand with computer games it is legal to download a rom for an emulator if you have at some point owned the game.Think old snes games and things.

[MJ5150]

VCR?

-Mike

[Snakeman1066]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

VCR?

-Mike

ha ha I still have a old Sony Betamax and a stockpile of blank tapes

I can record anything!....lol

low tech FTW

[CamMcIntyre]

If it is just single episodes-I'd try iTunes. Before Hulu & the various network sites featuring free online streaming (albeit w/commercials)-I would buy a season pass for certain shows or just single episodes. They've all been backed up to my external hard drive.

Can't help with ESPN or most sports related stuff.

[MJ5150]

Originally Posted by Snakeman1066

ha ha I still have a old Sony Betamax and a stockpile of blank tapes

I can record anything!....lol

low tech FTW

Yep, me too. I just had an issue recording an NHL game to DVD a couple months ago, so I put it on a VCR tape instead.

-Mike

[Bryan R. Tyler]

This is strange to hear- we have a DVD/VHS recorder that's only a couple years old, and my wife records from our digital cable all the time. I had no idea they were now making DVD recorders incapable of doing this.

[burk48237]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

Yep, me too. I just had an issue recording an NHL game to DVD a couple months ago, so I put it on a VCR tape instead.

-Mike

The sad thing is that the VHS tape may not be copyable to DVD as it may have gotten code from the game.

[burk48237]

Originally Posted by Bryan R. Tyler

This is strange to hear- we have a DVD/VHS recorder that's only a couple years old, and my wife records from our digital cable all the time. I had no idea they were now making DVD recorders incapable of doing this.

The problems have just started showing up on non premium channels in the last month or so. I want the Government to either buy my DVDR back from me or get rid of this. These are commercial programs, that get advertising revenue. Recording commercial network TV for personal use has never been considered illegal. Like I said I have no problem with codes that limit copies. Many are unavailable on DVD or streaming (legally) and even if you can download, I do all my computing on a 13" screen. In most cases their still coded to limit DVD burning. Also many of the downloadable TV shows are limited use. Like I said their actually coding Tivo files so they expire after seven days.

[TOOL460002]

the espn/live sports thing could really have a market. i know they have those mlb/nba/whatever season passes, but something computer-based would be pretty cool. that, and now that pretty much all (quality) new tvs have ethernet ports, thatd be a great money-maker.

as for other shows (files)... i dont know anything at all about digitally pirated copies of programming, have never participated in said activity, nor do i plan to... but, a random person i once talked to mentioned that even if you cant get into a private file-sharing community, there are things called newsgroups with a plethora of information at your disposable. a tv with a usb jack would make this system quite easy, and, while i have never owned a dvdr, but if it has some kind of fee associated with it, it could be cheaper; who knows. again, i dont know anything about this. that random guy just spouted some stuff off that im relaying

[judgeraye]

Originally Posted by burk48237

I am not an illegal downloader. I have strong feelings about taking someone's music or any creative work (movies) I don't pay for. But last night I went to record a TV show episode on a non premium commercial station. My relatively new DVD-R would not record it. The screen flashed "copy protected". I did some research and found out that all of the new DVD-R's in the US are required to be sold with software that reads new copy protections from digital TV. Hence the rush to switch the whole country over to digital. And that many non premium channels and networks (Fox, FX, USA, even ESPN) are copy protecting their content, and more are planning to. They are even introducing protection for TIVO and DVR's which limits the amount of times and how long after a show was produced that you can watch the program. I understand premium channels like HBO and Showtime which run commercial free programs and first run movies protecting program. They operate on a much more limited revenue stream. I also would have no problem with copy protection that limited the number of copies. But this leaves me with a few questions:

1) What purpose does a DVD-R have if you can't copy any TV programs? Even some old VHS tapes have protection. They should be required to warn before you by that the new DVD-R you just bought that it is essentially worthless.

2) With ESPN copy protecting, how will you be able to relive old sports memories if they don't market the DVD's? A vast majority of sports events aren't available on DVD and yet ESPN plans to copy protect everything.

3) When the government mandated digital it mandated the purchase of DVD's of TV programs if you want to save certain episodes. Essentially what this means is the government gave the entertainment and additional revenue stream while requiring you to pay for watching the commercials that pay for their shows. Is that a great deal or what? Not only do I have to pay to watch commercials on cable to get digital signal, but I can't record it. I have to buy it, in some cases ridiculously priced boxed sets when I only want an episode or two. Such a great deal.

Mods, I hope this last one isn't considered political, I'm certainly not blaming any one party, politician, or group for it. And I don't want the discussion to go that way.

i recently tried to archive the recent Lakers' games broadcast from FOX sports net in LA. i have a LG DVD recorder. i re4corded the games on tape on another machine then intended to transfer them to DVD. The first game was fine, but the next game, i got a Copy-protected signal that stopped everything. i was pissed. i am already paying for cable, and thus, the broadcast. Fox is totally out of line and as such they are the only ones playing NBA games that do that crap. im not going to sell it to anyone, i just want the program, they will never release games to DVD in their entirety anyway. another F-U to the consumers. I can almost understand it with The Soprano's and HBO, they have DVD's for sale somewhere, but what about when the signal stops us from even taping the thing on VHS? or DVR Hard Drives? too far, man