Dr Kevorkian - killed by death

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by CNN.Com

Dr. Jack Kevorkian dead at 83


Dr. Jack Kevorkian, the Michigan pathologist who put assisted suicide on the world's medical ethics stage, died early Friday, according to a spokesman with Beaumont Hospital. He was 83.

The assisted-suicide advocate had been hospitalized in Michigan for pneumonia and a kidney-related ailment, his attorney has said.

The 82-year-old former pathologist had struggled with kidney problems for years and had checked into a hospital earlier this month for similar problems, his lawyer, Mayer Morganroth, told CNN last month. He checked back into Beaumont Hospital in the Detroit suburb of Royal Oak on May 18 after suffering a relapse, Morganroth said.

Kevorkian, dubbed "Dr. Death," made national headlines as a supporter of physician-assisted suicide and "right-to-die" legislation. He was charged with murder numerous times through the 1990s for helping terminally ill patients take their own lives.

He was convicted on second-degree murder charges in 1999 stemming from the death of a patient who suffered from amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, commonly called Lou Gehrig's disease. He was paroled in 2007.

Morganroth told the Detroit Free Press it appears Kevorkian suffered a pulmonary thrombosis when a blood clot from his leg broke free and lodged in his heart. With Kevorkian were his niece Ava Janus and Morganroth.

“It was peaceful," Morganroth told the paper. "He didn’t feel a thing."

Source: Dr. Jack Kevorkian dead at 83 – This Just In - CNN.com Blogs

[colcifer]

Bummer. The nickname refers to his extensive time spent working with corpses as a young doctor, btw. He also discovered a very accurate way of determining the time of death (observing blood vessels in the eye). He seemed like a cool guy.

[Relic]

Too bad..
I never saw him as "evil, "bad" or anything of the sort but rather as a sort of 'angel of mercy" RIP Doc K

[Jools4001]

My wife has MS. We both know that since it is an incurable degenerative disease it might get to a point where her quality of life is negligible. She knows this better than most since she used to work as a nurse in a paliative care ward before her condition forced her to give up work. In that job she nursed a lot of MS sufferers who had reached the point where their central nervous system had all but failed. They spent their days virtually immobile because their damaged nervous system had rendered them paraplegic. For most their ability to swallow had gone so they were tube fed, catheterised and unable to communicate because speech had become difficult or impossible. They were also totally dependent on others for their continued existence.

In many cases the cognitive difficulties the disease brings with it meant that they were often confused and, not surprisingly, deeply depressed.

The cruel thing about MS is that it is not, in and of itself, a fatal condition - it just leads to complications caused by immobility such as pneumonia or heart conditions through lack of exercise, so it doesn't necessarily mean a greatly shortened lifespan - at worst you could live quite a while with no real quality to that life.

We are, of course, hoping that medical developments such as better medication or stem cell technology will slow down or halt my wife's condition before she gets to that point, but...

My wife has already decided that, if it all gets too much, she wants a one way trip to Zurich and a short stay in "The Hotel Dignitas" for an overdose of barbituate. I don't like the thought of this, but I respect her wishes and will be there holding her hand if it happens.

So, thanks Dr Kevorkian for helping make a dignified end an option for her.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by Jools4001

My wife has MS. We both know that since it is an incurable degenerative disease it might get to a point where her quality of life is negligible. She knows this better than most since she used to work as a nurse in a paliative care ward before her condition forced her to give up work. In that job she nursed a lot of MS sufferers who had reached the point where their central nervous system had all but failed. They spent their days virtually immobile because their damaged nervous system had rendered them paraplegic. For most their ability to swallow had gone so they were tube fed, catheterised and unable to communicate because speech had become difficult or impossible. They were also totally dependent on others for their continued existence.

In many cases the cognitive difficulties the disease brings with it meant that they were often confused and, not surprisingly, deeply depressed.

The cruel thing about MS is that it is not, in and of itself, a fatal condition - it just leads to complications caused by immobility such as pneumonia or heart conditions through lack of exercise, so it doesn't necessarily mean a greatly shortened lifespan - at worst you could live quite a while with no real quality to that life.

We are, of course, hoping that medical developments such as better medication or stem cell technology will slow down or halt my wife's condition before she gets to that point, but...

My wife has already decided that, if it all gets too much, she wants a one way trip to Zurich and a short stay in "The Hotel Dignitas" for an overdose of barbituate. I don't like the thought of this, but I respect her wishes and will be there holding her hand if it happens.

So, thanks Dr Kevorkian for helping make a dignified end an option for her.

Great post, thank you for sharing that.

[hdracer]

I find it so refreshing when someone wants to play God.

Good riddance, he has met his maker and HE will determine if what he did was right or wrong.

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by hdracer

I find it so refreshing when someone wants to play God.

Good riddance, he has met his maker and HE will determine if what he did was right or wrong.

I'm not sure you quite understand the circumstances under which he was operating. However, how do you determine who is playing god and who is not. For example:

1. Is a doctor who revives a patient from heart attack playing god?
2. Is a doctor who removes a life threatening tumour playing god?
3. Is a person who commits suicide playing god?
4. Is a soldier who kills an enemy combatent playing god?
5. Is a person who kills another person in self defence playing god?

Where do you draw the line?

[hdracer]

When a so called doctor gives a person a drug that kills them!

"Do No Harm"

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by hdracer

When a so called doctor gives a person a drug that kills them!

"Do No Harm"

I can understand how you could form the view that the practice was inconsistent with a doctor's duties. However, you used the expression "playing god". I don't see how you can logically accuse a doctor who gives the patient a drug that kills them of "playing god" and not level the same charge at a doctor who performs and operation that saves a patient that would otherwise have died without the operation. In both cases, the "natural" course of events was changed by the doctor.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by hdracer

When a so called doctor gives a person a drug that kills them!

"Do No Harm"

But you're not really answering the question - is reviving a "dead" patient playing god?

[colcifer]

Originally Posted by hdracer

When a so called doctor gives a person a drug that kills them!

"Do No Harm"

Ever put a dog down? I don't think mercy kills count as harm but to each their own. So long as both the patient and the doctor have done their due diligence making the decision I don't have a problem and it's really none of my business anyway.

[Hoover]

Originally Posted by hdracer

"Do No Harm"

I'm fairly sure the actual Hippocratic Oath reduces down to "First Do No Harm"

And I am extremely grateful to doctors with the foresight to recognize that the most compassionate healthcare usually requires a Second, Third, Fourth, etc. decision to be made.

I admire(d) Kevorkian for his bravery in the face of kneejerk adversity and for his ability to see that the oft-bandied phrase "Quality Of Life" refers primarily to that of the patient.

RIP Jack, and thanks for doing the right thing.

[colcifer]

Originally Posted by Hoover

I'm fairly sure the actual Hippocratic Oath reduces down to "First Do No Harm"

And I am extremely grateful to doctors with the foresight to recognize that the most compassionate healthcare usually requires a Second, Third, Fourth, etc. decision to be made.

I admire(d) Kevorkian for his bravery in the face of kneejerk adversity and for his ability to see that the oft-bandied phrase "Quality Of Life" refers primarily to that of the patient.

RIP Jack, and thanks for doing the right thing.

QFT

[hdracer]

Originally Posted by Relic

But you're not really answering the question - is reviving a "dead" patient playing god?

No, It is using the skills and technology to SAVE people

[hdracer]

Are you people saying that Hittler & the Nizi's were right when the rounded up all the mental ill and crippled people and wacked them? for their own good?

[Febs]

Originally Posted by Hoover

I'm fairly sure the actual Hippocratic Oath reduces down to "First Do No Harm"

And of course, it is also debatable that giving a merciful option to a person whose quality of life has deminished below the threshold of what is tolerable for that individual is in fact "doing harm."

[Relic]

Originally Posted by hdracer

No, It is using the skills and technology to SAVE people

Not knocking you, I just see a difference in the word "save".

IE - When someone you love is really really suffering with no end in sight except a miserable, lingering demise, I see "save" as mercifully putting an end to that person's suffering, that's all.
It's just sometimes hard for me to see how anyone could allow that to happen to a loved one, regardless of religious beliefs.

[Febs]

Originally Posted by hdracer

Are you people saying that Hittler & the Nizi's were right when the rounded up all the mental ill and crippled people and wacked them? for their own good?

No. No-one has said anything even remotely similar to that.

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by hdracer

Are you people saying that Hittler & the Nizi's were right when the rounded up all the mental ill and crippled people and wacked them? for their own good?

I feel we now have an excellent grasp of your ability to apply logic. Thanks.

[Relic]

Godwins law, 1st page! new TB record!